Kirby 1-CB motor issues

[sopranojam85]

Recently, my Kirby 1-CB started making a low-pitched, "motor boating" sound when running. It's not coming from the rug nozzle or anything... it's the motor. (Nothing attached, and running motor by pressing power + speed switch.)

I cleaned some stuff out of the fan blades. They collected some stuff. But the issue remains. I was afraid the motor was "off balance" or something. That's what it sounds like... but watching the motor shaft turn, I don't see any noticeable wobble.

I had this thing rebuilt by the factory in early 2010. I'd hate to have to re-do the rebuild process if this is an easy fix.

The fan is not original, it's the plastic variety... been that way for about 10 years now, and I assume that the fan was also replaced during the rebuild process 2 years ago. I'm starting to notice little tiny scuffs in the fan blades. Nothing major, but it seems these scuffs are where hair and stuff likes to accumulate on the fan blades. Could the "motor boating" sound (off-balance) issue be caused by the fan, even if it's not fatally damaged? Just scuffed? Thank you.

 

[madabouthoovers]

I think thats the Classic Omega model so no tech drive to check out. Does the vibration come through the main body any more than usual when you put a hand on it? Did you carefully inspect the whole of the fan, by removing the front of the fancase? any damage where a piece of the fan has broken off will cause vibration and noise, or similarly, if a bit of chewing gum or detritus has stuck to one of the blades, this will cause noise and vibration as well. The motor also has a rear fan behind the motor housing, and if this has come loose or bent out of shape it could cause vibration. Also check there is nothing trapped in this fan.
Normal bits of damage to the main plastic fan shouldnt matter too much - my G7 has a well worn fan with battle scars on it, but the motor runs very sweetly with no more noise than usual. You could always try removing the fan and running the cleaner to eliminate that as a cause.
If both the main fan and the rear fan are OK, then I can only think it must be the bearings (front or rear) are worn or dry of lubrication, or wear in the shaft where the shaft goes through the bearings - is there any undue play in the motor shaft (sideways or back and forth)?
check the motor carbon brushes are secure as well, and that all the motor housing screws are tight.

 

[sopranojam85]

I seem to recall some sort of sealant being put between the fan case and motor. Is such a thing necessary, and if so, what type of sealant is it?

 

[eurekastar]

It sounds to me like you may just have a brush roll with bad bearings.  Either that, or one of the end caps isn't sitting in the carrier correctly.  Brush roll issues can make a real racket sometimes and you can think something horrible is wrong with the vacuum.  A quick way to tell if it's a brush roll issue is to use the belt lifter to lift the belt off the fan pulley.  Then turn vacuum on and see how it sounds.  If it's making the same noise, then you know it's not the brush roll but something else.  But if you determine that it's a brush roll issue, remove the brush roll and examine the the two carriers.  Sometimes the lugs get spread out and the end caps don't sit in their tightly enough.  That will make a terrible racket, because the end cap will just rattle around.  If that's not the case, then you may just need a new brush roll.  As for fan case sealant, I've always just clear silicone calk.  If you don't use something, it will leak air.  Hope this helps!

 

[sopranojam85]

I used tweezers to get all the cat fur out of the fan blades. That temporarily did the trick. After a full cleaning the sound is gradually coming back. Lo and behold, so is the cat fur on the fan blades.

Bag is almost empty, fill tube isn't clogged. Not sure I've ever had cat fur stick to the fan blades like this.

Do I really need to replace the fan just 2.5 years in? I guess a trip to hardware store is in my future. Can't imagine what else is causing this... Unless there's some kinda crud elsewhere in the fan case blocking normal air flow.

 

[kirbykid]

if you could post a YouTube video of the sound I might be able to help

 

[madabouthoovers]

Must be small nicks and bits of damage on the fan, causing hairs to accumulate on the blades - mine does this as well, as I have cats, fur does tend to catch on to the small nicks in the plastic of the fan blades but it doesnt seem to cause much trouble - yet. I suppose if enough hairs build up on the fan, it would put it out of balance, all depends on how much build up there is, and how badly the fan is worn. I suppose the only answer would be a new fan, and be more careful what you pick up with it so as to avoid damaging it again. This is always the drawback with plactic fans on dirty fan machines - they may have used a really cheap quality pattern part fan when it was last changed - I think only the later Kirbys were fitted with kevlar fans after the G5.

 

[sopranojam85]

Kevlar, huh? Searching around, some people say it's Lexan, others say it's Kevlar. Not sure...

Seems the G5 and later have the fans made with this more durable material... whatever it is.
I found reports of people putting a kevlar (or lexan... or whatever) fan in a Kirby Classic III. Where would I find such a fan? Will a G5 or later fan work on the Classic Omega, or would I need a different one?

