Bagged or Bagless ?

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For goodness sakes, it's my opinion!

I don't want to spend money on bags. Have you ever cleaned up after a builder? They'll soon pop! I use hepa flow bags in my trusty Henry, and near enough every one has burst.

Buy yourself some talcum powder. Grab your 94 turbo 1000 and fit a new bag. Test the airflow. (put your finger in the tube so you can feel the air being drawn over it, rather than placing your hand over the nozzle and sealing the suction. Vacuum up the talcum powder. And test again. Listen to the motor pitch getting higher everything you vacuum up more powder. And then lastly, take of the bag door and look how bloated the bag has become, look at the inside of the bag door and see where all the dust has come through the bag onto the plastic.

If i use a bagged as a daily driver then it has to be a Kirby Miele. But again, bags are expensive!
 
How often do you wipe your cleaners down?

I don't need to because they don't leak and get caked in dust. Only my older cleaners sometimes need a wipe if I've not used them for a long time.

Like jmurray, I've always had bagged vacuums. As has both my parents and most people in my family. Aside from the odd Dyson, they all still do. I hate the dustclouds, having to empty it everytime I use the bloody thing and having to wash the filters out. It's messy and unhygienic. Add that to the fact that Dyson are the only efficient bagless vacuum and are stupidly overpriced and cheaply made, then I REALLY don't want one. It takes me months to fill a vacuum bag and I've never had any issues with the suction dropping on the Sebo or on the Henry. 1 pack of 10 bags will last over a year. Hardly an expense.
 
Have you ever cleaned up after a builder? They'll soon p

What the hell are you vacuuming up!?
I vacuumed my manky cellar out with Henry not so long back. The floor was covered in stones, dust, grit, mud etc and the bag was only half full.
 
My thoughts exactly Chris!

I've cleaned up all sorts (including mess left over from a builder) with my '94 Turbopower 1000 bagged and never has the bag burst or lost any suction.

And yes, I HAVE sucked up talcum powder when a whole bottle of it burst on the landing of our previous house and the Turbopower didn't loose any suction.
 
So it's not unhygenic for you run a vacuum with the same bag it for months having mould, bacteria,food particles and god knows what multiplying in your vacuum only to be nicely distrubuted around the house everytime you clean? I dont think so.

Henry is used when I'm cleaning for people who hve had building work done. Or the car. And he has just been helping me decorate. I have ordered him a cloth bag. Something else for me to put on the washer.

I really don't find dumping the dust that much of a problem.. Sure you come into contact with it when you do, but that is muck that was already in your home anyway? Isnt the whole point of cleaning to remove the dirt out of home?

I can understand why people don't like bagless. So what? I do. They work for brilliant for me. Ask the member of your family who own them. Dumping the dust, bulk and weight aren't an issue for me.

I agree, they are too expenisve. I rarely buy them new. And you can't argue with a 5 year warranty.
 
Funny that. Never loses suction? Then please be my guest to record the above instructions and post it on line.
 
Fine powder

Any vacuum will lose airflow with fine powders i once put down some baking soda and used my DC-17 to clean it up when i was finished i was curious and put the Baird meter on the dyson and it did not register (usually at 1.5/10) once the filter and cyclone assembly were washed and dried the power came back to it.
 
Mark40511

For killing suction?

My point was that IN MY EXPERIENCE I would prefer to use a dyson to clean an environment with this in,rather than a bagged machine.

I agree extremely fine dust shouldn't be vaccumed up but it can't always be helped..
 
"Ask the member of your family who own them."

I don't need to, because a couple of years ago my Grandfather bought a brand new Bagless Vax Upright cleaner and after a year he got rid of it and bought a bagged Miele cylinder cleaner because he was disgusted by the suction loss the Bagless had after only a couple of uses.

The Miele is still working perfectly with no suction loss by the way.
 
Mieles are good. But some of the bags do leak, they will lose some suction, and bags or Mieles are EXPENSIVE!!
 
Mieles are great.

But some of the bags do leak, they will lose some suction, and bags or Mieles are EXPENSIVE!!

What makes you think that bags don't lose suction? Ask anyone.
 
Baglessball...

I have to say, if you want bagless, Dyson is the way to go. The cyclone design is unrivalled IMO. It's certainly the most efficient bagless machine you can get.

