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The event tomorrow in Berlin from the teaser videos includes the V16 along with the new Robot that mops new Wash G model, the Pencil Vsc has appeared in some plus what might be a new fan or hair care product!
It’s a global launch of multiple products.
 
It's not really clear what that label is referring to specifically. One thing is clear from measurement, the motor's power drain on the battery is MUCH lower in all power modes than the Gen5—by a factor of 2 for boost mode! The performance data clearly shows the consequences and it's not an upgrade in its current state. It really looks like a software mistake. It shouldn't have happened.
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So i am pretty much covinced now (labels + your collected power data) that the "900w" is just a marketing stunt and is the label of the used motor version.

Do you have access to IEC 62885-4:2023 for the AW rating? The gen5 was tested against the older 2020 version if i am not mistaken, curios if something major has changed here.
 
It may be true, but is hard to believe. The Gen5 absolutely did draw ~900+ W, so their motors definitely are capable of that. Why would they positively retrograde their core function for so little gain in noise and weight? It doesn't add up. I'll see if there are any equivalent labels on the Gen5 to compare against.

I can get access to that standard and will take a look later when I get time. I'm pretty sure if you start trying to engage with their customer support to probe this, you'll just end up with robotic guard dog behaviour that concludes you need a new part or something unrelated.
 
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gen5 and v15.

If you take the 315AW unquestioned the 900w might just be a marketing "comparison indicator" how much power would be needed with the older v15 to achieve 315 AW. It is pretty close if you take the 230 AW Hepa version of the v15. 230 / 660 * 900 = 313,14.
It is also the same for the "first" AW rating of the gen5 of 262 AW (later changed to 280) : 262 / 752 * 900 = 313,56.
 
The designs of the to-be announced products leaked and people (on reddit) are complaining about some products looking outsourced, that'd be brutal!
 
The designs of the to-be announced products leaked and people (on reddit) are complaining about some products looking outsourced, that'd be brutal!
Not really clear what 'outsourced' even means or why it's relevant (with evidence) to technology or the specific issues being observed and discussed here atm. Citing the internet's toilet wall (reddit) is generally a sign rumours can be disregarded unless supplied with reputable evidence.
 
Not really clear what 'outsourced' even means or why it's relevant (with evidence) to technology or the specific issues being observed and discussed here atm. Citing the internet's toilet wall (reddit) is generally a sign rumours can be disregarded unless supplied with reputable evidence.

Outsourced being that they are using a generic ODM with minimal modifications to brand it as a Dyson product. I wouldn't say the vacuums fall into this category, however, the robot vacuum that was leaked looks like any other rounded generic version you'd find on the market.
 
Outsourced being that they are using a generic ODM with minimal modifications to brand it as a Dyson product. I wouldn't say the vacuums fall into this category, however, the robot vacuum that was leaked looks like any other rounded generic version you'd find on the market.
I mean, it's all possible, but not very convincing. Sounds like internet toilet wall speculation worth ignoring to me. Pity the wall-scrawlers aren't mentioning the observations I've reported here, independently verified by Frickhelm, or any detailed science behind what's going on. They might be useful then. I'd leave them to self-flush.
 
True but this is all so vague and speculative at the moment, and I suspect will forever be. The lay internet and reputable evidence aren't common bedfellows. I'm still trying to suss out this V16 issue at the other end of the spectrum.
 
If you take the 315AW unquestioned the 900w might just be a marketing "comparison indicator" how much power would be needed with the older v15 to achieve 315 AW. It is pretty close if you take the 230 AW Hepa version of the v15. 230 / 660 * 900 = 313,14.
It is also the same for the "first" AW rating of the gen5 of 262 AW (later changed to 280) : 262 / 752 * 900 = 313,56.
Possibly. Your calculations are just taking the ratio of air power to the power rating on the label, which is an efficiency rating, giving about 35% in all cases.

After some reading and digging—something you won’t find on cesspools like reddit, I think those labels represent the nominal power rating of the machine. Many countries require appliances to list a power rating on the label, often based on standardised tests (e.g., IEC 60335 for household appliances). For cordless vacuums, this might represent the maximum power draw under a specific load (e.g., Boost mode with a standard attachment, not necessarily the 100 W head).

I realised I’d cocked up the numbers earlier, so I’ve reattached. The powers are the estimated (so not accurate) drained by the machine from the battery in the specified usage mode and situation. The values for when on carpet include the 100 W power head, so the motor power (and other machine losses) will be 100 W lower. The run times are likely a bit higher than the machine reports, so these powers may also be slightly overestimated in all cases, particularly the highest values in Boost mode.

What’s generally true is that the nominal or peak power label rating is comparable to the peak power measured in Boost mode on all three machines—including the V16. Since the V16 lists a surprisingly lower nominal power rating of 450 W, this does indicate it has been reduced deliberately over the earlier versions. If it’s not the case that there’s some firmware cap currently there (e.g. by accident) and it has been designed with significantly reduced power in all modes like this deliberately, then it would suggest Dyson’s priority has shifted from performance to stopping customers complaining about runtimes, since this extends it. If that’s true, and I’ve no evidence there’s a software issue, then that’s just terrible and I’m going to absolutely hammer Dyson in the review. It would also suggest that 900 W motor thing is meaningless marketing, and in fact, I’m not even sure what it means in terms of real-world use. Dyson don’t usually market misleading crap. Maybe things have changed…I don’t know for sure yet, but I'm starting to smell some rot from all this data (note: not concluded from the rabid vacuum enthusiasts' wishful bile spitting).

