sharkcar19998
Well-known member
I own a 2007 Pontiac Grand Prix Sedan Base model in black. It is a great car. Just wanted to know if anyone else here has one! Thanks.
Any Pontiac Grand Prix owners?
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human
Well-known member
I used to have a '95 Pontiac Bonneville, which I liked very much and I have owned two GM "W-body" cars, which is the same platform as the on which the Gran Prix was built. I had a '91 Cutlass Supreme coupe back in 1996-1999 and my current car is a 2011 Chevy Impala LT. Both were/are excellent. It's a shame GM decided to drop two of its more venerable brands--Pontiac and Oldsmobile--in recent years. I've heard it said the only reason Buick is still around is it's one of the most popular car brands in China.
suckolux
Well-known member
If I can stick my toe in that water Edgar? It's been a status symbol there forever! Ages ago an emperor brought to China a huge Buick 90 Series I think? I want to say in the 30s maybe? been a while since I heard it.
human
Well-known member
Chinese Buicks
The ironic thing is the Buicks sold in China aren't American made. They're made in China for that market. But now GM has decided to try and make Buick more attractive to import buyers in the U.S. by selling the Chinese Buicks here. Crazy, but not new. When my sister got married the first time in the late '80s, she had a Cutlass Supreme that was made in Canada and her future ex-husband had a Honda Accord made in Ohio, so her 'domestic' car was actually an import and his 'import' was really a domestic.
The ironic thing is the Buicks sold in China aren't American made. They're made in China for that market. But now GM has decided to try and make Buick more attractive to import buyers in the U.S. by selling the Chinese Buicks here. Crazy, but not new. When my sister got married the first time in the late '80s, she had a Cutlass Supreme that was made in Canada and her future ex-husband had a Honda Accord made in Ohio, so her 'domestic' car was actually an import and his 'import' was really a domestic.
vacerator
Well-known member
vintage gold 1977 GP LJ
Back in the day, 301 V8 from Pontiac, steering gear from Saginaw, brakes from Delco Moraine, Dayton Ohio, A/C from Frigidaire, Dayton, heater core, evaporator, condenser, and radiator from Harrison division, NY, wiring harness from Packard Electric, Warren Ohio, radio from Kokomo In., other switches and power accessory motors from Anderson In. Rear axle from Detroit gear and axle (Saginaw div.)
Body stampings from either Cleveland (Parma metal fab.) or Pontiac, frame from Inland division in Deffiance, or Dana co. and final assembly Pontiac. Interior trim from Fisher body trim plants, as well as lights and bezels.
Canadian Pontiacs had Chevrolet engines to keep the cost down, and the Pontiac foundry and engine plant did not have enough production capacity anyway. The ST. Catherine engine plant is closer to Oshawa.
Until the year 2000, the "auto-pact" trade agreement with Canada sent one unit back to Canada for each unit sent to the USA, so were they actually imports?
Rest assured, I will not buy any car from China. I think I can do it too. I may drive at most another twenty five years.
See you parked along Woodward avenue in August near Beaumont Hospital.
Back in the day, 301 V8 from Pontiac, steering gear from Saginaw, brakes from Delco Moraine, Dayton Ohio, A/C from Frigidaire, Dayton, heater core, evaporator, condenser, and radiator from Harrison division, NY, wiring harness from Packard Electric, Warren Ohio, radio from Kokomo In., other switches and power accessory motors from Anderson In. Rear axle from Detroit gear and axle (Saginaw div.)
Body stampings from either Cleveland (Parma metal fab.) or Pontiac, frame from Inland division in Deffiance, or Dana co. and final assembly Pontiac. Interior trim from Fisher body trim plants, as well as lights and bezels.
Canadian Pontiacs had Chevrolet engines to keep the cost down, and the Pontiac foundry and engine plant did not have enough production capacity anyway. The ST. Catherine engine plant is closer to Oshawa.
Until the year 2000, the "auto-pact" trade agreement with Canada sent one unit back to Canada for each unit sent to the USA, so were they actually imports?
Rest assured, I will not buy any car from China. I think I can do it too. I may drive at most another twenty five years.
See you parked along Woodward avenue in August near Beaumont Hospital.
vac-o-matic
Well-known member
Memories....