HOWEVER

that doesn't mean I like it. I've said it before and I'll say it again. James Dyson knows NOTHING about vacuum cleaners. He is an engineer - a very good one. His cyclone design works very well. But a vacuum needs more than just suction. Hoover had it spot on with lower wattage, dirty fan motors and an effective brushroll. The Dyson brushroll is one of the worst I have ever seen - 2nd only to the brushroll in Hoover "The One" machines. The bristles are too far apart and not dense enough and that horrid helix brushroll does nothing but shred carpet fibres. Remember, the brushroll is not just for sweeping up bits - it's meant to groom the carpet pile to prolong the life of the carpet. The naff brushroll isn't helped by the floating head design of the cleaner either.

I've found the whole wand and hose assembly to be a complete pain the arse. I want my tools to be at hand when I need them - I don't want to have to stop mid-vacuum to get the hose out and have to take half the bloody thing apart just to get up a few crumbs by the skirting board. I've also found the tools to be cheap and break easily, although improvements have since been made (I actually quite like the click-fit tools)

Also, I've found the build quality to be absolutely appalling, especially in proportion to the price of the machine. When paying £200 plus for a vacuum, I expect robust plastic and metal parts, not something that feels like it's going to snap in half if I get a bit rough with it (that actually happened to my Gran's DC15 - snapped clean in 2 around the ball assembly).

Add all this to the fact that I don't like emptying the damn thing OR washing the filters out (which I've found to be way too messy and unhygienic, although the filters on the DC41 look like you can just chuck them in the washing machine. A vast improvement!) and you've got a vacuum I wouldn't ever want to own!

Dyson need to stop trying to "improve" on their cyclone design. It's already very efficient as it is and the filter set up on the DC41 looks drastically more acceptable. Now it's time to start focusing on everything else that's wrong with the bleedin' thing, starting with that horrible brushroll
 
Incidentally, my Grandparents have owned 5 Dysons since 1997. DC01, DC04, DC07, DC15 and a DC27. The DC01 never actually broke, but the suction dropped on it so much it didn't pick a thing up, despite regular filter changes. The DC04 and 07 both blew up and the 15 snapped in 2 and fell apart. The 27 is still in use, but now accompanied by a George, so it doesn't get used much anymore. I've used them all and none have impressed me for various reasons. A very good friend of mine has a DC26 Overdrive that's not bad, but testing at his house proved his Sebo X4 picks up more and the 26 leaves too much behind (though I'm presuming this is entirely due to the crap brushroll, as previously stated). I also owned a Dyson DC04 silverlime for a while and it was very average - nothing impressive about it.

Is it any wonder I stick to Sebo, Miele and Numatic for modern cleaners?
 
bag n bagless vacuum cleaners

hi. i hav got a hoover turbo power u 2194 my sister as a dc07i dyson year half old. she add new cream carpets down upstairs and onthe stairs the dyson add new filters in as well her carpets went dull when i use the turbo power on them they come back to life she was amazed what better job the turbo power did her mate all ways ues to take the mick cus i use a old cleaner an till she seen what a better job it did i do use gen bag s in it. and it add new motor in may. what iam get at his dysons are rubbish no matter which one you hav and bag cleaners are better thums up to the hoover turbo power 1 cant beat them

http://[email protected]
 
I know what you mean about Dysons - There ain't a single good thing about the tools or brush roll.

I want a cleaner that is 100% good, not 50%.
 
I noticed that Panasonic have gotten good recommendation from Which? for their MC-UL594 machine.

Mum got the next model up, the purple 596 for Christmas. I have tried it, and I'm actually rather impressed by it.

The brushroll has closely spaced clumps of short splayed bristles, so the carpet pile is effectively groomed. The brush vibrates the carpet very effectively, yet there are no beater bars. The pleated filter doesn't appear to be clogging; it has a manually operated flicker mechanism and a few taps on the side if the filter container dislodge the dust. Pre-filter not washable. Exhaust filter is a replaceable HEPA type.

The sound is powerful, yet quiet. The cat even tolerates the sound of the machine, so I presume that the ultrasonic whistling of other machines is not present in this one.

The Panasonic has a handle lock - hooray for handle locks!!! Nothing pisses me off more than trying to get the Dysons over thresholds between rooms, or avoiding rug fringes. Simply lower the handle and the nozzle pivots on the rear wheels, just like Ye Olde vacs of Yesteryear.