You won’t get a straight answer out of Dyson customer services, who are just robot guard dogs, and the engineers who understand things are probably under a gagging contract so couldn’t speak freely and chime in with clarification, so we just have to take what we see as it is. This thing can’t clean for shit and is vastly outperformed by both the v15 and gen5. So, I’m back to my initial reaction: I can’t believe Dyson did this and if they genuinely did, I hope they get all the hate in the world from V16 customers who return them in disgust. From the moronic user reviews I’ve seen so far, I doubt most of them would even notice they’ve got a Dyson machine in their hand over any other product and are just thrilled it's shiny. What a way for Dyson to seemingly undermine its pioneering and genuinely amazingly interesting constituent technologies. For the first time ever, I'm geninely contemplating returning a Dyson product. I still believe they can software modify the power cap in auto mode though, so we'll see what happens in the next week or so.

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What I find interesting is the promo head image shows what looks like a central position on the front flaps. All the ones I've seen so far have only two positions with the left and right position of the switch. It will be interesting to see what videos pop up over the next few days to see what people get.
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And the presumably paid for reviews are oozing out with many errors and omissions. Some claim it has amazing cleaning performance...but fail to evidence it, naturally, thereby missing a fairly key observation. Yet, they claiming it's bad because the head isn't straight, which is demonstrably a non-issue. Figures. And of course, total obliviousness to the new separator beyond the most trivial cosmetically apparent features. So right on par with expectations then...
Wait, does that thing have a conical shape to its roller brush? Odd decision if so.
It's the only head that fully solves hair tangling (except the panasonic dupe they got to market first using Dyson's idea, as patent history clearly evidences).
 
Never had any hair tangling issues with my Wessel-Werk EBK 360. Seems like it has a pretty sensible design in that regard. Then again, it's operating with a much higher internal air velocity which must be helping it a bit in that regard.
 
Wait, does that thing have a conical shape to its roller brush? Odd decision if so.
It is something Panasonic came up with for a canister vacuum power nozzle on one of their Japanese market vacuums they have subsequently applied to their stick vacs. The idea is that threads or hair caught on the brush roll will move from the larger diameter to the smaller diameter region of the brush roll then fall off the end and be sucked up into the nozzle. Panasonic orients the brushes the opposite of this Diesoon however. Their brushes are widest at the outer edges of the nozzle and taper inward with a small gap between them.
The Japanese vacuum manufacturers have a lot of clever machines never sold outside of Japan. Japan is this parallel universe of interesting and innovative home appliances.

 
It is something Panasonic came up with for a canister vacuum power nozzle on one of their Japanese market vacuums they have subsequently applied to their stick vacs. The idea is that threads or hair caught on the brush roll will move from the larger diameter to the smaller diameter region of the brush roll then fall off the end and be sucked up into the nozzle. Panasonic orients the brushes the opposite of this Diesoon however. Their brushes are widest at the outer edges of the nozzle and taper inward with a small gap between them.
This has been fully debunked long ago (note the correction in the description). Dyson invented the concept, Panasonic seemingly nicked the idea and patented it where it wasn't covered and released to market first. Their design suffers from the additional problem of massive unswept edges where their motors sit. Poor design.
 
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Never had any hair tangling issues with my Wessel-Werk EBK 360. Seems like it has a pretty sensible design in that regard. Then again, it's operating with a much higher internal air velocity which must be helping it a bit in that regard.
Pity there's little evidence to support your claims that can be judged by way of relative comparison.
 
Never had any hair tangling issues with my Wessel-Werk EBK 360. Seems like it has a pretty sensible design in that regard. Then again, it's operating with a much higher internal air velocity which must be helping it a bit in that regard.
Probably because they are miserable for pulling up pet hair. I have three of them, two that came with Miele canister vacuums and a third that came with my Vortech XR3000. Two of the three are literally as new. One was new in the box and has been used for maybe 8 full bags max. The other was only used for two full bags. None of them can remove pet hair from my area rugs. They move the hair back and leave it in a nice neat line at the back of the cleaning stroke. I can clean north-south, east-west and every way in between and the nozzle leaves the hair. Sebo, Lindhaus and Kenmore power nozzle have no problem removing all the pet hair from these same rugs. It is only the Wessel-Werk nozzles that can't do it. A Miele SEB236 takes a lot of passes but will eventually remove the hair. Lindhaus, Sebo and Kenmore remove the hair in two passes max. Even my little Japanese market Panasonic MC-PJ23G does a better job. Fortunately for me the hose handle on the Vortech XR3000 is identical to the hose handle on my Lindhaus Aria so I can use the Vortech with a Lindhaus power nozzle and no frustration.
 
It is something Panasonic came up with for a canister vacuum power nozzle on one of their Japanese market vacuums they have subsequently applied to their stick vacs. The idea is that threads or hair caught on the brush roll will move from the larger diameter to the smaller diameter region of the brush roll then fall off the end and be sucked up into the nozzle. Panasonic orients the brushes the opposite of this Diesoon however. Their brushes are widest at the outer edges of the nozzle and taper inward with a small gap between them.
The Japanese vacuum manufacturers have a lot of clever machines never sold outside of Japan. Japan is this parallel universe of interesting and innovative home appliances.

Interesting that the alignment is opposite between the Dyson and Panasonic. Either way, I can't say I like the range of brush-ground interface speed you will get from that when there are other solutions available.


Pity there's little evidence to support your claims that can be judged by way of relative comparison.

Well you can't really get better than no hair tangling when it comes to hair tangling lol. The only significant variable would be in air velocity, but I would just recommend avoiding underpowered machines.
 

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