Back in 1976 with three years in with my airline career, I figured I could handle a car payment. I had a hard time deciding between a Cutlass Supreme or a Grand Prix. The Pontiac won out, thought it looked sportier I guess. I sat down with the dealer, and ordered it. It had everything I could get I think, 400 CID engine, power everything, sunroof, 60/40 seats(didn't want buckets), landau roof, pin striping, and in a new color that year, Firethorn red, inside/out. I was stylin'! That car stickered just a tad under 7000.00. My how times have changed. I had another GP in 1995 that I bought used from Enterprise, I loved that car also.
Back in 1976 with three years in with my airline career, I figured I could handle a car payment. I had a hard time deciding between a Cutlass Supreme or a Grand Prix. The Pontiac won out, thought it looked sportier I guess. I sat down with the dealer, and ordered it. It had everything I could get I think, 400 CID engine, power everything, sunroof, 60/40 seats(didn't want buckets), landau roof, pin striping, and in a new color that year, Firethorn red, inside/out. I was stylin'! That car stickered just a tad under 7000.00. My how times have changed. I had another GP in 1995 that I bought used from Enterprise, I loved that car also.
suckolux
Well-known member
My dad ordered a new 73 SJ, man build quality was crap, but boy did that thing fly!
vacerator
Well-known member
build quality
was better by '75, but not like today. Yes, the 400, and 455 V8's had plenty of torque.
Rust was another problem, mainly the doors, and the roof at the A pillars.
Mine has velour buckets with velour door trim. Very comfortable. The 301 is a dog, but makes up for it in fuel economy.
I bought it used for $2,200 from a private seller in Grosse Pointe in 1983 with 50,000 miles on it. It was very clean. I drove it only in summers until 1986. I put new door skins on it, had it painted, and put it in storage for the winters.
Why? Because I saw the 1988 Grand Prix.
It burns no oil, and the turbohydramatic 400 trans. is also still original and shifts silky smooth.
I had trouble finding rear brake drums because they are the mid size car smaller bolt pattern, but are 11 inch drums as opposed to 9 inch as on a LeMans.
was better by '75, but not like today. Yes, the 400, and 455 V8's had plenty of torque.
Rust was another problem, mainly the doors, and the roof at the A pillars.
Mine has velour buckets with velour door trim. Very comfortable. The 301 is a dog, but makes up for it in fuel economy.
I bought it used for $2,200 from a private seller in Grosse Pointe in 1983 with 50,000 miles on it. It was very clean. I drove it only in summers until 1986. I put new door skins on it, had it painted, and put it in storage for the winters.
Why? Because I saw the 1988 Grand Prix.
It burns no oil, and the turbohydramatic 400 trans. is also still original and shifts silky smooth.
I had trouble finding rear brake drums because they are the mid size car smaller bolt pattern, but are 11 inch drums as opposed to 9 inch as on a LeMans.
suckolux
Well-known member
His was just shocking at how they put it together. A few months old, the veneer walnut on the dash peeled off! If you opened the doors, 2 shims on one side, 5 on the other of the front fenders. 11,000 miles water pump out, had to put trans leak in it at 2 years, it would Bark the tires on the 1-2 shift at full throttle, I loved to drive it as a kid and the noise of that 455 qjet on full boil. But in 2 years it was GONE.Pretty car, loved the long hood. Mom had a 74 Monte, it was Worse! Loved to drive it too, rode and drove so nice, but in Ca, that 350 was an amazingly thirsty DOG. Quality issues too.76 Cutlass, none of that trouble at all. Dad went for Regal Turbo.
suckolux
Well-known member
I think that 73 was our first car with Radial Tires, though my uncle sprung bucks for Michelin for his 68 LeSabre in 71.
vacerator
Well-known member
Hmmm,
David, maybe California cars were all assembled in the old Southgate plant, or even Freemont. Plagued with extra California emission controls as well.
Now Oldsmobile having less market share did not need a second or third plant to meet demand, so all Cutlasses came from Lansing with uniform quality, and back in those days, an Olds, or a Buick was know for better quality than a Chevy or a Pontiac.
GM was a huge operation with nine domestic assembly plants for A and B body cars.
Besides Los Angeles, Freemont, and Michigan, there was a plant in Atlanta Ga., Arlington Texas, they still build trucks, Fairax Kansas, Oklahoma City, Wentzville Mo., Lordstown Ohio before the Vega, Framingham Mass., Linden NJ, Baltimore Md., and Wilmington Delaware.
F bodies were built either in Norwalk Ohio, or Van Nuys Ca. Willow Run, Mi. built Nova's, and the Buick Apollo/Skylark, and Olds Omega.