Manouvering is easy: 2 rear wheels and 2 decent sized rollers behind the brush nozzle soleplate. Auto height adjustment, so no carpet height control. Works even on the low profile kitchen carpet - I'm very impressed - The Vax Mach Air had to lose its front rollers to do the same task. The Panasonic is a heavy machine, so lifting it seems to be more a little more difficult than the Hoover Turbopower 3.

Tools are easy to use. The hose is stored in the style of the Electolux 600/Contour vacs. Scabbard long crevice tool stored inside extension tube. Crevice tool has two air holes, so the hose isn't tensioned to its contracted state. Additional extension tube supplied, plus a parquet floor brush. Hose handle on the MC-UL596 only, has an adjustable air-bleed hole to reduce suction.

Should the hose end become blocked, a safety suction release valve opens on the back of the machine, beside the data plate, allowing air directly into the motor chamber.

Dusting brush is the narrow type, as fitted to modern Panasonic uprights, but at least is usable (the Vax Mach Air multi-tool was not ergonomically designed).

Turbobrush has an extra litter-picker add-on strip for pet hair. Seems a little lacklustre, until I covered the four suction bleed holes on the neck shank, with my fingertips. Then it worked fine.

The plastic build quality is much better than some of the other machines. The flex is stored in the sensible style of the bagged Panasonics/Hoovers/Electroluxs: i.e. top hook and carrying handle. Flex is longer too, around 8 metres.

rolls_rapide++12-31-2011-15-44-16.jpg
 
I thought almost all Vacuum Cleaners had handle lock!?

I don't know how I'd survive without it, seeing as I have a few rugs to clean on a daily basis and don't fancy snapping belts every morning when the end of the rug gets tangled up in the brush roll.

The only cleaner that doesn't have a working handle lock is my Electrolux 502S. It did have the feature, but the notch has worn down now and it just goes straight to the floor when you try and lift the brush roll, so I have to either put the handle so low it literally touches the floor to get the brush roll to lift off the carpet a few CM, or click it into the upright position which gets annoying.

Oh well - The joys of owning vintage Vacuum Cleaners eh!?
 
Handle Lock

Dysons don't, neither does the Vax Mach Air - the Vax head in the storage position flops down when you lift it, now that it is a couple of years old. Other Vax models do have the handle lock.

The Sebo X4 uprights do - but it is switchable, slide it one way for traditional handle lock positions, slide it the other for lockless travel (dyson style).
 
Quite a few people that I have spoken to, find the omission of the handle lock on the Dysons annoying. Most of them have a need to navigate over different levels of floor coverings, mats, and such like.

I don't know what the hell Dyson was thinking of. Apparently the Miele S7 upright also lacks a handle lock, but I can't be sure of that, as I've never seen one close up.

Regarding the Dysons: I find that they have quite few poorly though out ideas:
I don't like the Dyson wand-handle contraption - give me the Electrolux/Hoover/Panasonic hose handle any day.

The Dyson bent crevice tool is a joke. I much prefer Hoover and Panasonic long crevice tools. The Dyson flexi-crevice tool annoys me too, it is just over-engineered.

The Electrolux 2-in-1 dusting brush (1980s) was plush, effective and a joy to use. Any dusting brush now is awful, small and with short, scratchy bristles - horrible, horrible things. Some of them are part of these 3-in-1 tools that have no ergonomic design at all, so you have to hold the tool as if you were about to stir cement.
 
I totally agree about the 2-In-1 Electrolux tool - It is fantastic!

The brush has lots of bristles, and they are soft!

The bristles on the brush tool for my 2007 NUMATIC Henry are very, very hard and I'm afraid to use it!

My Turbopower's brush bristles are harder than the Luxes, but not so hard I cringe when running it over a nice piece of wood furniture.
 
One of the Electrolux dusting brushes I used, can't remember if it was the 550 or the 612, had a soft rubber cone inside the ring of bristles (the other one never had this). This helped to keep the bristles from entering the suction hole, and also provided a soft bumper should the brush be pressed too close to hard furnishings.

Nowadays, there is only a hard plastic sheath that is almost the same length as the bristles. Look at this Hoover one.

rolls_rapide++12-31-2011-18-55-9.jpg
 

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