Pick your poison: Main equivalency!

VacuumLand – Vintage & Modern Vacuum Enthusiasts

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What would you pick?

  • Dreame Z30: Cheap shot for nice motor, cheap competitor to others

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • SEBO Balance A1: Poor man's Dyson Cyclone V10, made by a now-wrongly praised bagged maker

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Lupe Pure: Anti-stick, cordless that just couldn't sustain it's existence or remaining innovation

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Dyson V8 (any version): Reliable&light but too cheap+compromised to be able to fully main-equivalent

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • eufy E20: Robot stick that can barely do any job at all except for its space-saving

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Cheap-@$$ knockoffs of advanced stuffs that doesn't do halfway as well as any of the real deal

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    12
V15 Detect are really well-received for a Dyson (your mileage may vary; f#¢k the current state of Dyson's award-winning customer service), and the power trigger wasn't too big of a problem. Gen5 is a refinement and removed the trigger. To be honest, that trigger and the extra weight are medium-level issues, neither minor nor major. I am talking about truly major problems.

@Hatsuwr consider this: any tool brand can make a dupe. That's one reason why tool brands are to be put into the cheap knockoffs. They're mere tools, and should be treated as some dupes that happens to function but not necessarily work like actual proper mains-equivalent cordless stuffs.

Another reason why I had not directly included the Stratos or PowerDetect: there's simply not enough poll choices allowed. The facts that Shark's cordless models all copied Dyson therefore put them in cheap knockoffs category.

Here's the outstanding enough to be dedicated options within that 10-option vote limit:
- Lupe Pure is pretty obvious, because it's a freaking upright. And duping technologies from Dyson as poorly as normally expected for the time, at that. Then Lupe themselves shut down...
- Samsung Bespoke Jet Ultra (and its less powerful and lighter variant, Jet Lite) are wasteful and dupe-@$$. Just look at the shape of the handheld and the main cleaner head, for example. Bulky dual brushrolls (similar to Lupe Pure), with non-powered soft roller and mid brush bar, and questionable sealing and unswept hard floors edges. The shape itself is too front-heavy even for the on-line version of the form factor that Dyson pioneered - heck, the cyclones are still 3-inlets-per-cone, which isn't too good, unlike the truly effective single-inlet-per-cone cyclones Dyson have had since even before the 5,127th prototype was made. Looking at both the old Samsung Jet review by Vacuum Facts himself as well as the RTINGS review of the Jet Ultra, and you can see why. It gets worse no matter which source (Tom's Guide thought the Ultra was perfect though...), so... yeah.
- SEBO Balance A1 looks like a poor man's V10 but likely performs like a dragged-out DC35 Digital Slim. Ditto for Dream Z30 to V15 Detect, with sloppy sensors holding it's holding nice motor back. eufy E20 tried to be both a bagless stick and a robot vac in one package, which splices up- oh no, I simply can't explain how ridiculous the compromises involved are. Henry Quick is bagged, and that enforces running cost and potential landfills, which is not worth the modern standards.
- And the most damning of all and even more obvious than even the Lupe... FACKING KIRBY! I know not all of you will like it, but Vacuum Facts is right about Kirby vacuums. They're too ancient to keep its legendary status at this point, and even ordinary dupes of Dyson's cordless mains-equivalents are able to outperform all Kirby machines in deep cleaning performance and versatility. A hunting bagged, corded trash that only belong to the first half of the 20th century, not the 21st!
- There are two Dysons as dedicated options. Dyson V8 had to catch up and is too cheap to fully allow for mains-equivalent capabilities (V8 Cyclone is the first to at least reliably come close, based on the new specs), whereas Dyson V16 Piston Animal... f#¢k Dyson's current suits for crippling that otherwise legendary machine out of the box! What a tragic mess.

Commentary there? What commentary? I was just trying to get you guys to vote.

@royalfan103, I am sorry for the apparent bias, but this is about choosing the very best of some of the worst yet.
Each of the flaws mentioned should only be considered flaws if they can be proven through proper testing that clearly demonstrates the vacuum cleaner has those issues. Otherwise, they may simply reflect functions that could have been designed better, not actual defects. Your comments are strictly opinions unless you can support them with test results showing that what you describe is truly a flaw.
 
Each of the flaws mentioned should only be considered flaws if they can be proven through proper testing that clearly demonstrates the vacuum cleaner has those issues. Otherwise, they may simply reflect functions that could have been designed better, not actual defects. Your comments are strictly opinions unless you can support them with test results showing that what you describe is truly a flaw.
Cue his obligatory Vacuum Facts pulling.

Well, could you provide us with metrics and test results from yourself instead of relying on Vacuum Facts, Absolute Rainbow?
 
