Bagged or Bagless ?

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Bagged for me as well.

Personally, with allergies, I don't want to empty and wash the container each and every time I use it. Part of the reason I don't like using my Rainbows...you can't dump the water in the house...you have to go outside...it is just to messy.

The quality of the high end bags is so good that they really don't leak a lot. Plus with bagless the filters are twice the price of bags..sometimes three and four time the price of bags.

For us as collectors bagless machines are great...we take care of them..for the normal household...they don't clean filters, they just empty the bin and most of the time when you hear a bagless machine running..the pitch is very high as the filters are totally clogged.

Bagless machines for me are a gimmick...the company has you totally convinced that because you can see the dirt swirling around in the clear container that it is really cleaing well. The fact of the matter is that when using a bagged machine with a high quality bag the air flow is staying just as strong and cleaning much better. The filter area of a bagless is so small compared to that of a bagged machine...they clog so much quicker and air flow is reduced almost immediatly.

Morgan
 
im gonna give a diffrent point of veiw on this....

i think bagless is more of a regression then something new, for the new breed of people that are much more lazy and likely to take short cuts then there use to be.

if you think about it, our moms or grand mothers had EVERYTHING bagless (coffee can Hoovers, Kirbys, earley Eureka's,and such), then when Air-Way came out with the first paper bag system, it stared to bring to some peoples attn that a shake bag may not be the most simple or sanitary way to empty a vacuum, but the idea wasint really pushed untill the late 40's when Hoover came out with the Handi-Sacks. then it stared to finally click that throwung a type C bag away was easer and less mess then emptying a Hoover 700 shake bag.

then sometime in the late 70's and earley 80's it was the changing time of convenince...and there were sevral machines that were created so there were "no bags to buy", and also featured tv commercials where a bag canging on something GRAET could be such a hassle.....but even now the public doesnt relize in reality a bagless machine is just as much work if not more than changing a panasinic bag or a type A or Z bag....cuse you dont just empty the bin, theres a few more steps afterwords that are crucial to the machines performance. and to me even a Hoover type C bag or a Eureka F&G bag is more to my likeing than having
to make a huge mess or go out side in the frezzing cold or rian to empty a dirt cup or bin.
 
Bagged

I prefer bagged, I don't own any full size bagless vacuums, but have a few Hoover Quick Brooms/Slider Vac, and I don't like emptying that small dirt cup and cleaning the filter...it's messy and a pain and I'm far from lazy...I usually just use one of my portable canisters to clean the bagless stick vacuums...so it really defeats the purpose of me having a bagless machine. It just works best for me to have a bagged machine.
 
I must say i prefer bag less but oonly Dyson bag less, In our shop we sell many makes and models and we are taking on the miele vacuums so i bought an S7 upright to try out.. I loved it , quiet easy to use just fantastic I have animals , and despite the bags getting full rather fast I have another problem , they start to smell. even with its charcoal filter the machine gets a certain stink to it. I switched back to my Dyson dc27 and although it is noisier I empty it after each use and 2 years on no smell , not even the dc07 we use now in the family room has the slightest smell to it .
 
I prefer bags for easy disposal of dust - fling the bag and the dust is gone.

However, with animals, the bags definitely do smell, until the become unbearably so.

Bagless is a pain to empty, usually raining or howling gale, so I get engulfed in the stoor.


Maybe they should be making smaller, cheaper bags that can be changed more often.
 
Two Tips on Smell:

Everyone who has mentioned animal-hair smell (well, dog-hair smell; cats don't have nearly as pronounced an odor) is correct. If you leave the bag in for very long, it gets smelly.

One thing that helps is to change the bag on a schedule, not when it gets full. My bags get changed once a month, no matter what. They're never holding that much dirt for that long, so no smellies.

Also, you can make your bags and house smell really nice if you'll put some of your favorite cologne on a fresh, empty bag, and then let it dry completely before installing the bag. If you put the bag in the cleaner before it's dry, the spot that's wet with cologne is weak and can burst. But after drying, the bag contributes a nice smell of Paco Rabanne or Chanel Egoiste or, hell - Old Spice if that's your thing. Makes the exhaust air smells great.
 
