Cirrus Unit Made By Tacony

[panasonicvac]

Tom, the Maytag M700 used a single stage 12 amp motor. I don't know if you were either mistaken or if the earlier ones in fact had a double stage motor (I would like to see pictures if so). But I know for certain the Maytags that I've sold and serviced before were in fact single stage. And that would've made more sense because double stage motors are more expensive than the single stage motors, Maytag or Whirlpool I should say since the original Maytag company has been gone since 2007, they would've wanted the cheaper route to go for since they weren't just only sold through vacuum stores. Like the M1200 is the same thing as the R30D/S30D, the M500 is the same thing as the R10S/S10S (Without the metal brushroll), and the M700 is the same thing as the R20P/S20P, none of which were Tacony's top of the line uprights.

Also regarding the lifetime belts and the hall sensor. I've never recalled ever having issues on both of those before, but that's just in my area. Also, my relative's R20P.2 has been going on for almost three years now and it's never had a problem yet, I've even tripped the hall sensor a few times without any issues. It'll be due for a free bag and filter change coming up shortly which is something no other company would offer. You'd not only get a warranty but you'd also get a VIP policy. That's about a $65 value! I'm sorry you haven't had a good experience with Tacony. But you outta give them credit for coming up with the lifetime belt and hall sensor idea. I really thought it was ingenious because not only occasionally I'd accidently vacuum up something that I shouldn't like the bed covers I've mentioned earlier but also I'm getting tired of changing out the rubber stretch belts, that was a complaint both my uncle and aunt had with their old Panasonic before they bought the Riccar. And I'm sure many consumers would agree as well. I love both the Riccar 8955 and the Simplicity 7850 but either one isn't what I'd want to have because they use a rubber belt and no hall sensor. Not to mention that I don't like bending over to grab the hose out, the handle grip wearing out on the 8955 or the plastic handle grips breaking on the 7850, and the handle release wearing out, the R20UP/S20UP were a nice upgrade for me.

 

[mark40511]

I think the Cirrus Vacuums are too expensive too

I feel like (at least the one I have) is a $350 vacuum and not a $500 vacuum...

The build quality is better than throw away vacuums for sure but it's not what I would call a premium built vacuum.. sort of falls between cheap and premium I suppose.

I'm trying to remember the last time I sucked something up and stopped the belt and at some point it's unavoidable no matter how careful you are. I've only done it a couple of times but it was the corner of a blanket hanging down...

I rarely ever use the clutch because all the hard floor/above floor cleaning I take the quick draw wand out and connect it to the aftermarket extension hose. I wouldn't like this vacuum for above floor or hard floor cleaning on its own...or any upright for that matter..In fact, I'm so used to using the extension hose and its tools I would probably use them with any canister vacuum for more reach. I do this with my Rainbow too and it's a canister

That port that opens on the back that you connect hoses to is a joke...the airflow is so bad through the hose using that port.. I just connect the aftermarket hose to the quick draw wand the airflow is so much stronger.

 

[dysonman1]

I actually had a chance to see the failure rate on hall sensors with my own eyes. Not only the ones that were failing while being assembled into new machines on the assembly line, but the tremendous number of hall sensors that were returned under warranty. Along with circuit boards. I would never want to purposely sell a vacuum with a hall sensor.

 

[panasonicvac]

You mean you wouldn't want to purposely sell a Tacony vacuum with a hall sensor (at least brand new) anymore at your newer store, is that right? Again, I don't ever recall seeing an issue with the hall sensor when I was working at a few vacuum shops in my area but I couldn't say that I was speaking on behalf of the other areas including the plant. I know not every part is perfect (I've definitely seen circuit boards go bad on other vacuums, not just Tacony), but the hall sensor works and it has proven to be useful to me. And of course, there's always room for improvement. Tacony definitely does improve their machines to be better which is one of the reasons why I still like that company today. I'll admit that they aren't the same that they were 10 years ago but it's not stopping me from buying or recommending their products to anybody. Actually if I do build a house in the next year or so, the Riccar or Simplicity central vacs are on my short list of brands to consider installing in brand new for my own. The only change I'd do is swapping out the double row brushroll to a triple row brushroll on the powerhead.

 

[kirbylux77]

Tom

Ok, so you saw a issue with the hall sensor failing on the TOL Vibrance/Symmetry uprights. At least Tacony did do revisions and improve them as time went on. Plus, why would Tacony still have models....even commercial models at that....that use a lifetime belt and hall sensor to this day if they didn't work and they weren't reliable? Plus, they are even relying on a Chinese manufacturer for quality control and ensuring a good finished, reliable product.
'
Look, we all get that you had a bad experience working for Tacony and you certainly have reason to resent the company. But that's the past - you started your own successful vac shop again, and one with your OWN museum this time to boot. Isn't it about time we move on and quit bashing Tacony products and the company? I personally don't like seeing all the negativity about them....I think their products are great! I use my Simplicity canister all the time, and I am sure there are many others like myself and Alex that feel the same way.