Each of the flaws mentioned should only be considered flaws if they can be proven through proper testing that clearly demonstrates the vacuum cleaner has those issues. Otherwise, they may simply reflect functions that could have been designed better, not actual defects. Your comments are strictly opinions unless you can support them with test results showing that what you describe is truly a flaw.
Cue his obligatory Vacuum Facts pulling.

Well, could you provide us with metrics and test results from yourself instead of relying on Vacuum Facts, Absolute Rainbow?
Are you assuming that I didn't read reviews beforehand?
 
Absolute Rainbow - For me, the reason I chose Samsung is because, unlike Dyson, their cyclone is washable! For me, that is a HUGE ISSUE! I knew someone who asked me to take apart and clean their Dyson V6 cyclone....it was really dirty and musty smelling. That was easy to take apart and do. But the latest V10 and later Dyson sticks, that is impossible to do without damaging the cyclone! Which is why I bet they sell replacement cyclones on the Dyson website.

I also watched a YouTube video on the Samsung Jet 75, and for me it seems the only real issue the Samsung's have is their carpet and floor heads don't clean quite as well and have issues with hair wrap. Also, there is only 1 drill pack battery adapter for DeWalt drill batteries, and it comes packaged with a kit with 2 batteries and a charger.

For me, I am looking at stick vacs right now, and NONE of the Dyson sticks satisfied me! On it's Medium power setting, the V15 and Gen5 Detect are about the same suction as my corded Shark Rocket HV381 that came out around 2016 and I bought refurbished in 2021. So why would I want a Dyson that I would have to use on Boost mode all the time to be happy with performance & shorten the battery life? So to me, it's either get the Samsung & have the ability to clean the cyclone, or buy one of the generic Dyson clones for about $200, and be happy with it for 1/3 the cost.
 
Are you assuming that I didn't read reviews beforehand?
What I’m saying is that if you had done the research to prove that the issues you’ve indicated are indeed flaws, then you should have posted those results rather than simply claiming them as flaws. I’m sure you may have done some research, but I’d like to see those results. I’m not trying to argue with you; I’m simply asking for proven facts. Some of your comments come across as ambiguous and make little sense, and the vernacular you use at times seems somewhat childish.
 
Henry Quick solely based on it being bagged. Far less messy to dump and no cyclone assembly means less maintenance plus no complicated airpath that reduces airflow, therefore better for performance (a big deal on something with a small battery powered motor).

I'd love one but the only drawback is in the states they're quite a bit more expensive than their UK counterparts.
 
Henry Quick solely based on it being bagged. Far less messy to dump and no cyclone assembly means less maintenance plus no complicated airpath that reduces airflow, therefore better for performance (a big deal on something with a small battery powered motor).

I'd love one but the only drawback is in the states they're quite a bit more expensive than their UK counterparts.
@Vacuum Facts hate bags, and I understand why - he has good points. Bag may not be messy, but they don't smell all that good, and they incurs running cost. They may even harm the environment through the landfill. And yeah, they loses suction. That bag is the biggest flaw of the machine.
 
@Vacuum Facts hate bags, and I understand why - he has good points. Bag may not be messy, but they don't smell all that good, and they incurs running cost. They may even harm the environment through the landfill. And yeah, they loses suction. That bag is the biggest flaw of the machine.
Eh, remember Japan has a standardized method of rating vacuum performance that all vacuums sold in Japan are tested to. They call it Suction Work Rate. Across the board bagless vacuums have lower Suction Work Rate ratings than premium Japanese bagged canister vacuums. And obtw I have measured the airflow of canister vacuums with and without a bag installed, just for giggles, and a synthetic dust bag does not reduce airflow. A paper bag does slightly reduce airflow but we are talking single digit cfm differences.
 
@Vacuum Facts hate bags, and I understand why - he has good points. Bag may not be messy, but they don't smell all that good, and they incurs running cost. They may even harm the environment through the landfill. And yeah, they loses suction. That bag is the biggest flaw of the machine.
Cyclones can develop smells too.

I don't buy the idea of bags being particularly bad for the environment when you're still dumping the dirt from a bagless bin into the trash. It all goes to the same place where it's in your house garbage bag or your vacuum's bag.

Any airflow/suction loss of a full bag is not even close to the airflow loss of having a complicated cyclone assembly in the airpath.