Prefer Multi Cyclonic Bagless vacuums....

I do like bagged vacuums, & it's nice that many bagged vacuums make it so easy to take the bag off, throw it out & put a new one on & continue cleaning. I also feel that the latest generation of vacuums with HEPA cloth bags do filter as well or perhaps better than filtered bagless vacuums. However, having said that, I do feel that micro-filtration or plain paper bags do NOT filter as well as the tower HEPA filters supplied these days with filtered bagless vacuums.

For my personal cleaning situation, I am an apartment dweller, & don't have any cats or dogs, & my carpeting is also low-pile commercial grade carpeting, which doesn't let off lots of carpet fibers. I find that I pick up lots of fine dust & sand, & that clogs my bagged vacuums fairly quickly....even the ones with HEPA cloth bags. For this reason, I prefer to use multi-cyclonic bagless vacuums, such as Fantom, Dyson, Hoover T-Series, etc, most times for my regular cleaning. I have had a Bissell Healthy Home upright now for nearly 2 years, & I find it outcleans many of my bagged or filtered cyclonic vacuums. It also empties without much dust flying in the air, & I don't mind taking the bin outside to empty, & just to be sure dust doesn't get in my face, I wear a white drywall dust mask. I also find the same thing with my Fantom Lightning canister. The only time I find that either my Fantom or Bissell can get messy is that I will take a canister vacuum with a blower, such as a Filter Queen or TriStar, put a crevice tool on the hose, & use that to blow out the multi-cyclonic filter assembly every few months; then I do have to do that outside with a face mask, or dust would be all over the place.

I would use a Water Filtration vacuum, such as Rainbow, & have owned one in the past, but since I clean my carpets every 2-3 days, it would be too inconvenient to set up & empty & clean each time. I also don't believe that water works well at trapping fine dust; when I owned my Rainbow D4, I was always disgusted by the fact that there was dirt on the separator to clean off, & that convinced me their claims of filtration were overstated. If I was to buy another Water Filtration vacuum, it would have to have a HEPA filter on the exhaust.

I agree with many points made about bagless vacuums, though, for sure! Filtered bagless vacuums, in most cases the filters are a pain to get clean, unless they are foam, like the original Bissell Cleanview uprights, or like the Powerforce bagless uprights, the pleated filter is intended to be rinsed & washed clean & left to dry. However, they still lose power when the dust & dirt accumulates on the filter, as they are designed to simulate what a bag does....so you don't get any advantage in cleaning performance. Rather, you get the convenience of throwing out the dirt & not wasting money on bags....BUT you have the cost of replacement filters. So, you still have a cost for consumables. The only real advantage is that you get the satisfaction of seeing all the dirt the vacuum collected & can have a sense of pride in having a clean home.

Rob

BTW- For anyone who is in my particular situation, picking up lots of fine dust & sand, & using a bagged vacuum, here's a tip to restore cleaning power to your vacuum if your bag isn't very full- Open the bag compartment of your vacuum, & if the hole of the bag is exposed, stuff a small dry towel in the hole of the bag. Then, give the bag a good vigorous shake. When you are done, carefully remove the towel, take it outside & shake off the dust that accumulated on the towel. You will notice your vacuum should regain most, if not all, of it's cleaning power, because you have knocked the fine dust off the walls of the bag so air can pass thru.
 
For deep cleaning bags are the way to go but bagless are fun to play with and to use as a daily quick cleaning that fine, but when you want to get serious I think the bag is better. As for water well again if it's really dirty you have to stop and empty before you're done, but i'm not knocking them.
 
@ Morgan. I dump my Rainbow down the toilet or the kitchen sink. I've never had a problem with it and I've done that for years.

I will admit that when it comes to bagged machines I like Electrolux/Aerus with the way they seal off when you open the machine. If I were to ever get a new vacuum that is what I would get.
 