Rob

 

[kirbylux77]

Mark

I think you actually got a pretty good deal on your Cirrus CR79, especially for the features you get for $350. Here in Canada, the Panasonic Performance Plus Platinum, their TOL models with the double stage motors, started at about $350 in most vac shops. And they did NOT have a sealed HEPA exhaust filter, or the ability to add one on for that price. You also had to spend about $450 to get a model with the brushroll on/off switch in that TOL range. The only advantage one of those Panasonic uprights would have had is the double stage Panasonic-made motor, and even then that's debatable whether they would be that much better than the single stage Ametek motor your Cirrus CR79 has.

Sure, the quality could be higher. But the problem right now is the high end upright market has some good machines with decent quality, but with some serious compromises. And then you have certain brands like Shark and Dyson that think they can charge those high end upright prices for TOL models that just aren't anywhere the build quality as the others and are a rip-off in comparison.

Lindhaus - high build quality, long lifespan, commercial grade machines. BUT, HEPA Cloth bags aren't widely available yet, on many models their sealed HEPA Filter is optional, and you only get a 1 row brushroll that has rather wimpy grooming action in comparison to other brands.

Sebo - Yes, they have great build quality, long lifespan, commercial grade. But, on the X series full size uprights you get only average suction through the hose, no brushroll on/off, and their S Class grade filtration that claims to be close to HEPA is seriously lacking. On the Felix, you have to put up with a machine with a really heavy upper body and that blows out lots of hot air to get a brushroll on/off switch, swivel steering, variable speed control and the option to use a floor brush or rug/floor nozzle.

Miele - The S7/Dynamic U1 uprights were nice, but unfortunately it was too fancy for it's own good and had many flaws and quality control issues, they learned the hard way to stick to canisters.

Aerus - They did have a good upright with the Guardian, but unfortunately that all ended when they replaced it with the Heavy Duty model recently.

The one brand that I see has some promise are the Riccar R25 models - yes, a bit pricy, especially for being made in China. But you get a LOT of features for those prices, and a really nice design. It's unfortunate to see how some dealers think they are slightly below Sebo in quality, but hopefully that's something they can improve on in the future. If I was looking at a high end upright for my home, I would only be looking at the Cirrus models, Riccar R25 uprights and the Tacony made uprights under the various names they are sold under. To me, these machines make the balance between providing a quality machine, with the features consumers want at reasonable prices.

Rob

 

[panasonicvac]

I remembered years ago that same buddy of mine from my old local vacuum store had some Panasonic Optiflow uprights that were TOL back then like the late 2000s'. I'll definitely share a thread more about them down below. The silver MC-UG775 had not only a double stage TriForce motor and a clutch but also it had a HEPA filter (not as good as the Cirrus but better than alot of other post motor filters back then), the switch was on the handle, it used the Optiflow design which I thought was neat, and the hose was SUPER long like one of the longest for an upright. However, I seemed to recall that at least here in the states it was like somewhere between $700-$800 which I thought was quite a bit much for an upright like that. I knew the green MC-UG787 was close to the $1,000 range. It was a bit much because I knew I could've gotten a red Performance Plus Platinum MC-UG589 with similar performance but for ALOT less like $400 or no more than $500 (of course you'd also lose some features that the Opitflow had) and the Cirrus CR99 was around in that same price range that I would've bought over the MC-UG589 cause it did offered me more than what Panasonic would've had in that price range. And also around the same price range as the silver Optiflow, the R20UP/S20UP also offered more than what Panasonic would've had to give me. Awesome upright in my humble opinion, one of if not the best Panasonic vacuums that I've ever used.

https://www.vacuumland.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?21678_41

 

[panasonicvac]

Also thought I'd mention on here that I just bought a blue Panasonic Performance Plus Platinum MC-UG583 for $15 in REALLY good condition like that thing will look like brand new once I'm done refurbishing it

 

[s2_82]

@kirbylux77

Hey Rob.. I always wondered why the Felix blows out pretty hot air from it's exhaust myself when I tried one out at the store a few times, since I'm considering one.. Do you recommend it? I really do think it might be a good option though because there aren't too many machines like it except for the Lindhaus which still uses paper bags which have gone archaic in the industry, at least for residential use.

 

[mark40511]

the most impressive

thing to me is the fact that the HEPA bags are not that outrageously expensive...nor are the HEPA filters...and the bag chamber stays clean...the reason that's so impressive to me is over the years with any bagged vacuum I've had in the past...there was always some dust in the bag chamber...but then again, those weren't HEPA bags...My Kenmore progressive would always have dust in the bag chamber no matter if it was a HEPA bag or not...

