In the case of pushing ease-A Kirby "G" series vacuum cleaner is going to be easier to push than the Oreck XL over thick carpet.Used to have a few Orecks in my collection-sold them--Remember they aren't really designed to be used on thick carpets.Some of the newer Orecks are NOISEY!!!sound like a strangled banshee.I could say the Sebo "X" vacuums would be just right for an older person-or one who does want a hose on the machine for those corner,baseboard cleaning or grabbing cobwebs in ceiling corners.It really doesn't take me that much longer to clean with two machines.Both are ready to go.Just grab the vacuum and go.I don't have to put the hose on the Kirby or the Royal upright-but do use them occasionally-just to try them.The Sebo would absolutely be a better buy than the Oreck XL.It is a more powerful vacuum.And it is easy to push, have a few Sebo uprights in my collection.Watching the auto height adjust is sort of neat-esp on the transparent Sebo I have.You can see the height mechanism working.
ORECK
- Thread starter kirbyloverdan
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I do see elderly folks bring in their whatever brand of vacuums into the Sew&vac place for maintenance-often older machines like 'lux and Kirbys.For just that-changing belts or removing clogs.I could see that an elderly persons finger and hand stregnth may not be enough to stretch a belt onto the brushroll or motor shaft.Oreck must have come out with their bag docking system to make it easier for older folks to change bags-for one Oreck XL that was brought into the vac place for repairs-the outer bag was stuffed full of dirt-she used it that way for years she said-she wasn't aware of the paper bags and didn't want to buy or use them-she simply used the Oreck outer bag like a dump bag-was a mess.She didn't say about removing the cloth bag from the machine to dump it-guess she could have brought the vac to a trash can-opened the cloth bag and let the stuff fall into the trash.
tolivac
I like Sebo too, very solid machine. The only think about Sebo I do not like is you cannot turn off the brush on the X series....my only gripe. I think they should change that! I agree with you about the separate vacuum for tools, I find it inconvenient and the Oreck is good for large open areas, that's about it.
I like Sebo too, very solid machine. The only think about Sebo I do not like is you cannot turn off the brush on the X series....my only gripe. I think they should change that! I agree with you about the separate vacuum for tools, I find it inconvenient and the Oreck is good for large open areas, that's about it.
sebo_fan
Well-known member
Another thought...
Since I returned from Asia I have hummed and hawed about whether I should keep my Miele S6 Ecoline. The S6 is an okay vacuum, at least where its normal variants are concerned and it remains to be beautifully compact and lightweight to carry but the heavy AirTeq Ecoline floor head is a constant pain in the butt to use and I'm fed up of it constantly getting tangled up when the head is put on the rear and the cable is being taken out for use. I can see it as an ideal candidate to take to India the next time I visit - they need something over there which is light enough, has a bigger dust capacity than the paltry 0.7 litres that are currently being offered with one Eureka vac, or the 2 litre bags with the Aerus type machine. My aunt would adore a much lighter vac to pull around and use on the rugs compared to beating the carpets the old fashioned way or putting up with the crap plastic tubes and lousy oval ring carpet floor head that Eureka-Forbes are still selling with other canister vacs.
In India and Dubai, most floor-care appliances are going down the bagless route using the old fashioned paper pleated cones or Eureka Aerus type bagged cylinder vacs that are too heavy to cart around as I mentioned in the other post I created. The bagless vacs are not popular -well if you have ever visited major Indian cities, it's a dust fest!
I bought my aunt an electric kettle over there, a British brand Kenwood which was available in India using a European adapter - so you can imagine that the Miele S6 Eco can definitely be used there, using less power from its 1300 watt motor compared to the 2200 watts of the electric kettle.
In the meantime I have returned to using my Sebo Felix. Granted, it's a much heavier upright than the cylinder Miele S6, but the speed in which I can get around the home using the short hose and attachments to do quick clean ups is a far more compact and quicker affair than using loads of hose and that heavy suction only floor head on the Miele. The Felix may well have a smaller dust bag than the X but I find the manual height adjustment and its brush roll on/off to be a far more modern convenience and feature. And when I'm finished I don't bother winding up the cord - I can just collect it all and stuff it in at the top hook.
Perhaps in time SEBO will do a brush roll on/off on the X series but for the meantime, the Felix has taken over my Miele S6 Eco as the quick run around vac. It is heavier though and that's the point I'd also like to say - the Oreck's winning card is that it is lightweight to carry, but then so is a Sebo K series canister or Vax's Mach Air/Hoover Windtunnel Air (but then crosses the threshold into bagless cyclonic territory). SEBO's main uprights are too heavy to be seen in the UK as an Oreck alternative. People are still relying on the total weight factor and not actually researching what other brands have.
