electromatik
Well-known member
Kirbydanlover, please stop smart mouthing me. I gave them the benefit of the doubt, as you read. I wouldn't buy an Oreck because I like canisters and want attachments, no matter how good they are.
ORECK
- Thread starter kirbyloverdan
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stricklybojack
Well-known member
I am fascinated by the Oreck brand...
First i got to hand it to 'em for making vacuums people love...really, that's the number one thing a company can build into it's products imo. Second, they are so scrappy & unpredictable in their designs, Dual-Stack anyone? Awesomeness!
I'm at a small local church thrift shop, they got a well used basic Oreck upright for a bit more then i want to spend, i'm checkin' it over wondering what it needs, "hmmm not as light as i thought"...that's because a new bag was way over due, the one in it was a solid cinderblock of about 6 lbs of packed dust! That was as good of a testimonial as i'll ever get on a machine.
First i got to hand it to 'em for making vacuums people love...really, that's the number one thing a company can build into it's products imo. Second, they are so scrappy & unpredictable in their designs, Dual-Stack anyone? Awesomeness!
I'm at a small local church thrift shop, they got a well used basic Oreck upright for a bit more then i want to spend, i'm checkin' it over wondering what it needs, "hmmm not as light as i thought"...that's because a new bag was way over due, the one in it was a solid cinderblock of about 6 lbs of packed dust! That was as good of a testimonial as i'll ever get on a machine.
sebo_fan
Well-known member
Oreck just need to start making better and versatile vacuums - if they want to sell to people who sleep in hospitals - if there's anything to be learnt from that news report, its quieter motors for a start! If Miele can do it, so can Oreck and its about time Oreck invested a bit more versatility into their vacuums. I've said it before and I'll say it again, when you consider how lightweight a general vacuum cleaner hose is, there really isn't anything stopping Oreck from adding a hose on the back of their uprights, thus giving future buyers a better incentive than an upright alone with the option of another canister machine in their ownership.
The Oreck uprights direct air fan system would not delivor good suction with a hose-it was designed for floor and carpet cleaning only.That is why the Oreck uprights are often sold with the Oreck compact canister vacuum as a package deal.And a hose and attachments on the Oreck upright would make it heavier and more clumsy-not what the Oreck folks want.
sebo_fan
Well-known member
Oh my goodness me. A hose and two tools do not add " extra weight." You've only been led to believe that. Case in point - many uprights don't have added weight where hoses and tools have been added. I can see your point if an additional caddy has been tagged on that IS heavy if it can be taken off and stored.
Direct air system? Do you mean where the dirt enters from the brush roll and through the fan before it travels up the main spine to the bag? I thought that was dirty fan air?
Clearly the news report highlights some poor thinking in my opinion:
Namely the addition of a lightweight, bagless vacuum/steam mop hybrid. "The industry's never seen that," so says Doug Cahill CEO. Well, hello - Shark already have one on the market and it weighs 12 to 16 pounds.
If Oreck are a true vacuum cleaner company I'd have thought they'd have invested more time and effort in producing something more in line with dry picking up dust only, don't you think? If they want to appear to a younger crowd, they will have to consider an upright WITH a hose. If Miele can do it with their S7, Oreck can jolly well tag along. Keep churning out the classic bagged vacs only but offer buyers something a bit more modern at the same time. Thereby keeping Oreck loyalists happy with the old and pulling in a larger new audience with something new. Selling old and new products are easy to do - Miele, Sebo and others all do it, not necessarily replacing old lines all the time with new ones.
Furthermore, Oreck folks and future Oreck buyers are two very different bands of consumer. An Oreck owner will be happy with what they have and will continue to recommend the product to others as long as it gives good performance - same as any owner with a brand that gives a good performance. I think resting on that idea alone of hearsay and passing a brand's name word of mouth is slowly dying out though.
We have the Internet now, those ruddy consumer reports and individuals use per review site and forums like this. Therefore it's not as easy as it once was to believe in a brand and I very much doubt these days a younger crowd wants two machines to deal with as opposed to one that can offer cleaning the floor and above it.
http://www.amazon.com/Shark-Steam-Mop-Vac-MV2010/dp/B003KKD7DY
Direct air system? Do you mean where the dirt enters from the brush roll and through the fan before it travels up the main spine to the bag? I thought that was dirty fan air?
Clearly the news report highlights some poor thinking in my opinion:
Namely the addition of a lightweight, bagless vacuum/steam mop hybrid. "The industry's never seen that," so says Doug Cahill CEO. Well, hello - Shark already have one on the market and it weighs 12 to 16 pounds.