I have an air purifier in my room that shows the level of pollution in the air (Now, keep in mind...I don't know how accurate it is) I do know that when I vape...it goes way up...it usually stays on around 4 to 8 (0 being best)..My point is that I cleaned my room where the air purifier is running on high speed and while vacuuming it stayed between 4 and 8 the entire time.

 

[kirbylux77]

Steve

I would say that for certain use cases, for some people a Sebo Felix would be a good choice. If you had a home with lots of area rugs and hard floors, or if you wanted to clean hard floors but you didn't want to use a stick vacuum or a canister, for instance. However, for most consumers, a Shark upright would be a better choice.

The Sebo does clean well, no complaints there. However, my Shark Navigator and Shark Rotator clean just as well....have just as much suction and airflow through the hose, and the powerhead grooms as nicely as the Sebo. However, I am not particularly impressed with the S Class filtration system that Sebo uses, you can definitely tell the air is cleaner, but not as clean as other vacuums. My Shark uprights filter better, and back years ago a air purifier website tested the Shark Navigator and found it released only 3,000 particles into the air during their tests. If you were looking at high end uprights, I would give the edge to Lindhaus over Sebo since they have optional HEPA Filters. As far as running costs go, one nitpick I have with the Felix is, unlike the Sebo X series, you can't find generic HEPA Cloth bags as easily.

As far as usability goes, It's a very top heavy upright....this would definitely not be a good vacuum for seniors, disabled people or who don't have much upper body strength. In my home, just living in a apartment and being used by a healthy strong male, it's ok, but I could see how someone who had a lot of carpeting to clean in a large family home would find it tiring and get annoyed after a while. The Felix also blows out a LOT of hot air through the exhaust filter, definitely takes some getting used to and some people would find annoying.

I was also not impressed that for a $700 dollar upright, the dusting brush and extension wand are optional. And the tool holder only holds the crevice and upholstery tools, you will be carrying the dusting brush in your pocket. Why they made the choice to not include a dusting brush or extension wand on a high end upright is beyond me, especially when they included a floor brush. If you want to use generic fit all tools, there are adapters available but they aren't as easy to find as adapters for other brands.

With regards to the floor brush and the rug/floor nozzle, when attached to the vacuum they will not allow the vacuum to stand up by itself without being leaned against something, that's REALLY ANNOYING they would design them like that. Also, online reviewers complain about the short hose and how tippy it is when using tools - you definitely need to hold onto the vacuum with one hand while using the tools with the other. If you use the hose a lot, I would definitely suggest getting the optional extension hose, especially if doing stairs or doing a lot of dusting.

Sure, the Sebo Felix is a great high end upright vacuum, and performs and filters well. However, I think most consumers looking for a new vacuum would be just as happy with a Shark. They clean just as well, filter better, and I think would be easier to live with on a daily basis. I also think most consumers would probably prefer a Shark with the DuoClean powerhead and soft front roller in the front to clean bare floors with, since they wouldn't have to stop and attach another attachment just to get the same results. Sure, the Shark wouldn't be the same quality as the Sebo, but when you consider that a Shark will last 7 to 8 years, costs 1/2 as much as the Sebo Felix, and you could buy 2 Shark uprights over the life of 1 Sebo, it's a dead heat. I will go as far to say that I wouldn't have bought my Sebo Felix if I hadn't gotten it for $100, if I had to pay more than $400 for it I would have passed.

Rob

 

[s2_82]

@kirbylux77

Thanks Rob,

I highly value your opinion as always and wanted to see what your thoughts were. Me personally, I like high end vacuums and that's pretty much all I use (I have 4 uprights) and also a Shark Rocket stick vacuum that I use mostly for quick pickup jobs around the house.

I don't have any canisters because I never really grew up using any and my parents never liked them either, so thats's why I figured the Felix would probablly be as close to a canister as possible all the while still being able to swap out floor heads (especially for bare floors) if that makes any sense.

You listed good points about the Felix. I definitely agree with everything you said; just like every vacuum, there are pros and cons to each one no matter how "perfect" it might seem. I also thought it blew really hot air after using it for a few minutes which I found to be odd, its probably the way it's designed and the way it redirects the air out of it's exhaust im not sure. The vacuum store guy even said it's completely normal.

Shark vacuums might be all that most consumers would ever want/need and fits many peoples'budgets but me personally I would never want one as a main vacuum to use. I already don't like dealing with messy/dirty filters and emptying out the dust container after every vacuuming as is. I would rather do a bag change every 2-3 months and be done with it. I also find their performance to be lacking but to each their own.

I don't understand how a bagless would filter better than a Sebo.. but yet then again I guess it's pretty obvious that S class definitely isn't nowhere near hepa standards. I was confused by that myself. My vacuum shop guy here told me that Sebo's filteration is "close" to Miele's.. but sounds like he isn't as informed as well as he thinks he is.

As far as the weight goes, I definitley found it more enjoyable to use and maneuver than the Miele U1 upright (remember that one?) which I found extremely cumbersome.


Thanks again for your insight!