David, maybe California cars were all assembled in the old Southgate plant, or even Freemont. Plagued with extra California emission controls as well.
Now Oldsmobile having less market share did not need a second or third plant to meet demand, so all Cutlasses came from Lansing with uniform quality, and back in those days, an Olds, or a Buick was know for better quality than a Chevy or a Pontiac.
GM was a huge operation with nine domestic assembly plants for A and B body cars.
Besides Los Angeles, Freemont, and Michigan, there was a plant in Atlanta Ga., Arlington Texas, they still build trucks, Fairax Kansas, Oklahoma City, Wentzville Mo., Lordstown Ohio before the Vega, Framingham Mass., Linden NJ, Baltimore Md., and Wilmington Delaware.
F bodies were built either in Norwalk Ohio, or Van Nuys Ca. Willow Run, Mi. built Nova's, and the Buick Apollo/Skylark, and Olds Omega.
cb123
Well-known member
Nope, but wouldn't one of these cruisers be fun!?
s31463221
Well-known member
LOVE the old cruisers!
I have owned several F-Body Pontiac's through the years, and while I've driven many GP's I've never owned one. One of my favorite memories from my college days was when a group of us went to an old junk car lot and test drove a totally worn-out 77 Grand Prix SJ. That thing was a DOG! One t-top was busted complete out, it was rusty, shocks were gone, but after a LOT of gentle coaxing that old 400 roared to life! We tore down those back country roads as fast as that old trap would take us, decided to take a spin through a large gravel parking lot. I was in the back and literally, I would see sky one minute, and ground the next the car was bouncing so bad. At the far end of the lot there was a small boy riding his bicycle.....he looked up and saw this HUGE olive green tank roaring and bouncing toward him.....I've never in all my days seen anyone run so fast for dear life as that child did! If he didn't have to go home and change his underwear, I would be surprised! Looking back on it now, I can't believe I let anyone talk me into such a crazy thing, the frame was about rusted in two on that junker, but as crazy college kids go, we didn't care!
These days, I much prefer my classic automobiles, and yes I do agree that the build quality of the classic Buick and Oldsmobile cars was far superior to the Chevy and Pontiac cars of the era. Besides my daily driver (a 2014 F-150), my baby is a 1954 Buick Special Coupe....SO comfortable to drive, like sitting on your couch and floating down the highway!
I have owned several F-Body Pontiac's through the years, and while I've driven many GP's I've never owned one. One of my favorite memories from my college days was when a group of us went to an old junk car lot and test drove a totally worn-out 77 Grand Prix SJ. That thing was a DOG! One t-top was busted complete out, it was rusty, shocks were gone, but after a LOT of gentle coaxing that old 400 roared to life! We tore down those back country roads as fast as that old trap would take us, decided to take a spin through a large gravel parking lot. I was in the back and literally, I would see sky one minute, and ground the next the car was bouncing so bad. At the far end of the lot there was a small boy riding his bicycle.....he looked up and saw this HUGE olive green tank roaring and bouncing toward him.....I've never in all my days seen anyone run so fast for dear life as that child did! If he didn't have to go home and change his underwear, I would be surprised! Looking back on it now, I can't believe I let anyone talk me into such a crazy thing, the frame was about rusted in two on that junker, but as crazy college kids go, we didn't care!
These days, I much prefer my classic automobiles, and yes I do agree that the build quality of the classic Buick and Oldsmobile cars was far superior to the Chevy and Pontiac cars of the era. Besides my daily driver (a 2014 F-150), my baby is a 1954 Buick Special Coupe....SO comfortable to drive, like sitting on your couch and floating down the highway!
vac-o-matic
Well-known member
That Buick is freaking stunning! My favorite aunt/uncle both had red Buick convertibles, 57/58. If I remember correctly my aunt's 58 started with the accelerator? My memory is foggy at best, but I was in love with the 58, because of the fins. She drove that car for 10yrs, my uncle practically had to pry it out of her hands to trade it.
I remember years ago talking to a retired GM worker and he told me on comparable models, 1 screw for the Chevy, 2 for the Pontiac, 3 for the Olds, 4 for the Buick, and 5 on the Caddy. There indeed was always quality differences. Then in the '70s you could buy a Pontiac or Olds, and it could have a Chevy inspired engine. The quality of the differences was dissipating, and we won't even talk about the '80s for GM.