Here's a kinda funny bagless story. When I sell a refurbed vac, I give a 30 day guarantee on it. One time a lady came over, took a look at what I had and fairly quickly decided upon a Hoover Windtunnel bagless, the higher level machine with the dual chamber and tall pleated element filter. These machines actually have pretty good suction when everything is tip-top.

Anyway, almost a month later the same lady sent me an email telling me the machine was giving her problems. She said something like, "It worked fine for the first few weeks I had it but now it isn't working right." I told her to bring it over so I could look at it. She did and right away I could see the machine was completely filthy. A closer look showed that the pre-filter and the main filter were missing. These two filters fit together, then slip into one side of the dirt canister. Without these two vital parts, the dirt enters the machine and goes right into the motor case. Also, the absense of the primary filter leaves a gap at the bottom of the dirt bin for dust and debris to fly out of. There is a pre-motor filter on this model but its purpose is only to keep out the big stuff. I pointed out the missing filters and the lady said, "Oh. I turned this over to my kids to do chores with. They emptied out the dirt bin." In so doing, they let the pre-filter and filter element drop into the trash with the debris. They didn't notice these parts were missing; they just put the lid back on the dirt bin and reinstalled it in the vacuum cleaner.

The lady freely admitted her kids were to blame. Her solution was to buy another machine just like it that I had and she gave back me the original one. I took it apart to the back bone getting it clean, but it worked out just fine. But that motor compartment was a mess. It's all ready to go out again to a new owner; I haven't tried to sell it yet as I've been too busy on other projects in November and December. Pretty lavender color.
 
Before you dump the Rainbow bin down your plumbing--pick out the large peices and wads of lint-hair.Does your place use a septic tank-if so dump the bin outside-plant beds is a good place-been doing that with any of my Rainbows.
 
If you have the kids use the vacuum for their duty rosters-be sure they know how to use it and empty it properly-and WHEN to empty it.A woman brought a FILTHY-NASTY Dyson into the Vac place my way-the kids had been using it--the machine was loaded with dust and dirt-and STANK.At one point the little helpers dumpted the machine and let the seal for the large cyclone in the bin go into the trash--result dirt all throughout the vacuum-The machine was so bad---it was dumpstered.She bought another Dyson-used one-and vowed NOT to let her kids use it.
and another vac store episode-A woman brought in a REALLY PACKED Kirby G6-the paper bag was burst inside the cloth one-shows the "packing" power of these machines-The bag was hard as a brick.The kids did not know how to change the bag-the Mom was ill for a few months and the kids "helpted" with the chores.The vacuum could STILL pick up despite the stuffed bags.the fill tube was not clogged.
 
I Gotta Say:

Bagless vacuums are not the only ones that can be abused far beyond all reasonable limits.

My Lux Diamond Jubilee was found in a thrift store, marked $2.02 because "it don't pick up nothin'", according to the employee who was putting it out.

I opened it up and immediately found why "it don't pick up nothin'." It had a bag so full it was like handling a tiny bag of Sakrete, and the hose was solidly packed as well. Dog hair and sand - yecch!

I bought it, changed the bag and reamed out the hose. It's been working like a champ ever since. Miraculously, the motor was not harmed; the sleeve bearings in a DJ are not the longest-lived design Electrolux ever came up with.
 
Sadly, that isn't the first time I've heard of somebody using a Vacuum Cleaner until the bag is 100% full and dirt it starting to collect in the hose.

I fill my bags to half way, then change them - Which is what everybody should do, as once a bag gets fuller than half way, it puts a strain on the motor, and will start to cause extra wear.

Even bags that say "Can Be Used Twice" I throw away after the first use, as I just don't trust a bag that has already been filled once to still give me the same air flow as a new one would.

For the price of a new bag, compared to the price of a new motor, it just isn't worth it.

I'm not surprised at all though that the Electrolux's motor wasn't damaged by being ran with a full bag, because, simply, it is an Electrolux!

Nothing Sucks Like An Electrolux! :)
 
I fill my bags to half way, then change them - Which is what

I usually pack the vacuum bag as full as I can and have never had a problem. My Panasonic 40 series vacuums will retain strong suction and good performance until the bag is about 3/4 full. Same with the Electrolux 616. My Henry keeps strong suction until the bag is almost full, but only if I use the HEPAflo bags.