 

[eurekastar]

Lexan is the material that Kirby once used in their fans.  The fans today are made out of a material similar to Kevlar.  I think that's why people say that.  If the brush roll isn't the culprit and it still sounds like a thrashing machine, then you probably need a new fan.  Sometimes it's hard to see the broken piece(s) and even nicks that catch pet hair can throw it off balance.  It might be a good idea to stop running it until the fan is changed, because it will run the armature off balance cause the the armature or the field (or both) to short. 

 

[sopranojam85]

Should I look for a specific kind of fan then? There's bunches on eBay, they all look more-or-less the same. Some are listed for G series, other for Heritage/Legend series models. Wondering what the real differences are, and whether it's possible or worth pursuing a kevlar/whatever material fan? Thank you.

 

[lillylux]

I'm with the guys....you have to eliminate the fan's condition before considering other avenues..and speaking from experience with Kirbys of all year/models, I know that as the impeller gets "sand blasted" by normal use, it does leave some erosion on the blades. Now this is not a problem in and of itself...but it does lead to that "lower octave sound" because the wear makes it easy for lent and other debris to get caught in the blades. What happens is it causes a division in the air path that causes a sympathetic drone a couple of octaves below the pitch of the fan itself. When my machines are requiring frequent "picking lent out" I dump some cat litter on the carpet and vacuum it up, and it actually "cleans" and perhaps smooths things out a bit. Also, UNUSED, arm and hammer baking soda is a nice deoderizer! Again...as the above comments have pointed out, if there is any vibration that is unusual felt through the handle...then that is probably one of the fans as has been said.
Nina

 

[eurekastar]

The fans themselves are exactly the same; however, the certain items in the kits are different (depending on the model).  Just look for the fan kit that's specific for your model. 

 

[sopranojam85]

New fan kit is on the way. I also got a new rug plate gasket... Have been meaning to get one on there for some time.

 

[sopranojam85]

Fan is installed - all better! I will work on the rug plate gasket next. I got some awesome adhesive for it to stay put.

 

[sopranojam85]

Ok. I have replaced the rug plate gasket. I used a Dremmel to completely clear off all the old goo and debris before applying gasket adhesive, and firmly gluing the new one down. I let it cure for 24 hours, and reinstalled the rug plate. This did not change the other noise though.

How can I describe it? 2 noises, and both noises only happen when the rug nozzle is in use, and when it's down 3 notches (proper height for cleaning this carpet.)

1.) Low frequency rattle. It's pretty clear that it's proportionate to the brush roller speed. I suspect it's either the brush roller, or something related that's rattling. No amount of fiddling has rid me of this. It's particularly bad when moving the cleaner backwards. It sounds like a metal-on-metal vibration.

2.) A very high pitched hissing wind tunnel sound. It's happening even when the belt lifter is up (so that the brush roller is not spinning). It sounds like an air leak. It does not happen when using the hose so it must be the rug nozzle. It's not coming from the top "if suction is too high" vent. Moving that vent open/closed has no change. It sounds like an air leak around the rug plate gasket but I can't find the leak for the life of me...

Other than these quirks the vacuum works great. I guess most of this effort was all for nothing though, which is super frustrating. It's just noises.

 

[madabouthoovers]

Nice to see you got a new fan - I just acquired another Kirby myself this month, a Heritage 1. I note that the rubber gasket between the nozzle and the fan housing is different from the G series, and maybe this is where your air leak is coming from?
I was gonna suggest that did you seal the fan housing with some silicone rubber when you replaced the fan? Apparently if you don't seal the two halves of the fan chamber you can get air leaks there too.

I know that the odd whistle can be annoying though! The rattle could just be the brushroll ends slightly loose in the base plate housings. Not sure how the brushroll fits into the bell housing on the Omega - but maybe a new brushroll and base plate might solve the rattling issue?

 

[sopranojam85]

Yeah these are all valid suggestions. I did use clear silicon sealant between the fan case when I put the fan back on. The sound is the same as it always was. Maybe it's the seal on front of the motor where it meets up with the rug nozzle, I dunno.

I've stopped caring I think. It still cleans great, and doesn't seem to be leaking dust anywhere. I don't wanna sink any more cash into it than necessary. Thanks!

 

[sopranojam85]

I have often toyed with the thought of buying a G series, but I can't imagine having to vacuum the stairs by hand with one of those monsters. I really do like the lean, lighter weight of these older models.

 

[kirbyclassiciii]

Callie,

You may just want to revert back to the OEM single-row brush roll (#152575).

~Ben