Also please have an original opinion without citing Vacuum "Facts" I'm begging you
 
Ah, this time the images loaded. The hose is a super nice aftermarket part from Hibbert International in Canada. It has a nice sturdy steel spout instead of the easy to break plastic spout of the original. You can see a Filter Queen power nozzle. That was an attempt to mate the Samsung with a power nozzle I can get brush rolls, belts and motors for. There are no brush rolls anywhere for the original Samsung PH90 this was sold with. Amazingly a Samsung neck fits the Filter Queen power nozzle like it was designed for it, allowing it to accept the large diameter upside down wands Samsung used on these. Unfortunately the F-Q pn is a big heavy thing and doesn't work very well, so the mod was kind of a bust. The bag and attachment cover both open sideways. The synthetic dust bag is from Superior Vacuums of Canada, the house brand of Hibbert International. These were apparently popular in Canada. Not so much in the US. Nice equipment though, powerful and very quiet. The button lock hole in the top of the spout on the hose handle makes getting an accurate suction reading very hard. It also affects the airflow reading. I have to play around some more.

I have a plan to use a spare hose I have for one of these to use the canister swivel end with an 8 foot long Kenmore hose casing and a Kenmore hose end so I can use it with a Hayden or Kenmore power nozzle. But that is a project for later on.
 

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Cyclones can develop smells too.

I don't buy the idea of bags being particularly bad for the environment when you're still dumping the dirt from a bagless bin into the trash. It all goes to the same place where it's in your house garbage bag or your vacuum's bag.

Any airflow/suction loss of a full bag is not even close to the airflow loss of having a complicated cyclone assembly in the airpath.

Also please have an original opinion without citing Vacuum "Facts" I'm begging you
Old school single-layered paper bags did clog quite sevearly, but those aren't used any more. Modern synthetic vacuum bags don't clog like the old school bags, and even modern multi-layer paper bags don't clog like old school single-layered.
Dyson set out to solve a problem, and that problem has old school bags, but bags modernized, and the bagless is an alternative way of solving the problem. Both solutions have pros and cons, Neither is outright superior.
They don't even clog as badly as when Dyson started engineering bagless. So, it's not that significant of a problem today as it was back then.
 
Cyclones can develop smells too.

I don't buy the idea of bags being particularly bad for the environment when you're still dumping the dirt from a bagless bin into the trash. It all goes to the same place where it's in your house garbage bag or your vacuum's bag.

Any airflow/suction loss of a full bag is not even close to the airflow loss of having a complicated cyclone assembly in the airpath.
With the bagless designs, only contents are dumped, not also the entire bag in answer. Those bags are wasteful precisely because they physical exists (and have recurring running cost).
Old school single-layered paper bags did clog quite sevearly, but those aren't used any more. Modern synthetic vacuum bags don't clog like the old school bags, and even modern multi-layer paper bags don't clog like old school single-layered.
Dyson set out to solve a problem, and that problem has old school bags, but bags modernized, and the bagless is an alternative way of solving the problem. Both solutions have pros and cons, Neither is outright superior.
But bags still clogs, and still easier than cyclones. Cyclones clog almost entirely due to user error, whether it be violent maintenance, or simply abuse and neglect. Bagless are better, but not OUTRIGHT superior, as bags are easier to empty relatively hygienically. The best bagless can still do the job with no significant dust cloud whatsoever and without much effort, so ultimately bags became a net negative, considering the running cost and the physical waste added. So... bagless cyclones are superior to bags in NEARLY EVERY way.
They don't even clog as badly as when Dyson started engineering bagless. So, it's not that significant of a problem today as it was back then.
But it's still a problem nonetheless.
Also please have an original opinion without citing Vacuum "Facts" I'm begging you
@Ant_Tenna, stop whining! The objectiveness is the reason why I even cited @Vacuum Facts himself!
 
Eh, remember Japan has a standardized method of rating vacuum performance that all vacuums sold in Japan are tested to. They call it Suction Work Rate. Across the board bagless vacuums have lower Suction Work Rate ratings than premium Japanese bagged canister vacuums. And obtw I have measured the airflow of canister vacuums with and without a bag installed, just for giggles, and a synthetic dust bag does not reduce airflow. A paper bag does slightly reduce airflow but we are talking single digit cfm differences.
Well, the bags still (easily) clog(s).
 
I would like to supportively challenge you to not say "Vacuum Facts" every single comment.

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Instead, maybe address - with your own thoughts

@Ant_Tenna, stop whining! The objectiveness is the reason why I even cited @Vacuum Facts himself!
I'm gonna supportively challenge you as well. Instead of relying on Vacuum Facts, adress with your own thoughts and metrics.
 
Well, the bags still (easily) clog(s).
Not necessarily. My Japanese Panasonics, some US model Panasonics and my Kenmore Elite ( made by Panasonic ) suspend the bag in an expander cage so the bag is not touching the walls anywhere. They maintain full airflow until the bag is stuffed. Tristars and vacuums like Tristar ( Schoettler Airstorm/Patriot, Miracle Mate, Vortech, Zero-G ) have a top fill bag suspended in the bag chamber inside a cloth bag with a bag chamber designed to create a cyclone that pushes the dirt towards the front of the bag leaving the air path to the motor unobstructed until the bag is completely full.
 
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