The Sebo, however, keeps on picking up flawlessly, even with a full bag. Infact, the bag full indicator doesn't start flashing until the dirt is coming up through the hose. The bags on my Miele S5281 and on my Dad's S2110 can really be crammed full before the suction drops.
 
Yes, the bags can take it - Of course they can if they are of good quality, but over time, the strain the motor is having to put up with to keep the suction up with the packed bag will end in a break down.

If the motor is a durable one, the break down will take a long time to become apparent, but it will still happen one day. Maybe tomorrow, maybe next year, or maybe in the next decade, but it WILL happen if you keep filling your bags until the motor is working very hard to keep going with the amount of air flow restriction the full bag is putting on it.


I never trust a "FULL BAG" indicator, as they always come on too late in my opinion.

I once ran my '94 HOOVER Turbopower 1000 without changing the bag just to see when the full bag indicator lit, and when it did, the bag was 2-3CM from being filled to the top.

I don't know why Vacuum Cleaners even have bag full indicators to be honest, because by the time they come on you are way past the recommended bag change interval.

The only good thing about the indicator is that it tells you when you have a blockage in the hose pipe/inlet passage, and even then it is superfluous in my opinion, as it is usually obvious if there is a blockage bad enough to set the indicator off.
 
The Reason....

....That "Full Bag" indicators are set to trigger so late is this:

Vacuum manufacturers also sell bags, and if the indicator was set to trip when it was in the best interests of motor life, you'd have a gazillion complaints from consumers, claiming they were being ripped off by being made to purchase bags too frequently. Remember that most consumers want to get every last trillionth of a cent's worth of service out of a disposable bag; it never occurs to them that bags are wayyyyyyyyy cheaper than motors.

And obviously, this goes along with the other reason it's in the manufacturer's best interest to fill the bag: it promotes faster motor wear, meaning the manufacturer will get to sell another vacuum that much sooner.

For myself, I change bags monthly, no matter how little is in the bag. That keeps me well away from the point where a full bag could promote any wear, and it also keeps the vac smelling better, since I'm not storing old dust for a long time.
 
"I'm not surprised at all though that the Electrolux's motor wasn't damaged by being ran with a full bag, because, simply, it is an Electrolux!"

Jamie:

On this side of the pond, the Electrolux Diamond Jubilee - and some later models - were notorious for bearing failure; a sleeve bearing was used that proved less durable than previous designs.

That's why I was amazed such an abused vacuum did not have a motor that was burnt-out, or about to be.
 
Ah, I see what you mean Sandy!

I don't change my bags monthly, as I use those "Vac Fresheners" which keep everything smelling of roses (literally), but I do check it after every two or three uses and change when it gets to or just below half full.
 
Bagless

Hi All,

Ok, this is my first post on this forum. I just found it because I'm poking around on the web to find a bagless vacuum.

I've been using a Kirby Ultimate G for the past 10+ years and now want to find a bagless.

My main reason hasn't been shared yet: with a bagless you can empty the dirt right away and it doesn't sit around.

With a bag, you have the dirt sitting in there until you toss the bag.

I have pet rats. They scatter their litter and raisins (which is a nice way of saying poop pellets) on the floor. I'm very reluctant to vacuum this up unless I'm about to toss the bag because I'm afraid that if the litter sits in the bag, every time I vacuum and hot air passes through, I'll get that smell.

You laugh, but the last few times I vacuumed, there was a strong smell of chocolate. I finally realized I had previously sucked up a couple of chocolate coffee beans.

So I'm looking for a bagless so I can vacuum and dump out what I picked up.

I'm going to keep searching this forum to see what people recommend. I'm leaning towards a Dyson. I've had a Fantom in the past (well, the Sears equivalent which was the same vacuum with a different name) before my Kirby.
 
Jamie:

That having been said, a Diamond Jubilee in good repair will suck the dried paint off a wall. My DJ has the highest suction of any of my vacuums, including my TriStar CXL, though the CXL is very close, without the jet-fighter whine of the DJ.
 