If Oreck are a true vacuum cleaner company I'd have thought they'd have invested more time and effort in producing something more in line with dry picking up dust only, don't you think? If they want to appear to a younger crowd, they will have to consider an upright WITH a hose. If Miele can do it with their S7, Oreck can jolly well tag along. Keep churning out the classic bagged vacs only but offer buyers something a bit more modern at the same time. Thereby keeping Oreck loyalists happy with the old and pulling in a larger new audience with something new. Selling old and new products are easy to do - Miele, Sebo and others all do it, not necessarily replacing old lines all the time with new ones.
Furthermore, Oreck folks and future Oreck buyers are two very different bands of consumer. An Oreck owner will be happy with what they have and will continue to recommend the product to others as long as it gives good performance - same as any owner with a brand that gives a good performance. I think resting on that idea alone of hearsay and passing a brand's name word of mouth is slowly dying out though.
We have the Internet now, those ruddy consumer reports and individuals use per review site and forums like this. Therefore it's not as easy as it once was to believe in a brand and I very much doubt these days a younger crowd wants two machines to deal with as opposed to one that can offer cleaning the floor and above it.
http://www.amazon.com/Shark-Steam-Mop-Vac-MV2010/dp/B003KKD7DY
As an Amazon Associate we earn from qualifying purchases.
kirbysthebest
Well-known member
I am not going to knock Oreck because I think they are good little vacuums for what they were designed to do.
I think the light weight is what has caused them to gain their popularity, at least that is the way they have been marketed. As for offering bagless, they are just attempting to give consumers a choice while still staying with their line of vacuums.
The best vacuum someone can have is one they will use. If a 8lb, Oreck is easier to use by an older person, or someone with disabilities then it is going to be far more effective than a more complicated heavier machine.
Though by going bagless, Dave is going to have to re-shoot a whole series of infomercials where he touts the superiority of a bagged machine.
I think the light weight is what has caused them to gain their popularity, at least that is the way they have been marketed. As for offering bagless, they are just attempting to give consumers a choice while still staying with their line of vacuums.
The best vacuum someone can have is one they will use. If a 8lb, Oreck is easier to use by an older person, or someone with disabilities then it is going to be far more effective than a more complicated heavier machine.
Though by going bagless, Dave is going to have to re-shoot a whole series of infomercials where he touts the superiority of a bagged machine.
kirbyloverdan
Well-known member
Ryan
as Harley has said Oreck`s are for older people or those with a disability any attachments would add weight to the vacuum . Orecks are know for their light weight 8-9 lb vacuum not tools onboard heavy vacuum .
Plus the idea of having two vacuums an upright and a canister is the perfect way to clean your house . I personally hate tools on board when I clean I use an upright mostly for carpet and a canister for attachment cleaning and bare floor cleaning .
as Harley has said Oreck`s are for older people or those with a disability any attachments would add weight to the vacuum . Orecks are know for their light weight 8-9 lb vacuum not tools onboard heavy vacuum .
Plus the idea of having two vacuums an upright and a canister is the perfect way to clean your house . I personally hate tools on board when I clean I use an upright mostly for carpet and a canister for attachment cleaning and bare floor cleaning .
georgect
Well-known member
Daniel
Ohhhh Daniel...I LOVE as many tools as possible on board a canister...to each his own.
I love being able to take the vacuum anywhere in the house and BAM! everything is right there with you. No having to run upstairs to grab an attachment.
And I like my attachments to be full sized, not tiny.
I just hope the Riccar's coming later this year will fill may desires for a full sized canister with every bell and whistle and attachment, on board.
Ohhhh Daniel...I LOVE as many tools as possible on board a canister...to each his own.
I love being able to take the vacuum anywhere in the house and BAM! everything is right there with you. No having to run upstairs to grab an attachment.
And I like my attachments to be full sized, not tiny.
I just hope the Riccar's coming later this year will fill may desires for a full sized canister with every bell and whistle and attachment, on board.
Direct air and dirty air mean the same thing.I don't use hose attached to the vacuum-to have the hose with the machine means compromises-The hose performance won't be as good and the upright function won't be as good-hence the little compact canister sold with the Oreck XL type uprights.On the little Oreck XL upright-they would have to somehow intergrate the hose with the direct-dirty air fan system.Garry did do this-never used one of their machines.Don't know how well the hose on their machine works.I hardly ever use the hand tools and hose with my Kirbys-just on occasions--just to use them.Mostly use another canister vac instead.Its easier and gives better hose performance.
sebo_fan
Well-known member
Dan
Who has time these days to use two machines to clean up a home compared to one? (well apart from vacuum cleaner collectors!) I can see the bonus of a canister vacuum but to have to buy the two in order to get the upright in the first place can be off putting. Things are easier now since Oreck do sell just the uprights.