I remember years ago talking to a retired GM worker and he told me on comparable models, 1 screw for the Chevy, 2 for the Pontiac, 3 for the Olds, 4 for the Buick, and 5 on the Caddy. There indeed was always quality differences. Then in the '70s you could buy a Pontiac or Olds, and it could have a Chevy inspired engine. The quality of the differences was dissipating, and we won't even talk about the '80s for GM.
suckolux
Well-known member
I think it was called a starterator
cb123
Well-known member
s31463221, I thought you would like them.
...And on a side note, I got the Chevy home about two weeks ago, on account, my mechanic turned out to be a flake. Always giving me one accuse after another about why he hasn't got any of the mechanical repairs done. So when he was gone on another one of his unexpected trips, I slithered over early in the morn and unfroze the drums and put new brakes on, unstuck the carb, put some transmission fluid in, and ran her home on a small gas can, singing " Zippity Do Da " all the way! So, now I just about got all the mechanical problems fixed and the body work should be starting soon.
...And on a side note, I got the Chevy home about two weeks ago, on account, my mechanic turned out to be a flake. Always giving me one accuse after another about why he hasn't got any of the mechanical repairs done. So when he was gone on another one of his unexpected trips, I slithered over early in the morn and unfroze the drums and put new brakes on, unstuck the carb, put some transmission fluid in, and ran her home on a small gas can, singing " Zippity Do Da " all the way! So, now I just about got all the mechanical problems fixed and the body work should be starting soon.
suckolux
Well-known member
56 was a pretty year!
cb123
Well-known member
Thanks David, I think so two! For her to be so wore out, she sure drove well on the way home. Not so much as a puff of smoke. I think just maybe that's why Chevy stopped making the 265, on account, they wouldn't break...And her powerglide shifted smooth too for being only a two speed.
brando_husky
Well-known member
My brother had a 55 Pontiac chieftain. Biiiiig car. Lots of rust and lots of missing pieces but he loved it and drove it quite a bit for the years he had it.
human
Well-known member
Vac-o-matic wrote: Then in the '70s you could buy a Pontiac or Olds, and it could have a Chevy inspired engine.
I reply: They weren't just Chevy inspired engines, they WERE Chevy engines. My dad was a district sales manager for Oldsmobile from 1959-1991 and that was a big stink around 1978 when Oldsmobile couldn't build enough of their 350 "Rocket V8" engines so they quietly substituted Chevy 350's, even going so far as to put the "Rocket 350" decals on the air cleaner lids. That was where they screwed up. There wasn't a thing in the world wrong with the Chevy engine, but they should have told the customers up front what they were getting. It all hit the fan when some smart-ass in the service department of an Olds dealership told a customer who'd thrown a fan belt on his Eighty-Eight that he'd have to go down to the Chevy dealership to get it fixed because the Olds dealership didn't stock the right belt. The customer responded by filing a lawsuit. To this day, price stickers on GM cars now have a disclaimer that says the engine may be built by any GM division.
I reply: They weren't just Chevy inspired engines, they WERE Chevy engines. My dad was a district sales manager for Oldsmobile from 1959-1991 and that was a big stink around 1978 when Oldsmobile couldn't build enough of their 350 "Rocket V8" engines so they quietly substituted Chevy 350's, even going so far as to put the "Rocket 350" decals on the air cleaner lids. That was where they screwed up. There wasn't a thing in the world wrong with the Chevy engine, but they should have told the customers up front what they were getting. It all hit the fan when some smart-ass in the service department of an Olds dealership told a customer who'd thrown a fan belt on his Eighty-Eight that he'd have to go down to the Chevy dealership to get it fixed because the Olds dealership didn't stock the right belt. The customer responded by filing a lawsuit. To this day, price stickers on GM cars now have a disclaimer that says the engine may be built by any GM division.
vacerator
Well-known member
re; GM engine usage
Wow, I never knew, or saw an Olds, Pontiac, or a Buick with an air cleaner sticker claiming they were that divisions engine.
I had seen Olds 350's in '77 Bonneville's though.
The Chevy V8 was fine, except the Olds was smoother, and had positive valve rotation, so by up around 60,000 miles, never suffered from the "chevy" lifter ticks on under maintained oil changed engines.
Buick lost production capacity when it began milling it's V6 again in 1975, so they put the chevy 305 in Regals, and LeSabres as well as Olds.
Olds was also making the fuel Injected 350 for the Cadillac Seville, so I think that was part of the reason they used the Chevy mill.
The Olds 307 was gone by 1990, and Buick stopped V8 production in the 80's, and the last Pontiac V8 was made in 1981, so all engines became corporate after that.