Hi Susie,

Doesn't the Kirby have an open topped bag ? If so, you could just tip the dirt out of the bag when you vacuum up the rat droppings surely ?
 
I like bags but . . .

I have a Miele Capricorn and over the last three years it's become a pretty good friend of mine. However, I could live without the twenty bucks a pop for just four genuine high-filtration bags. Online or brick and mortar, they price the same wherever I've looked. There are lesser bags made for this machine but their purchase would defeat the purpose I bought the cleaner for the first place. Sears and Hoover appear to be following suit as they've models for which the price of high filtration bags is two for ten dollars.

Filter Queen got me a lot of bang for the buck by way of capacity but I've also owned Rexairs and Rainbows. Because everything picked up was already wet down, there was no dust to fly around come time to empty them. You flushed sweepings down the john, washed out the water pan and separator. The washing up and storage issues were of course an annoyance but necessary to keep one clean and running properly. The maintenance regimen plus their bulk and weight didn't encourage their use.

Last year I did in-store demos for LG and came to like the Luv200, 300 and 400 models a lot. They were relatively easy to maintain and cleaned well. I'm trying not to but I'm taking a fancy to LG's new LuV350. However, in the end I'll probably end up with a refurb Kirby -- big disposable bags -- just because it has a blower.
 
I never buy genuine bags, unless I can get them really cheap, like I did at my local recycling store when they had two packs of genuine HOOVER bags for my Turbopower really cheap.

Otherwise, I log onto eBay, and buy the cheapest (usually Electropart or Qualtex) bags I can, which have never given me any problems nor performed any worse in suction or air filtration opposed to the genuine manufacturers bags.
 
Has to be bagless, dyson preferably.

I don't like having to buy bags, or relying on people having some spares (I used to be a cleaner) or when they burst!
Cleaning up after lots of pets and using bags is costly (especially the good synthetic material) and smelly.
It used to kill me to clean somebody's house who had a liking for talcum powder, that would be the last ro to clean as it would choke the suction.

I completely understand why people like them though.

I like seeing what I've picked up too, it gives me great satisfaction. Like when you wash down your all your wood work and then pour away the dirty water.

I always empty outside and push the canister to the bottom of the bin and wipe down the canister. Keep a spare filter (I can't be without a machine!) and toss the filters in the washer on a gentle wash. They come up like new. (I wouldnt try this with a pleated filter mind..)
 
I prefer bagged. The only bagless I like is Rainbow. The Epic 6500 is bags are super cheap & easy to change. I always change them WAY before they even look full because I can tell it loses some suction. There's nothing like putting a fresh bag in and feeling that power, but it never seems to last. The suction remains decently strong but I can always tell it's never as good as when the brand new bag was put in.

The LAST dry bagless I had was a Fantom Fury in the Late 90s & I hated it with a white hot purple pink passion. You could see dust collecting all over the OUTSIDE of the machine and emptying it was what I hated most because of dust flying all over. I think I'd like a DYSON but you've never going to get away with emptying it and dust flying.
 
Mark - I thought I was the only one who got a buzz out of putting a fresh bag into a cleaner!? It seems I'm not :)
 
"I always empty outside and push the canister to the bottom of the bin and wipe down the canister. Keep a spare filter and toss the filters in the washer on a gentle wash"

And you find that easier than just tossing a bag into the bin and putting a new one in? Sounds like an awfully messy, unhygienic process to me.
 
I wouldn't be able to see what I've picked up that way!!

I'm happy for that extra bit of maintenance if it means I don't have to buy bags. I just personally find them inefficient.

Lets be honest though, putting a wash on and having a having a damp cloth to hand really isn't a strainuous though is it?

How often do you wipe your cleaners down?
 
@baglessball I don't agree. Bags rarely burst - For my whole life my mother has used bagged cleaners and never ONCE has a bag burst or lost suction after vacuuming up any kind of fine powder.

Bags FTW!

Fill the bag to half way, pull it out, throw it in the bin, put a new one in - Simples!

And no dust getting into the air.
 

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