I find it quite ironic that whilst some members on here feel that the elderly need an 8lb vacuum cleaner to use, some easily forget the maintenance thereafter. How can an elderly person who may be arthritic and yet is able to use an Oreck vacuum cleaner be able to grip the thick rubber sections at the back of the main spine to remove clogs? Or, change the drive belt? Do you see my point in this? If not I'll explain in more detail.
My parents bought their Oreck XL in the 1990s. At the time it was one of the "middle of the range" models available in the UK. They bought it because they too were "getting on a bit," and the heavy 10kg Vax canister they had bought a few years earlier was given to me as it was far too heavy to use in the home. My mother also broke her arm and thereafter couldn't use half of the appliances in the home. (You can't imagine the delight I had when they gave me their Jack La Lanne juicer as it was too heavy to move each time to remove the bin at the back in their tiny kitchen.) So the Oreck made sense at the time - even using our old Hoover Junior U1104 with the straight plastic handle was agonising for mum to push around. They adored the Helping Handle and the 10 metre length cord that the XL came with though and the ease of using the upright only to swipe around floors. What they weren't taken with was some of the claims that Oreck had used the machine with - namely showing that the vacuum could clean any kind of carpet including sisal weave and thick natural bassine rugs that had been bolted at the front door.
Oreck UK showed a video with the same kind of texture where the Oreck XL could happily clean. Not with my parents. They soon found out that the drive belt could easily break due to the long textures of that particular carpet. So in the first year of ownership, the XL had about three belt replacements and my father detested the idea of having to remove so many screws on the base plate, not for the belt replacement but for having to remove the bunched up of texture fibres sitting in a bunch at the dust channel behind the brush roll.
Next up - the dust bag in their XL was of the old type that just pushed onto the dust channel hole. At times it would come off, because whilst they felt the dust bag inside since there was no dust bag indicator, the dust bag would never be as full as it initially filled the first day they got the XL. Definitely a clog then and oh the fun I had trying to dismantle it all to shift the clog of dog hair that had just built up behind the main dust channel at the top leading to the dust bag.
Looking back at it now, my parents avoided using the XL until I returned home from Uni to fix it whilst they borrowed my uncle's SEBO X1 - a totally different machine as you can imagine but when the electronic sensor took the weight off pushing and pulling and showed if there was a clog, my parents instantly fell in love with the SEBO upright, though it was just as expensive to buy as the money they had splashed out on the Oreck XL and the brush roll could be taken out via a push button release! For a machine that was supposedly made for the elderly, they felt let down by the Oreck's design and more so for the lack of a hose. My late father was a scientist and mathematician and he figured it wouldn't have been a loss to fit just a hose on the back by the main suction channel spine. I can still see their point, even if years after, the dust bag has a slide in-to-lock mechanism, now.
Another issue they had was the actual cord of the machine itself - Oreck UK fits the poorest rubber quality that when run over with the Oreck when its done accidentally, the rubber splits really easily. Two cord replacements were also spent on my parents XL. They didn't mind winding up the cord though as it was light enough, but the quality of it was less than expected for the price they paid. When you're used to thicker rubberised ribbed cords on Hoover classic uprights, the thin rubber quality on an upright three or four times the price of what went before can be disappointing to the buyer and owner.
End of the day, whilst the machine was great on carpets and hard floors, my parents felt as if they had been ripped off. Having to buy replacement edge brushes that were a nonsense to put on via a tiny cross head screw, the removal of another cross head screw to get into the side door belt release chamber (it made a lot of sense just to leave the screw out and just slide the door in, eventually with tape). the removal of clogged pet hair and whatever else got stuck up the spine or the main dust channel and then at the end of all that having to put up with the noisiest sound they had ever experienced, the claim that this was a purpose made vacuum ideal for the elderly just didn't seem to ring true. They were less impressed with the cost of the highly expensive high filtration dust bags too.
Its all very well being able to have an upright that is light and easy to push - but what happens after if it all starts to go wrong? Does the design extend far enough to consider easier access points for elderly people who find gripping difficult and poor eyesight compensated by larger screws or nuts for removal or far more modern mechanisms that don't even allow tools to be used?
Who has time these days to use two machines to clean up a home compared to one? (well apart from vacuum cleaner collectors!) I can see the bonus of a canister vacuum but to have to buy the two in order to get the upright in the first place can be off putting. Things are easier now since Oreck do sell just the uprights.