Since I returned from Asia I have hummed and hawed about whether I should keep my Miele S6 Ecoline. The S6 is an okay vacuum, at least where its normal variants are concerned and it remains to be beautifully compact and lightweight to carry but the heavy AirTeq Ecoline floor head is a constant pain in the butt to use and I'm fed up of it constantly getting tangled up when the head is put on the rear and the cable is being taken out for use. I can see it as an ideal candidate to take to India the next time I visit - they need something over there which is light enough, has a bigger dust capacity than the paltry 0.7 litres that are currently being offered with one Eureka vac, or the 2 litre bags with the Aerus type machine. My aunt would adore a much lighter vac to pull around and use on the rugs compared to beating the carpets the old fashioned way or putting up with the crap plastic tubes and lousy oval ring carpet floor head that Eureka-Forbes are still selling with other canister vacs.
In India and Dubai, most floor-care appliances are going down the bagless route using the old fashioned paper pleated cones or Eureka Aerus type bagged cylinder vacs that are too heavy to cart around as I mentioned in the other post I created. The bagless vacs are not popular -well if you have ever visited major Indian cities, it's a dust fest!
I bought my aunt an electric kettle over there, a British brand Kenwood which was available in India using a European adapter - so you can imagine that the Miele S6 Eco can definitely be used there, using less power from its 1300 watt motor compared to the 2200 watts of the electric kettle.
In the meantime I have returned to using my Sebo Felix. Granted, it's a much heavier upright than the cylinder Miele S6, but the speed in which I can get around the home using the short hose and attachments to do quick clean ups is a far more compact and quicker affair than using loads of hose and that heavy suction only floor head on the Miele. The Felix may well have a smaller dust bag than the X but I find the manual height adjustment and its brush roll on/off to be a far more modern convenience and feature. And when I'm finished I don't bother winding up the cord - I can just collect it all and stuff it in at the top hook.
Perhaps in time SEBO will do a brush roll on/off on the X series but for the meantime, the Felix has taken over my Miele S6 Eco as the quick run around vac. It is heavier though and that's the point I'd also like to say - the Oreck's winning card is that it is lightweight to carry, but then so is a Sebo K series canister or Vax's Mach Air/Hoover Windtunnel Air (but then crosses the threshold into bagless cyclonic territory). SEBO's main uprights are too heavy to be seen in the UK as an Oreck alternative. People are still relying on the total weight factor and not actually researching what other brands have.
kirbyfan99
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2013
- Messages
- 60
Mr. David Oreck may not like the fact that Oreck is going bagless as he always said in some of his infomercials "bagless is a dirty word" and "Did you know that if you use a bagless vacuum, you're actually spewing dirt, bacteria, mold, and allergens back into your home". I bet those who knew that David oreck said those 2 things in some of his infomercials and also knew oreck's slogan, they wouldn't be very happy with what oreck did. They don't have 1 bagels vacuum, the versavac, they have 4 bagels vacs — the other 3 are the oreck carvac 12 volt car vacuum, the oreck speed sweep cordless vacuum, and the oreck little hero canister.
-Jack
Kirbyfan99
-Jack
Kirbyfan99
marks_here
Well-known member
Since i'm in between Cookville Tn where the factory is, maybe I can locate where the factory is & drop in to see what they are or aren't producing there. I know the stores in the Nashville area say they will fix any machine but I wouldn't trust them plus when I when I stopped by the store in Mt. Juliet to pick up a brush roll for a neighbor (that was a project in itself) the guy was trying to sell a Miele to a woman which she didn't want because the cord was too short. She told him she wanted something with a long cord. He did not know any of the merchandise that was in there & I wasn't about to open my mouth to offer my 2¢ because the guy was so stressed out because of the rush of people in the store (4 people including me & some random guy sitting in the back room).
Now my neighbor was asking me if she should trade her machine in for a new one & after seeing what I saw there, I told her no because her XL21 was built alot better then the new ones. She picked up hers at a yard sale for $5 bucks & I told her that was the best 5 bucks she ever spent!
Also in the sales bill that we get on Tues. they have at the Sears Oulet an Oreck Reconditioned Magnesium for $149.96 save 50%. Now if this is made in China where is China Tn located at . . . i'm having a rough time trying to find it on the map! LOLOL
Now my neighbor was asking me if she should trade her machine in for a new one & after seeing what I saw there, I told her no because her XL21 was built alot better then the new ones. She picked up hers at a yard sale for $5 bucks & I told her that was the best 5 bucks she ever spent!
Also in the sales bill that we get on Tues. they have at the Sears Oulet an Oreck Reconditioned Magnesium for $149.96 save 50%. Now if this is made in China where is China Tn located at . . . i'm having a rough time trying to find it on the map! LOLOL
nycwriter
Well-known member
Why is Dyson so popular?
"As to the marketing designs that Dyson utilizes. Agreed, their strategy is exactly one that attracts certain consumers to their product. Without going into the cons of the product itself, there are many people who like that flashy, sci-fi kinda design aesthetic."