The 2.8, 3.1, 3.4, and 4.3 litre V6's were Chevrolet designs. The 3.3, 3.8, and 4.1 were Buick designs. All V8's were Chevrolet or Cadillac designs, save the 6.2 litre diesel, which was a Detroit diesel design.
Wow, I never knew, or saw an Olds, Pontiac, or a Buick with an air cleaner sticker claiming they were that divisions engine.
I had seen Olds 350's in '77 Bonneville's though.
The Chevy V8 was fine, except the Olds was smoother, and had positive valve rotation, so by up around 60,000 miles, never suffered from the "chevy" lifter ticks on under maintained oil changed engines.
Buick lost production capacity when it began milling it's V6 again in 1975, so they put the chevy 305 in Regals, and LeSabres as well as Olds.
Olds was also making the fuel Injected 350 for the Cadillac Seville, so I think that was part of the reason they used the Chevy mill.
The Olds 307 was gone by 1990, and Buick stopped V8 production in the 80's, and the last Pontiac V8 was made in 1981, so all engines became corporate after that.
The 2.8, 3.1, 3.4, and 4.3 litre V6's were Chevrolet designs. The 3.3, 3.8, and 4.1 were Buick designs. All V8's were Chevrolet or Cadillac designs, save the 6.2 litre diesel, which was a Detroit diesel design.
suckolux
Well-known member
Actually I was told that Cadillac assembled their own 350 from Olds parts for their Seville. I owned 3
human
Well-known member
That's true, David. The Sevilles of the 1970s used an Olds 350 to which Cadillac added fuel injection. It was a relatively simple throttle body setup, as opposed to multi-port, which made it a pretty easy bolt-on in place of the standard carburetor. I think Olds also used that fuel injection system on the diesel 350's they offered in the late '70s and early '80s, which were based on the same "Rocket 350" block.
vacerator
Well-known member
David,
who told you that? A salesman? Now they wouldn't want you to think you were getting anything less than the quality standard for the world like you were paying for. Some buyers would have just bought an Olds 98 with a 455 for even less than a Seville if they knew they were only getting an Olds engine.
I knew the son of the engine line foreman at Cadillac at the time.
All Cadillac added was the fuel Injection to the engine.
It made no sense to ship engine pieces from Lansing to Livonia engine or Detroit final assembly. Livonia engine was at full production capacity with the 500 cubic inch for Eldorados, Fleetwoods, and DeVilles.
who told you that? A salesman? Now they wouldn't want you to think you were getting anything less than the quality standard for the world like you were paying for. Some buyers would have just bought an Olds 98 with a 455 for even less than a Seville if they knew they were only getting an Olds engine.
I knew the son of the engine line foreman at Cadillac at the time.
All Cadillac added was the fuel Injection to the engine.
It made no sense to ship engine pieces from Lansing to Livonia engine or Detroit final assembly. Livonia engine was at full production capacity with the 500 cubic inch for Eldorados, Fleetwoods, and DeVilles.
vacerator
Well-known member
David,
in late '78, Olds also added diesel engines to the Delta engine plant, further reducing gas V8 production capacity. Yes, the same 350 V8 diesel that went into the bussle back Seville and the downsized Eldorado.
in late '78, Olds also added diesel engines to the Delta engine plant, further reducing gas V8 production capacity. Yes, the same 350 V8 diesel that went into the bussle back Seville and the downsized Eldorado.
suckolux
Well-known member
My dad bought a 79 with the Diesel, oh lord, what were they thinking! My brother had a black 76, I had a white 76, dad got a white 79, serious piece of crap. The Fuel Injection system used on the Caddys was Bosch supplied. Throttle body.
suckolux
Well-known member
The diesel Olds was direct injection
human
Well-known member
Diesel Olds
Their thinking at the time was that unlike now, diesel fuel was considerably less expensive than gasoline and the diesel cars, even though they had no pickup, got better fuel economy then their gasoline counterparts. Unfortunately, the engines were terribly unreliable. I don't remember the last time I saw one on the road.
Their thinking at the time was that unlike now, diesel fuel was considerably less expensive than gasoline and the diesel cars, even though they had no pickup, got better fuel economy then their gasoline counterparts. Unfortunately, the engines were terribly unreliable. I don't remember the last time I saw one on the road.
suckolux
Well-known member
They lacked enough head bolts. I want to say the HP was around 110? not much, but they did save fuel when they ran.The compression is so much higher.