I find it quite ironic that whilst some members on here feel that the elderly need an 8lb vacuum cleaner to use, some easily forget the maintenance thereafter. How can an elderly person who may be arthritic and yet is able to use an Oreck vacuum cleaner be able to grip the thick rubber sections at the back of the main spine to remove clogs? Or, change the drive belt? Do you see my point in this? If not I'll explain in more detail.
My parents bought their Oreck XL in the 1990s. At the time it was one of the "middle of the range" models available in the UK. They bought it because they too were "getting on a bit," and the heavy 10kg Vax canister they had bought a few years earlier was given to me as it was far too heavy to use in the home. My mother also broke her arm and thereafter couldn't use half of the appliances in the home. (You can't imagine the delight I had when they gave me their Jack La Lanne juicer as it was too heavy to move each time to remove the bin at the back in their tiny kitchen.) So the Oreck made sense at the time - even using our old Hoover Junior U1104 with the straight plastic handle was agonising for mum to push around. They adored the Helping Handle and the 10 metre length cord that the XL came with though and the ease of using the upright only to swipe around floors. What they weren't taken with was some of the claims that Oreck had used the machine with - namely showing that the vacuum could clean any kind of carpet including sisal weave and thick natural bassine rugs that had been bolted at the front door.
Oreck UK showed a video with the same kind of texture where the Oreck XL could happily clean. Not with my parents. They soon found out that the drive belt could easily break due to the long textures of that particular carpet. So in the first year of ownership, the XL had about three belt replacements and my father detested the idea of having to remove so many screws on the base plate, not for the belt replacement but for having to remove the bunched up of texture fibres sitting in a bunch at the dust channel behind the brush roll.
Next up - the dust bag in their XL was of the old type that just pushed onto the dust channel hole. At times it would come off, because whilst they felt the dust bag inside since there was no dust bag indicator, the dust bag would never be as full as it initially filled the first day they got the XL. Definitely a clog then and oh the fun I had trying to dismantle it all to shift the clog of dog hair that had just built up behind the main dust channel at the top leading to the dust bag.
Looking back at it now, my parents avoided using the XL until I returned home from Uni to fix it whilst they borrowed my uncle's SEBO X1 - a totally different machine as you can imagine but when the electronic sensor took the weight off pushing and pulling and showed if there was a clog, my parents instantly fell in love with the SEBO upright, though it was just as expensive to buy as the money they had splashed out on the Oreck XL and the brush roll could be taken out via a push button release! For a machine that was supposedly made for the elderly, they felt let down by the Oreck's design and more so for the lack of a hose. My late father was a scientist and mathematician and he figured it wouldn't have been a loss to fit just a hose on the back by the main suction channel spine. I can still see their point, even if years after, the dust bag has a slide in-to-lock mechanism, now.
Another issue they had was the actual cord of the machine itself - Oreck UK fits the poorest rubber quality that when run over with the Oreck when its done accidentally, the rubber splits really easily. Two cord replacements were also spent on my parents XL. They didn't mind winding up the cord though as it was light enough, but the quality of it was less than expected for the price they paid. When you're used to thicker rubberised ribbed cords on Hoover classic uprights, the thin rubber quality on an upright three or four times the price of what went before can be disappointing to the buyer and owner.
End of the day, whilst the machine was great on carpets and hard floors, my parents felt as if they had been ripped off. Having to buy replacement edge brushes that were a nonsense to put on via a tiny cross head screw, the removal of another cross head screw to get into the side door belt release chamber (it made a lot of sense just to leave the screw out and just slide the door in, eventually with tape). the removal of clogged pet hair and whatever else got stuck up the spine or the main dust channel and then at the end of all that having to put up with the noisiest sound they had ever experienced, the claim that this was a purpose made vacuum ideal for the elderly just didn't seem to ring true. They were less impressed with the cost of the highly expensive high filtration dust bags too.
Its all very well being able to have an upright that is light and easy to push - but what happens after if it all starts to go wrong? Does the design extend far enough to consider easier access points for elderly people who find gripping difficult and poor eyesight compensated by larger screws or nuts for removal or far more modern mechanisms that don't even allow tools to be used?
In the case of pushing ease-A Kirby "G" series vacuum cleaner is going to be easier to push than the Oreck XL over thick carpet.Used to have a few Orecks in my collection-sold them--Remember they aren't really designed to be used on thick carpets.Some of the newer Orecks are NOISEY!!!sound like a strangled banshee.I could say the Sebo "X" vacuums would be just right for an older person-or one who does want a hose on the machine for those corner,baseboard cleaning or grabbing cobwebs in ceiling corners.It really doesn't take me that much longer to clean with two machines.Both are ready to go.Just grab the vacuum and go.I don't have to put the hose on the Kirby or the Royal upright-but do use them occasionally-just to try them.The Sebo would absolutely be a better buy than the Oreck XL.It is a more powerful vacuum.And it is easy to push, have a few Sebo uprights in my collection.Watching the auto height adjust is sort of neat-esp on the transparent Sebo I have.You can see the height mechanism working.