I think Dyson's AVAILABILITY is much more of a factor than anything else; the fact that you can buy a Dyson at your nearest BB&B, Walmart, or Costco -- rather than having to invite a stranger into your home for a high-pressure (at least that's the perception) sales pitch -- the choice is obvious.
All things being equal, if Kirbys, Rainbows, Luxes, etc. were lined up next to the Dysons, I really think the Dysons would get a run for their money.
"As to the marketing designs that Dyson utilizes. Agreed, their strategy is exactly one that attracts certain consumers to their product. Without going into the cons of the product itself, there are many people who like that flashy, sci-fi kinda design aesthetic."
I think Dyson's AVAILABILITY is much more of a factor than anything else; the fact that you can buy a Dyson at your nearest BB&B, Walmart, or Costco -- rather than having to invite a stranger into your home for a high-pressure (at least that's the perception) sales pitch -- the choice is obvious.
All things being equal, if Kirbys, Rainbows, Luxes, etc. were lined up next to the Dysons, I really think the Dysons would get a run for their money.
kirbyloverdan
Well-known member
And Dysons are
made in Maylasia . The best thing that Dyson did for the vacuum market is make it ok for you to spend over $500.00 for a new vacuum .
Orecks are going to be sold in every store right next to Dyson .
Knowing many high end vacuum dealers ie: Aerus , Rainbow , Kirby , Filter Queen .
When I see the trade in rooms there are always tons of Dysons because of the in home demos .You see the proof in your own home in person that many machines out clean Dyson .
Dan
made in Maylasia . The best thing that Dyson did for the vacuum market is make it ok for you to spend over $500.00 for a new vacuum .
Orecks are going to be sold in every store right next to Dyson .
Knowing many high end vacuum dealers ie: Aerus , Rainbow , Kirby , Filter Queen .
When I see the trade in rooms there are always tons of Dysons because of the in home demos .You see the proof in your own home in person that many machines out clean Dyson .
Dan
Dyson spends a fortune on advertising. If they would spend more on quality control they might actually have more repeat customers. People buy one for the "cool" factor, then realize they do not have a quality product. If customers would just do the proper research, they would end up spending their money on quality products. Listen to experts, people who actually understand and know vacuums. The " cool" factor wears off quickly when you sacrifice quality and performance! Just my thoughts...
Absolutely agree here, I like the looks of a Dyson and it seems cool, I had one for short time, but realized soon that there are other vacuums that pick up so much more dirt than a Dyson... my Aerus upright and Miele canister blows it away.
cue003
Well-known member
I hope you guys see and agree that everyone on this forum is in the minority when it comes to vacuums. Oreck, Dyson, Hoover, Bissell, Shark etc cater to the majority. And they do so without any in store demos. Even when customers have a bag experience only maybe 2 out of 10 would seek out a vacuum specialty store. The other 8 simply throws out the old and brings in something else new to see how it goes. I have met people in my area that used to have Dyson and didn't like it and then went to a Hoover then back to Dyson and now love the shark....etc.. At no time did they consider going to a vacuum store. They simply decide that bed bath and beyond carries better stuff than their Walmart so we will go there for the next vacuum etc.
It is the 80/20 rule..... All the "great" brands such as sebo, miele, Aerus, kirby, rainbow, filter queen, riccar/simplicity etc play and compete with each other in the 20% band. We are all in that band. Everyone else competes in the 80% space. That is a much bigger space with much more room for error. This is why you see the Oreck challenging the bagless success that Dyson and others have seen. They aren't challenging the cleaning ability or clean air or above the floor cleaning ability etc that you find on the vacuums in the 20% band.
It is the 80/20 rule..... All the "great" brands such as sebo, miele, Aerus, kirby, rainbow, filter queen, riccar/simplicity etc play and compete with each other in the 20% band. We are all in that band. Everyone else competes in the 80% space. That is a much bigger space with much more room for error. This is why you see the Oreck challenging the bagless success that Dyson and others have seen. They aren't challenging the cleaning ability or clean air or above the floor cleaning ability etc that you find on the vacuums in the 20% band.
kirbyloverdan
Well-known member
It all comes down to
if you can`t beat em join em .
if you can`t beat em join em .
stricklybojack
Well-known member
cue003 hit the nail on the head...
From Wikipedia (see link):
A meme (pron.: /ˈmiːm/; meem)[1] is "an idea, behavior or style that spreads from person to person within a culture."[2] A meme acts as a unit for carrying cultural ideas, symbols or practices, which can be transmitted from one mind to another through writing, speech, gestures, rituals or other imitable phenomena. Supporters of the concept regard memes as cultural analogues to genes in that they self-replicate, mutate and respond to selective pressures.[3]
Overall the meme has changed in the vacuum world to the disposable vac or Swiffer on hard surface flooring. 70's shag is gone along with the ability of an average person to change a belt and what's even more lacking would be knowing when to, where to get one, & is it the right one for their machine in the first place. So forget offering any design that requires the belt meme. Bags fall into this catagory now to it seems.. All most people know about DTD is it's riddled with scams & rip offs be it vacuums sold by instillment with loan shark rates or other products/charities.
