"Automatic" brush height adjustment

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oliveoiltinfoil

oliveoiltinfoil

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Joined
Feb 15, 2014
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Hello everyone. Newbie here! Looks like a nice forum with decent people.

One of my first topics I want to bring up is manufactures who make upright claiming to have "automatic" head height adjustment, or "suitable for all floors". There are a few upright out there which genuinely do automatically adjust the head depending on the floor type, for example the sebo X series uprights and the miele s7 with spring loaded brush roll, oh and the dyson dc41. But manufactures like Vax, Bissell and AEG/Electrolux say their do as well when all it is, is a fixed brush bar. False advertising ? It's silly really and its amazing some people believe it.

Anyways? Opinions?
 
Those vacuum brands are greedy, and just want your money if they are falsely advertising auto adjustment to lure in consumers when all they have a fixed brush bar. I don't know any Bissell that advertises auto adjustment, but here's one I found on Amazon in the link below.

Here's some false advertising I read about yesterday: You may know about the Dyson DC33 "Multi-floor." I have read many reviews on Amazon that say this vacuum has a loud grinding noise from the clutch when cleaning certain carpets, like thicker pile carpets for example. These people contacted Dyson customer care, and Dyson customer care says that if the Dyson DC33 makes a grinding noise, that means the vacuum isn't suitable for your carpet. Calling it a "multi-floor" vacuum is false advertising if it's unable to go on different types of carpet.

http://www.amazon.com/BISSELL-PROli...ds=bissell+vacuum+automatic+height+adjustment
 
As an Amazon Associate we earn from qualifying purchases.
It is an interesting question.

It makes sense to offer the user a manual front end height adjustment on uprights and power nozzles. That being said, some of the best Hoover and Eureka power nozzles did not have any way of adjusting the height and yet they performed with excellence on all kinds of carpet.

Though you need to bend down to adjust manual height adjusters, I prefer them to electronically-activated mechanisms as they are less repair-prone. Some here at Vacuumland report that electrically-activated height adjusters don't make proper contact with the carpet nap. So I prefer manual mechanisms.

My big complaint about height adjusters on vacs is that some of them offer a "bare floor" setting which does not shut off the brush roll. To me, having a spinning brush roll touch a bare floor could easily scratch that floor.
 
In the U.S. "auto" height adjustment has tended to mean spring-loaded back wheels. The front end of the head is designed to rise and fall based on the movement of the back wheels up or down. These "shocks" cause the nozzle tip to rise and fall sinking into the carpet or up higher depending on flooring. These work well, but I still would say that manually forcing the head into the carpet would be better. The "springy" action of the "shocks" doesn't hold the head down as a manual click-lock force would.
 
Manual height adjustment

I agree that manual height adjustment is the only way to go. But not all vacuums with manual height adjustment require you to bend down to make an adjustment. The Kirby is one of the few that you can adjust with a touch of your toe and it has 7 height levels to choose from. Some all metal Royal vacs also have touch toe height adjustment. Both of these vacs force the nozzle down to the carpet allowing for perfect height adjustment every time.

[this post was last edited: 2/16/2014-15:41]
 
The only machine to have true "automatic" height adjustment is the Sebo X series. The springs that load the brush on the Miele S7 are that stiff, I cant see how the brush would be able to move against them. Other vacs like the Panasonic and older Dysons simply use a "floating head" which just rides under its own weight over  the carpet pile. The same happens on the Vax Mach Air, which floats over the carpet.  Manual height adjust is better than floating heads really, especially when the vac is used on hard floors like lino to avoid the brushes damaging the lino surface. It also enables a vac to be pushed easier over thicker pile carpet.
 
Thanks for the replies. Looking beyond what these do, or don't do for vacuums, it is misleading advertising. I probably should have said manufactures who claim to have "suitable for all floors", when it is a fixed height and no on/off for the brushroll.

Yeah, I don't know much about kirbys, only that they are considered by many as the panicle of vacuum performance. I would imagine sebo's get pretty close. I agree that the X series automatics are true "automatic" height adjustment, but I prefer my felix with manual adjustment.
 
Auto adjusting isn't misleading advertising.

Some brands have made it confusing by suggesting that auto adjustment means the upright automatically adjusts to the "correct" floor height; other brands suggest that it does away with a manual dial.

In reality, auto adjustment eliminates "one less thing" to go wrong, but don't forget a lot of uprights now also have a static brush or rubber strip fitted to guide dirt along.

Deep vacuums like Oreck that don't have a dial and "fixed" height have deeper, bushier brush rolls to cope with getting deep into the dirt in the carpet.

I can tell you now that a Kirby will clean up better than SEBO only because the Kirby is a dirty fan vac compared to SEBO that is clean air. It doesn't just come down to the design of the brush roll or whether the vacuum has auto adjustment or not - as some members have reported on here already - the SEBO auto adjustment doesn't go low enough for some carpet pile.
 
Steve, the S7's automatic Height adjustment does work. Yes, the springs are a little stiff, but considering how fast the RPM is and the powerful force of the S7's beater brush beating the carpet, the brush should change to the correct height for certain carpet heights while the springs go under pressure. Also, the springs are stiff so that the springs can force down the beater brush to dig deeper into the carpet at a changed brush height. It does a great job on all my 1.5cm tall wall-to-wall carpeting.
 
Oh yeah I know the X series auto height adjustment just skimps over the surface. That's why the professional G series range has a manual adjustment, makes you wonder what sebo thinks does a better job.
 