I do see elderly folks bring in their whatever brand of vacuums into the Sew&vac place for maintenance-often older machines like 'lux and Kirbys.For just that-changing belts or removing clogs.I could see that an elderly persons finger and hand stregnth may not be enough to stretch a belt onto the brushroll or motor shaft.Oreck must have come out with their bag docking system to make it easier for older folks to change bags-for one Oreck XL that was brought into the vac place for repairs-the outer bag was stuffed full of dirt-she used it that way for years she said-she wasn't aware of the paper bags and didn't want to buy or use them-she simply used the Oreck outer bag like a dump bag-was a mess.She didn't say about removing the cloth bag from the machine to dump it-guess she could have brought the vac to a trash can-opened the cloth bag and let the stuff fall into the trash.
tolivac
I like Sebo too, very solid machine. The only think about Sebo I do not like is you cannot turn off the brush on the X series....my only gripe. I think they should change that! I agree with you about the separate vacuum for tools, I find it inconvenient and the Oreck is good for large open areas, that's about it.
I like Sebo too, very solid machine. The only think about Sebo I do not like is you cannot turn off the brush on the X series....my only gripe. I think they should change that! I agree with you about the separate vacuum for tools, I find it inconvenient and the Oreck is good for large open areas, that's about it.
sebo_fan
Well-known member
Another thought...
Since I returned from Asia I have hummed and hawed about whether I should keep my Miele S6 Ecoline. The S6 is an okay vacuum, at least where its normal variants are concerned and it remains to be beautifully compact and lightweight to carry but the heavy AirTeq Ecoline floor head is a constant pain in the butt to use and I'm fed up of it constantly getting tangled up when the head is put on the rear and the cable is being taken out for use. I can see it as an ideal candidate to take to India the next time I visit - they need something over there which is light enough, has a bigger dust capacity than the paltry 0.7 litres that are currently being offered with one Eureka vac, or the 2 litre bags with the Aerus type machine. My aunt would adore a much lighter vac to pull around and use on the rugs compared to beating the carpets the old fashioned way or putting up with the crap plastic tubes and lousy oval ring carpet floor head that Eureka-Forbes are still selling with other canister vacs.
In India and Dubai, most floor-care appliances are going down the bagless route using the old fashioned paper pleated cones or Eureka Aerus type bagged cylinder vacs that are too heavy to cart around as I mentioned in the other post I created. The bagless vacs are not popular -well if you have ever visited major Indian cities, it's a dust fest!
I bought my aunt an electric kettle over there, a British brand Kenwood which was available in India using a European adapter - so you can imagine that the Miele S6 Eco can definitely be used there, using less power from its 1300 watt motor compared to the 2200 watts of the electric kettle.
In the meantime I have returned to using my Sebo Felix. Granted, it's a much heavier upright than the cylinder Miele S6, but the speed in which I can get around the home using the short hose and attachments to do quick clean ups is a far more compact and quicker affair than using loads of hose and that heavy suction only floor head on the Miele. The Felix may well have a smaller dust bag than the X but I find the manual height adjustment and its brush roll on/off to be a far more modern convenience and feature. And when I'm finished I don't bother winding up the cord - I can just collect it all and stuff it in at the top hook.
Perhaps in time SEBO will do a brush roll on/off on the X series but for the meantime, the Felix has taken over my Miele S6 Eco as the quick run around vac. It is heavier though and that's the point I'd also like to say - the Oreck's winning card is that it is lightweight to carry, but then so is a Sebo K series canister or Vax's Mach Air/Hoover Windtunnel Air (but then crosses the threshold into bagless cyclonic territory). SEBO's main uprights are too heavy to be seen in the UK as an Oreck alternative. People are still relying on the total weight factor and not actually researching what other brands have.
Since I returned from Asia I have hummed and hawed about whether I should keep my Miele S6 Ecoline. The S6 is an okay vacuum, at least where its normal variants are concerned and it remains to be beautifully compact and lightweight to carry but the heavy AirTeq Ecoline floor head is a constant pain in the butt to use and I'm fed up of it constantly getting tangled up when the head is put on the rear and the cable is being taken out for use. I can see it as an ideal candidate to take to India the next time I visit - they need something over there which is light enough, has a bigger dust capacity than the paltry 0.7 litres that are currently being offered with one Eureka vac, or the 2 litre bags with the Aerus type machine. My aunt would adore a much lighter vac to pull around and use on the rugs compared to beating the carpets the old fashioned way or putting up with the crap plastic tubes and lousy oval ring carpet floor head that Eureka-Forbes are still selling with other canister vacs.