I stopped fighting & have joined the crowd in as much as i'm able to say, found at the right price (not hard if you can use the internet), some of those plasti-disposable vacs offer astonishing capabilities for the money spent. Yes those with crippling allergies need not apply, but they have probably moved on to hard surface by now any way. I see a Kirby and think, "what a sweet piece of machinery, & for almost nuttin' honey!" ($50 used Sentria w/o attachments)...she thinks, "what a tank".
Bagsless is the new shakeout, today's Dyson bling is the Chicklet colors of 60's & 70's Hoovers, who's Constellation model seems most endearing to collectors, but was no doubt was cosidered a toy by serious types back in the day. Memes have changed but it can also be said, "what's old is new again"...vacuums may even be mostly made state-side again someday, stranger things have happened.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme
From Wikipedia (see link):
A meme (pron.: /ˈmiːm/; meem)[1] is "an idea, behavior or style that spreads from person to person within a culture."[2] A meme acts as a unit for carrying cultural ideas, symbols or practices, which can be transmitted from one mind to another through writing, speech, gestures, rituals or other imitable phenomena. Supporters of the concept regard memes as cultural analogues to genes in that they self-replicate, mutate and respond to selective pressures.[3]
Overall the meme has changed in the vacuum world to the disposable vac or Swiffer on hard surface flooring. 70's shag is gone along with the ability of an average person to change a belt and what's even more lacking would be knowing when to, where to get one, & is it the right one for their machine in the first place. So forget offering any design that requires the belt meme. Bags fall into this catagory now to it seems.. All most people know about DTD is it's riddled with scams & rip offs be it vacuums sold by instillment with loan shark rates or other products/charities.
I stopped fighting & have joined the crowd in as much as i'm able to say, found at the right price (not hard if you can use the internet), some of those plasti-disposable vacs offer astonishing capabilities for the money spent. Yes those with crippling allergies need not apply, but they have probably moved on to hard surface by now any way. I see a Kirby and think, "what a sweet piece of machinery, & for almost nuttin' honey!" ($50 used Sentria w/o attachments)...she thinks, "what a tank".
Bagsless is the new shakeout, today's Dyson bling is the Chicklet colors of 60's & 70's Hoovers, who's Constellation model seems most endearing to collectors, but was no doubt was cosidered a toy by serious types back in the day. Memes have changed but it can also be said, "what's old is new again"...vacuums may even be mostly made state-side again someday, stranger things have happened.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme
Oh my! The two Hoover self propelled uprights look very different! LOL
Dyson:Customer broght one in to the Sew&Vac place-complained-"doesn't pick up"It was the compact upright-had a tiny dump bin-the bin is made of such flimsy plastic you could squeeze it almost together with your fingers.There were clogs in two areas-the path going to the bin-a flower sticker and some grass peices and lint-then on the hose side-a huge dust bunny.The motor filters were dirty,too.Cleaned it out-then was OK.forget the model of the machine.To me Dysons are pretty expensive peices of plastic-and probably the most expensive DUMPSTER vac you can buy.Seen a few over the years at the trash dropoff transfer station-in the appliaces dumpster-sad,dirty,dusty Dysons.Probably all have clogs and plugged filters.The dirt path on the Dysons is just to complex.But Dysons sure look pretty in the Bed,Bath&Beyond dsiplay!
strongenough78
Active member
One advantage to bagged vs. bagless, especially with the filters placed on top of the collection tank, the filters clog so fast and easily. As where on a bagged the bag is the filter. The bagless vacs I've used, I'll clean them good before using them and by the time I'm done there is a noticable loss of suction. That on top of the dirt being contained is why I love bagged vacs. Canister or upright.
electromatik
Well-known member
Stricklybojack is so right. Today's bagless fantasies are not new. People forget that at one time nearly ALL vacuums were bagless! And those that had a bag had to be shook out by hand. Disposible bags were invented because people got tired of the dirt flying back out that they had just cleaned up. Why are they trying to steer public opinion back to that?? You know what they say, everything old sooner or later comes back in style. I'm sure I read somewhere that bagless sales had started to decline. People may be tiring of it again just like the housewives of old.
sebo_fan
Well-known member
Yes but im sure housewives "of old" don't miss the days of having to lift a rug outside and then beating it with a carpet beater. When you think about it with the dust and dirt flying everywhere, it isn't far away from what happens when you go and empty a bagless bin outside.
