Hot & Cold Fill UK Washing Machines

[sebo_fan]

Here's a thought I'm puzzled about currently.

At the moment I'm running a test based on a cold fill washing machine compared to my old faithful LG washer that has a cold & a hot fill system. The hot tube runs off the mains water supply that my gas boiler has, when it is used and the washer is used maybe once a week if Im lucky. The LG uses 2100 watts in total and has a 6.5kg load. It offers a variety of programs including 1600 rpm top spin speed and a quick wash of which I usually use the most of.

The new machine uses 2225 watts in total and has a bigger 9kg load. It too offers a variety of programs including a quick wash. However it also offers 1600 rpm top spin speeds as well as others and though it should be more eco-efficient based on the cold water fill alone, the 1800 watt water heater inside the machine requires the water to be heated up. Thus, doesn't this fact make this machine less eco efficient than the older machine even though it is cold fill only?

The stats online for this machine tell me one thing that it is eco efficient with its A+++ rating but then my old LG was also rated A for performance, thus an older system granted its 8 year old age. But still, the water that the LG uses is no where as big for the larger 9kg load that this newer machine offers.

 

[turbo500]

Hi Ryan,

Interesting point. I know, generally speaking, gas is more costly to run than electric. Lets also not forget that your boiler is electricity powered, even if it's just to control the timer and inner workings (I'm no boiler expert, but when I have a power cut, the boiler goes off. Therefore it is electric lol!).

Hot & Cold fill machines still have to heat the water, just not as much as a cold fill only. With the cold fill only washer, it may use more electricity to heat the water, but it's not using any gas and not using electricity to power the boiler. The A+++ rating will also be based on water consumption as well as power consumption. So if it uses less water, no gas and is using less electricity just to heat the water instead of heat the water AND power the boiler, then in theory, that would make it greener?

Out of interest, which LG do you have?

Chris

 

[sebo_fan]

That thought was precisely what I thought regarding the cold fill only versus the hot & cold fill. The only aspect that seems to be more greener, or perhaps more efficient is if the hot water has been channelled from another source, such as solar panels.

I have an LG WM16220FD *(link to old review). It has never required any repair and its just a fab machine that does what is asked of it. Now with a more modern A+++ washer with a much bigger 9kg load capacity, it uses a drive belt compared to the direct drive of the LG and though generally quiet, the new washer is a bit noisier than expected. Last night I thought the "vacuum truck" was passing by my house only to realise it was the new machine doing a spin lol




http://www.dooyoo.co.uk/washing-machine/lg-wm16220fd/1054497/

 

[turbo500]

Oh, so you've actually bought a new machine? Is there any particular reason you got a new one?

I *think* my godparents have that older LG, but don't quote me on that. It's definitely similar and about the same age. That is a fantastic machine from what I remember.

 

[sebo_fan]

Message sent!

 

[dysonman1]

Are you telling us that in the UK, you are just now getting washing machines that hook up to both the hot and cold water faucets? Our washers in the USA have always done that, and none that I know of have had a heater inside. My Maytag Bravos is an excellent washer that is very energy efficient, holds 25 pounds of clothes in one load, and while a top loading machine, has no agitator. I've had it for almost six years and no problems.

 

[turbo500]

^No. Historically, UK and European washers were all hot & cold feed, but it is far more energy efficient to have them on cold fill only. Since about 2000-2002 ish, all UK washers have been cold fill only.

NOTE: NOT GETTING INTO YET ANOTHER DEBATE ABOUT TOPLOADERS VS. FRONT LOADERS.

 

[sebo_fan]

As Chris says quite rightly, up until 2000 or so, brands started to offer cold fill only. My family in India have an excellent LG top loader though. Very quiet, quite space efficient but by god it takes a lot of water. Took me back to the days of when my parents had their ever faithful Hoover Twin-tub - those were very popular in the UK.

Mind you, it does the job it is intended to do and I was very impressed with it. My uncle tried to explain to me how to work it until I said I have an LG already - the controls are very similar, so that was good to find.

Luckily in Scotland, in most areas we don't have a separate water bill. Parts of England do though as well as the famous "hosepipe" ban when water is low. We never have that issue in Scotland as it rains all the time!!