In India and Dubai, most floor-care appliances are going down the bagless route using the old fashioned paper pleated cones or Eureka Aerus type bagged cylinder vacs that are too heavy to cart around as I mentioned in the other post I created. The bagless vacs are not popular -well if you have ever visited major Indian cities, it's a dust fest!
I bought my aunt an electric kettle over there, a British brand Kenwood which was available in India using a European adapter - so you can imagine that the Miele S6 Eco can definitely be used there, using less power from its 1300 watt motor compared to the 2200 watts of the electric kettle.
In the meantime I have returned to using my Sebo Felix. Granted, it's a much heavier upright than the cylinder Miele S6, but the speed in which I can get around the home using the short hose and attachments to do quick clean ups is a far more compact and quicker affair than using loads of hose and that heavy suction only floor head on the Miele. The Felix may well have a smaller dust bag than the X but I find the manual height adjustment and its brush roll on/off to be a far more modern convenience and feature. And when I'm finished I don't bother winding up the cord - I can just collect it all and stuff it in at the top hook.
Perhaps in time SEBO will do a brush roll on/off on the X series but for the meantime, the Felix has taken over my Miele S6 Eco as the quick run around vac. It is heavier though and that's the point I'd also like to say - the Oreck's winning card is that it is lightweight to carry, but then so is a Sebo K series canister or Vax's Mach Air/Hoover Windtunnel Air (but then crosses the threshold into bagless cyclonic territory). SEBO's main uprights are too heavy to be seen in the UK as an Oreck alternative. People are still relying on the total weight factor and not actually researching what other brands have.
kirbyfan99
Well-known member
- Joined
- Feb 15, 2013
- Messages
- 60
Mr. David Oreck may not like the fact that Oreck is going bagless as he always said in some of his infomercials "bagless is a dirty word" and "Did you know that if you use a bagless vacuum, you're actually spewing dirt, bacteria, mold, and allergens back into your home". I bet those who knew that David oreck said those 2 things in some of his infomercials and also knew oreck's slogan, they wouldn't be very happy with what oreck did. They don't have 1 bagels vacuum, the versavac, they have 4 bagels vacs — the other 3 are the oreck carvac 12 volt car vacuum, the oreck speed sweep cordless vacuum, and the oreck little hero canister.
-Jack
Kirbyfan99
-Jack
Kirbyfan99
marks_here
Well-known member
Since i'm in between Cookville Tn where the factory is, maybe I can locate where the factory is & drop in to see what they are or aren't producing there. I know the stores in the Nashville area say they will fix any machine but I wouldn't trust them plus when I when I stopped by the store in Mt. Juliet to pick up a brush roll for a neighbor (that was a project in itself) the guy was trying to sell a Miele to a woman which she didn't want because the cord was too short. She told him she wanted something with a long cord. He did not know any of the merchandise that was in there & I wasn't about to open my mouth to offer my 2¢ because the guy was so stressed out because of the rush of people in the store (4 people including me & some random guy sitting in the back room).
Now my neighbor was asking me if she should trade her machine in for a new one & after seeing what I saw there, I told her no because her XL21 was built alot better then the new ones. She picked up hers at a yard sale for $5 bucks & I told her that was the best 5 bucks she ever spent!
Also in the sales bill that we get on Tues. they have at the Sears Oulet an Oreck Reconditioned Magnesium for $149.96 save 50%. Now if this is made in China where is China Tn located at . . . i'm having a rough time trying to find it on the map! LOLOL
Now my neighbor was asking me if she should trade her machine in for a new one & after seeing what I saw there, I told her no because her XL21 was built alot better then the new ones. She picked up hers at a yard sale for $5 bucks & I told her that was the best 5 bucks she ever spent!
Also in the sales bill that we get on Tues. they have at the Sears Oulet an Oreck Reconditioned Magnesium for $149.96 save 50%. Now if this is made in China where is China Tn located at . . . i'm having a rough time trying to find it on the map! LOLOL
nycwriter
Well-known member
Why is Dyson so popular?
"As to the marketing designs that Dyson utilizes. Agreed, their strategy is exactly one that attracts certain consumers to their product. Without going into the cons of the product itself, there are many people who like that flashy, sci-fi kinda design aesthetic."
I think Dyson's AVAILABILITY is much more of a factor than anything else; the fact that you can buy a Dyson at your nearest BB&B, Walmart, or Costco -- rather than having to invite a stranger into your home for a high-pressure (at least that's the perception) sales pitch -- the choice is obvious.
