Bagged VS Bagless

[sebo_fan]

Well I wouldn't say that they were "bagged" from their invention in terms of using replaceable, disposable dust bags. My father's own Hoover Junior in the 1960s didn't come with a paper dust bag, but rather just used the outer bag for capturing the dust, thus constantly requiring it to be shaken out, creating lots of dust in the home and rather messy.

 

[turbo500]

Nar, that's a really good point. The first Hoover with a paper bag was, I believe, the 1346 in the early 70's. The first Kirby with a disposable paper bag was the Tradition. Prior to this, they were all cloth shake out bags.

It always makes me laugh that disposable paper bags were put in vacuums to make disposal of the dirt easier and more hygenic, and then they were taken away again. Kind of a step back.

 

[sebo_fan]

I agree, but then I have often wondered that with the inner shake out material dust bags that allow air to pass through, why brands haven't offered a triple layer bag whereby a fleece coating is provided and a paper bag inside?

I am pretty sure I once saw something like that on a Numatic commercial tub once (the big ones on huge golf bag trolley wheels.). I guess it is the expense and probably nowadays given the high filtration layers that most bags now have that it would eliminate the need for an outer permanent fleece lining?

Plus of course strain on the motor has to be taken into account I suppose plus restricted airflow etc

 

[turbomaster1984]

The Hoover 1346 was late 1950s and they had disposal bags as did the pink seniors.

All the juniors from 1958 onwards IIRC had paper bags.

It was the 1224 and 119 juniors which had shake out bags

 

[sebo_fan]

It was a 119 Junior my late father had.

Besides that, weren't some Goblin & Electrolux cylinder vacs from the 1960s using shake out dust bags?

 

[blakaeg]

I like bagless because I find them:

1) Good to see what I'm picking up and it makes me feel that I have not spend
25 mins of my time achieving little.

2) I like the 'No extra costs' aspect of things.

3) I like technology, always fascinated with how things work, so cyclones etc
fascinate me.


I like bagged machines because:

1) They are hygienic to empty, no messing around, no dust clouds or mess.

2) I have found bagged machines such as SEBO to be better constructed machines

3) A clean bag for me is like a clean start

4) Impressed with the suction power from bagged machines, even if there a tiny drop
when full.

5) Air fresheners in the bag like the SEBO fresh, smell lovely when vacuuming.

6) I've been able to vacuum builders dust without worry with a bagged machine,
though, really for that type of job, one should use an industrial type machine.

I suppose there are pros and cons to every type of machine and we all have different tastes and requirements but its good to see what others like.

 

[marcusprit]

I agree with you Blakaeg

 

[turbo500]

The Hoover 1346 was late 1950s

The 1346 didn't come out until the early 70's. The 1334 came out in the late 50's and ran throughout the 60's. I know the earlier pink model had a shake out bag, not too sure on the earlier ones.

 

[turbomaster1984]

Chris sorry Im always getting those 13' model no's mixed up - perhaps it was the later juniors.

Guess that's made the seniors deluxe too.

 

[adamthemieleman]

Always a hotly debated subject. But I go for Dyson. And for good reason. This is something I have experienced with our demo machines, we demo with sand, sawdust and cat hair.

The brands we represent:
Hoover: Typical pleated filter in budget models. The globe appears to have a design flaw, dust leaks from the lower half of the bin to the top half where the cyclones are. Not reassuring.

Vax: Pleated filters for basic models. Even the Air is poor. The Air Max Pet was demoed with cat hair, only found to be deposited on the filter.

Bosch: Again pleated filters. Not had much to do with these.

Samsung: Single cyclone and multi. The multi separation is poor, especially noticed on the upright. Sand leaked it's way through, and fine dust on the filter.

Shark: Single cyclone, very poor. Not sure how they get away with no loss of suction. The demo machine has a filter covered in dust, sand in the filter cavity.

Dyson: All demo filters clean. Washed on the odd occasion.

The point here is that Dyson have the best separation system available, even amongst multi-cyclonic. Dyson machines are demoed more than the others yet still have clean filters.

Given we only demo the machines for five minutes with a handful of dirt, I dread to imagine the efficiency of these machines in real life use.

 

[marcusprit]

I agree with Adam. This is what I have found. The seperation on the Dyson cyclones is fantastic. I don't think my filters will need washing for 6 months!

 

[sptyks]

The Riccar Radience is a superb tandem air bagged vacuum and there are no cyclones or filters to wash. Just remove and throw away the HEPA bag. It contains more dust and dirt than the Dyson ever could.

[this post was last edited: 11/8/2014-16:30]

 

[sebo_fan]

Sorry but I think I'll stick with my Numatic Henry eco model. No dust on a filter to worry about - and buyers these days shouldn't have to even bother being taught about dirty filters. Talk about trying to coerce a sale for the most obvious brand!

 

[marcusprit]

Nar if Sebo offered washable filters I think the majority of their customers would approve

 

[marcusprit]

And you could also say buyers these days shouldn't have to purchase bags and filters. And don't forget Cinetic which all Dysons will probably become will require no washing of filters.

 

[kenkart]

Re Old Eureka pic....

Of course its better than anything new...ITS METAL!, and its 80 years old or so, I bet you wont find todays plastivacs running in 80 years!

 

[marcusprit]

You certainly won't. But I like to change my vacuums every 5 years. I'd find it very boring using the same machine for decades. Yawn yawn

 

[turbo500]

I'd find it very boring using the same machine for decad

Marcus, you are a conundrum. One minute you're talking about what the customer wants and then in the same debate you're switching to you personally getting bored with machines. It almost reads like you're being argumentative for the sake of it.

We, as collectors/enthusiasts do not represent what the customer wants. We are far more fussy in that regard and I'd imagine that more customers would agree with Kenkart and want something that will last for years to avoid the inconvenience and expense of having to buy a new one every few years.

 

[marcusprit]

I'm just giving my opinion Chris people are free to agree or disagree. I love some of those old machines but for the same reason i change my car every few years i also like to change my cleaner. Just my opinion as Kenkart was giving his opinion of modern plastic vacs

 

[sebo_fan]

If buyers didn't have to purchase bags and filters for vacuums, they'd still have to buy drive belts if they have an upright.

And you would be scunnered with your allergies if there is no filter to contain any dust escaping!

Of course one might be lucky to own a cylinder vac but you'd still have to wash the filter - the dust that escapes the main chamber has to go somewhere other than out in the room.

Not all Dyson uprights let alone cheap uprights have lifetime drive belts, after all and Im sure it will take an age for the "Dyson Cinetic" to appear on ALL of Dyson's vacs.

As for SEBO washing filters - that will never happen. The brand (and Miele) offer replacement filters to purge the vacuum's main exhaust and therefore refresh the vacuum.

The only washable item SEBO sell is a shake out permanent dust bag for their commercial uprights and not many owners have them because they prefer disposable dust bags.