 

[anthony]

hot and cold fill washers

my old washer was a hoover H&C fill but by the time the hot water came all the way down from the hot water cylinder upstairs the machine was full usually with cold to tepid water so the heater came on anyway just my tuppence worth guys

 

[davetranter]

Cold only / Hot & Cold fill

I'm not sure, but I think that some of the 'efficiency' attributed to cold-fill-only washers, is that they may use slightly shorter cycles, due to the 'soak time' available while the water heats, plus the compilers of the data will probably assume all-electric heating- hence the economy of only heating the precise amount of water required for the load.

But.... On the subject of efficiency/eco-friendliness... Why does no manufacturer INSULATE the drum?????

All best

Dave T

 

[sebo_fan]

Well ive since discovered that the programs on offer with this new cold fill machine take far longer than what Im used to.

 

[vacbear58]

Well you say that ......

Firstly I should point out for Americans and Canadians there is a fundamental difference between how your machines (front loading) work and European machines work.

I cannot think of a European designed machine that does not have a built in heater. Traditionally on hot and cold fill machines the machine will generally only take in hot water on washes of 60C & more, which reduces the time taken to complete the wash rather than wait for the water to heat from cold. All other programmes and rinses use cold water - at least in my experience.

The only machines that I can think of which were not supplied with a heater (post WW2) were a few wringer washers and twin tubs.

Cold fill only machines are by no means a new thing although it seems to me that the largest trend to cold fill only was from German manufactured machines - not entirely, I can think of certain Indesit models that were cold fill, and one of my Hoover Keymatics (wide body not slanted - 1967) is cold fill only too, although the model was modified later for H & C fill. This was a surprise as the predecessor models were H&C fill - why they did this, who knows?

@sebo_fan - I know it is a common conception that current machines take a lot longer, but I am not sure I agree. My daily driver is a 2004 Miele machine which takes 1hr 46min for a cotton wash and 1hr 16m for a Minimum Iron (Permanent Press) wash. I have been surprised that my old autos (Keymatic 1967, Keymatic 1979, Philips 1981) take pretty much the same time to complete to complete equivalent cycles. These all run on cold fill only, as does the Miele.

I will add that I usually start the Miele and walk to do something else (and actually I usually run it at night) whereas with the vintage machines I tend to keep an eye on them (partly to make sure they are not leaking!) which makes it seem like they take even longer. Its not just watched kettles that never boil ...

Al

 

[sebo_fan]

I cant say very much for the moment but my 8 year old h&c fill LG takes 2 hours 40 to do a full 60 degree cotton wash compared to the new cold fill only machine that offers the same program and takes 3 hours 15! Mind you, the LG has a 7.5kg capacity compared to the 9kg capacity, but that shouldn't mean the same when there are sufficient clothes not to overload the system.

 

[paulc]

Sebo Fan

The 60 deg cotton cycle is the one used to determine the machines energy efficiency rating and is usually the one that uses the least water. A lot of these large capacity washers have very long wash times to enable them to clean well using less water than automatics used in the past. Can I ask what washing machine did you get? Does it have a function to reduce the wash time? I always have the short option selected on my washer, I get great results and most loads are done anywhere from 50 to 90 mins, mind you, my machine is rated at 6kg.

 

[sebo_fan]

I cant say what the machine is at the moment as it still going through the product test from the company. Put it this way, the total rating is 2525 watts compared to the 2100 watts on my hot and cold fill LG. In essence the bigger drum means it should be more economical to use since it uses less water but unless I use just the eco cold only temp washes or the quick wash functions, there's very little between them and I'd be more inclined to stick with the fab performance and reliability that LG have given me already.

 

[paulc]

Product testing for the company? Oh my!!!!! I'd be in my element!

 

[sebo_fan]

Well I can tell you, I have enjoyed every moment of it!

 

[alexhoovers94]

Paul...

Was that a pun?

 

[sebo_fan]

All can be revealed now - I was chosen from a few others to test run the Hotpoint WMUD962P washer.

Video link given below.

http://www.ciao-special.co.uk/hotpoint/phase3/