All things being equal, if Kirbys, Rainbows, Luxes, etc. were lined up next to the Dysons, I really think the Dysons would get a run for their money.
"As to the marketing designs that Dyson utilizes. Agreed, their strategy is exactly one that attracts certain consumers to their product. Without going into the cons of the product itself, there are many people who like that flashy, sci-fi kinda design aesthetic."
I think Dyson's AVAILABILITY is much more of a factor than anything else; the fact that you can buy a Dyson at your nearest BB&B, Walmart, or Costco -- rather than having to invite a stranger into your home for a high-pressure (at least that's the perception) sales pitch -- the choice is obvious.
All things being equal, if Kirbys, Rainbows, Luxes, etc. were lined up next to the Dysons, I really think the Dysons would get a run for their money.
kirbyloverdan
Well-known member
And Dysons are
made in Maylasia . The best thing that Dyson did for the vacuum market is make it ok for you to spend over $500.00 for a new vacuum .
Orecks are going to be sold in every store right next to Dyson .
Knowing many high end vacuum dealers ie: Aerus , Rainbow , Kirby , Filter Queen .
When I see the trade in rooms there are always tons of Dysons because of the in home demos .You see the proof in your own home in person that many machines out clean Dyson .
Dan
made in Maylasia . The best thing that Dyson did for the vacuum market is make it ok for you to spend over $500.00 for a new vacuum .
Orecks are going to be sold in every store right next to Dyson .
Knowing many high end vacuum dealers ie: Aerus , Rainbow , Kirby , Filter Queen .
When I see the trade in rooms there are always tons of Dysons because of the in home demos .You see the proof in your own home in person that many machines out clean Dyson .
Dan
Dyson spends a fortune on advertising. If they would spend more on quality control they might actually have more repeat customers. People buy one for the "cool" factor, then realize they do not have a quality product. If customers would just do the proper research, they would end up spending their money on quality products. Listen to experts, people who actually understand and know vacuums. The " cool" factor wears off quickly when you sacrifice quality and performance! Just my thoughts...
Absolutely agree here, I like the looks of a Dyson and it seems cool, I had one for short time, but realized soon that there are other vacuums that pick up so much more dirt than a Dyson... my Aerus upright and Miele canister blows it away.
cue003
Well-known member
I hope you guys see and agree that everyone on this forum is in the minority when it comes to vacuums. Oreck, Dyson, Hoover, Bissell, Shark etc cater to the majority. And they do so without any in store demos. Even when customers have a bag experience only maybe 2 out of 10 would seek out a vacuum specialty store. The other 8 simply throws out the old and brings in something else new to see how it goes. I have met people in my area that used to have Dyson and didn't like it and then went to a Hoover then back to Dyson and now love the shark....etc.. At no time did they consider going to a vacuum store. They simply decide that bed bath and beyond carries better stuff than their Walmart so we will go there for the next vacuum etc.
It is the 80/20 rule..... All the "great" brands such as sebo, miele, Aerus, kirby, rainbow, filter queen, riccar/simplicity etc play and compete with each other in the 20% band. We are all in that band. Everyone else competes in the 80% space. That is a much bigger space with much more room for error. This is why you see the Oreck challenging the bagless success that Dyson and others have seen. They aren't challenging the cleaning ability or clean air or above the floor cleaning ability etc that you find on the vacuums in the 20% band.
It is the 80/20 rule..... All the "great" brands such as sebo, miele, Aerus, kirby, rainbow, filter queen, riccar/simplicity etc play and compete with each other in the 20% band. We are all in that band. Everyone else competes in the 80% space. That is a much bigger space with much more room for error. This is why you see the Oreck challenging the bagless success that Dyson and others have seen. They aren't challenging the cleaning ability or clean air or above the floor cleaning ability etc that you find on the vacuums in the 20% band.
kirbyloverdan
Well-known member
It all comes down to
if you can`t beat em join em .
if you can`t beat em join em .
stricklybojack
Well-known member
cue003 hit the nail on the head...
From Wikipedia (see link):
A meme (pron.: /ˈmiːm/; meem)[1] is "an idea, behavior or style that spreads from person to person within a culture."[2] A meme acts as a unit for carrying cultural ideas, symbols or practices, which can be transmitted from one mind to another through writing, speech, gestures, rituals or other imitable phenomena. Supporters of the concept regard memes as cultural analogues to genes in that they self-replicate, mutate and respond to selective pressures.[3]
Overall the meme has changed in the vacuum world to the disposable vac or Swiffer on hard surface flooring. 70's shag is gone along with the ability of an average person to change a belt and what's even more lacking would be knowing when to, where to get one, & is it the right one for their machine in the first place. So forget offering any design that requires the belt meme. Bags fall into this catagory now to it seems.. All most people know about DTD is it's riddled with scams & rip offs be it vacuums sold by instillment with loan shark rates or other products/charities.
I stopped fighting & have joined the crowd in as much as i'm able to say, found at the right price (not hard if you can use the internet), some of those plasti-disposable vacs offer astonishing capabilities for the money spent. Yes those with crippling allergies need not apply, but they have probably moved on to hard surface by now any way. I see a Kirby and think, "what a sweet piece of machinery, & for almost nuttin' honey!" ($50 used Sentria w/o attachments)...she thinks, "what a tank".
Bagsless is the new shakeout, today's Dyson bling is the Chicklet colors of 60's & 70's Hoovers, who's Constellation model seems most endearing to collectors, but was no doubt was cosidered a toy by serious types back in the day. Memes have changed but it can also be said, "what's old is new again"...vacuums may even be mostly made state-side again someday, stranger things have happened.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme
From Wikipedia (see link):
A meme (pron.: /ˈmiːm/; meem)[1] is "an idea, behavior or style that spreads from person to person within a culture."[2] A meme acts as a unit for carrying cultural ideas, symbols or practices, which can be transmitted from one mind to another through writing, speech, gestures, rituals or other imitable phenomena. Supporters of the concept regard memes as cultural analogues to genes in that they self-replicate, mutate and respond to selective pressures.[3]
Overall the meme has changed in the vacuum world to the disposable vac or Swiffer on hard surface flooring. 70's shag is gone along with the ability of an average person to change a belt and what's even more lacking would be knowing when to, where to get one, & is it the right one for their machine in the first place. So forget offering any design that requires the belt meme. Bags fall into this catagory now to it seems.. All most people know about DTD is it's riddled with scams & rip offs be it vacuums sold by instillment with loan shark rates or other products/charities.
I stopped fighting & have joined the crowd in as much as i'm able to say, found at the right price (not hard if you can use the internet), some of those plasti-disposable vacs offer astonishing capabilities for the money spent. Yes those with crippling allergies need not apply, but they have probably moved on to hard surface by now any way. I see a Kirby and think, "what a sweet piece of machinery, & for almost nuttin' honey!" ($50 used Sentria w/o attachments)...she thinks, "what a tank".
Bagsless is the new shakeout, today's Dyson bling is the Chicklet colors of 60's & 70's Hoovers, who's Constellation model seems most endearing to collectors, but was no doubt was cosidered a toy by serious types back in the day. Memes have changed but it can also be said, "what's old is new again"...vacuums may even be mostly made state-side again someday, stranger things have happened.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme
Oh my! The two Hoover self propelled uprights look very different! LOL
Dyson:Customer broght one in to the Sew&Vac place-complained-"doesn't pick up"It was the compact upright-had a tiny dump bin-the bin is made of such flimsy plastic you could squeeze it almost together with your fingers.There were clogs in two areas-the path going to the bin-a flower sticker and some grass peices and lint-then on the hose side-a huge dust bunny.The motor filters were dirty,too.Cleaned it out-then was OK.forget the model of the machine.To me Dysons are pretty expensive peices of plastic-and probably the most expensive DUMPSTER vac you can buy.Seen a few over the years at the trash dropoff transfer station-in the appliaces dumpster-sad,dirty,dusty Dysons.Probably all have clogs and plugged filters.The dirt path on the Dysons is just to complex.But Dysons sure look pretty in the Bed,Bath&Beyond dsiplay!
strongenough78
Active member
One advantage to bagged vs. bagless, especially with the filters placed on top of the collection tank, the filters clog so fast and easily. As where on a bagged the bag is the filter. The bagless vacs I've used, I'll clean them good before using them and by the time I'm done there is a noticable loss of suction. That on top of the dirt being contained is why I love bagged vacs. Canister or upright.
electromatik
Well-known member
Stricklybojack is so right. Today's bagless fantasies are not new. People forget that at one time nearly ALL vacuums were bagless! And those that had a bag had to be shook out by hand. Disposible bags were invented because people got tired of the dirt flying back out that they had just cleaned up. Why are they trying to steer public opinion back to that?? You know what they say, everything old sooner or later comes back in style. I'm sure I read somewhere that bagless sales had started to decline. People may be tiring of it again just like the housewives of old.
sebo_fan
Well-known member
Yes but im sure housewives "of old" don't miss the days of having to lift a rug outside and then beating it with a carpet beater. When you think about it with the dust and dirt flying everywhere, it isn't far away from what happens when you go and empty a bagless bin outside.