I really do prefer manual height adjustment, generally. I may have a Miele S7, but the spring loaded height adjuster that adjusts to all varying heights correctly is interesting and makes sense to me (as I explained on my last reply here). I don't really go for vacuums with an auto height adjuster like the X4's because, like you said Ollie, it may adjust wrong. I do like the Sebo Essential G or Sebo 370 just because they have manual adjustment. To be honest, I do miss having a vacuum with manual height adjustment just because I like traditional vacuums like that. I may look into one of the Sebos I mentioned.
 
EurekaPrince said it all the way!!

I could not agree more with EurekaPrince in Reply 2!

To the user the Automatic Carpet Height Adjustment means that they don't have to do any manual setting whatsoever and the unit will be able to glide smoothly over all surfaces with no adjustment. The Sebo has gone further with having a computer sensor gauge where the resistance of the brush hitting on the carpet is sensed and adjust the head based on that setting. However, many users including myself have found that setting doesn't groom and deep clean well enough.

I don't consider false advertising if its something I as a user don't have to make any adjustments to. Now with machines market as Bare floor cleaning, many have a squeegee or brush on bottom to push debris into agitator path but machines with no brush roll shut off could do very serious damage to floors, example: Hoover Windtunnel. Some others like many Orecks do an ok job on many hard surface flooring.

I for one don't like the idea of ANY revolving brush on hard surfaces for the following reasons:
Marred finish on Hardwood and Laminate
Scratch marks and possible broken rug guards on base plate
Some wheels not gliding smoothly
Loose dirt scattered away and not caught by airflow
Airflow not strong enough to concentrate into grooves, or grout
Agitator bristles worn down drastically due to sand paper like effect especially on tile and concrete surfaces or thresholds.
Missing fine coating of dust and sand that a soft horsehair stationary brush would gently sweep away.
 
I still think it is slightly wrong that some of them put "auto height adjustment" when there is no adjustment in the brush bar height at all. To say something I automatic means it does it for you. It is kind of superficial. What is more of a question like some of you pointed out is "suitable for all floors". Probably should have put that, but the two are linked in a way. I think I remember getting a vax around 7 years ago which said it was suitable for alt types of floors, but in the instructions booklet on the front page, it said "cleaner may cause damage to certain bare floor types. Vax is not responsible for damaged surfaces" or something along those lines.
 
Oooohh somebody DARED to mention the Sebo X series, how dare they!

Alex, I don't know why you bother reading threads where you know the Automatic X is going to get a mention and I doubley have no idea why you both repeating your dislike over and over again and continuing to post about them with nothing constructive or relevant to contribute.

You don't like them - we get it. Play a new record, please?

Ollie, welcome to the forum! With regards to auto height adjustment, Ryan (Sebo_Fan) has pretty much hit the nail on the head with the floating head stuff. I can kind of understand it being branded as auto height adjustment. As much as you're right in that the brushroll doesn't move, the cleaner head does as it's connected on a pivot point with floating rear wheels which angles the cleaner head to the carpet, in a similar way to the height adjustment on the Hoover Senior. The only true automatic adjustment machine is, as Ryan pointed out, the Sebo Automatic X. I've always found that the auto height adjustment does a fantastic job and a recent thread I posted clearly shows the improvement in performance between automatic height adjustment and floating heads (link below - no need to argue, Alex, you've already done that in the other thread :P).

Having said that, I wouldn't want to use any upright on bare floors - that's really where cylinders come into their own.

I would say that manual height adjustment cleaners with a hard floor setting are totally useless.

http://www.vacuumland.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?23791_140~1
 
"only true automatic adjustment machine is, as Ryan pointed out, the Sebo Automatic X. I've always found that the auto height adjustment does a fantastic job"


 


...But it doesn't, all that dirt it picked up after the Panasonic, a Contour could of done that, little wonder anyway, those Panasonic's don't even touch the carpet at the best of times! You have to lean the handle back really far for it to dig in nicely.


 


Chris, I think you just don't like the fact that I am right.
 
The term "automatic" ...

... is derived from the Greek word "automatos", meaning "self-moving" or "self-thinking".

For something to be truly "automatic", the object in question must be engaging in some sort of *action*.

A stationary brush roll on a power nozzle with fixed wheels that's appropriate for all floor surfaces isn't engaging in any *action*, therefore it can't be described as having an "automatic" adjust.

And calling it a "self-adjust" is blatantly worse, as there's no "adjusting" going on in the first place.
 
I think you just don't like the fact that I am right

No, Alex, I don't like the fact that you feel the need to shove your opinion down everybody's throat everytime somebody even mentions a Sebo Automatic X because you THINK you're right. You're quite obviously not right because opinion is totally subjective and for every person who doesn't like the Automatic X, there will be another that does.

I don't like Dyson's, but I don't go about commenting on every single post about them annoucing the fact that I don't like them and giving the same reasons why OVER and OVER and OVER again. I don't have anything remotely constructive to say about Dysons, so I just don't say anything about them.

You don't like the X, we know, you've told us all a thousand times and it's getting old. You're not even constructive with it, you're just plain rude about it.

"Whenever I hear "Automatic X series" I hear screaming down my ears using one of those can near enough make my blood boil."

...What's wrong with a simple "I'm not a fan of the X series, personally".

This thread is NOT going to become another Sebo-bashing outlet for you - we already have that for the world to read in the thread I linked to, so please do us all a favour and keep it in that thread, not this one.
 
A stationary brushroll isn't engaging in any *action*

Whilst that's true that the brushroll is not, the cleaner head is moving and therefore engaging in action.

Like on the Panasonic's here and the US models with the floating rear wheels, the cleaner head will be at a different height for different surfaces. And it pivots, therefore it is self-moving. Same with Dyson uprights, although the front of the cleaner head pivots, rather than the rear wheels.
 
Hoover!!!

Had automatic height adjustment in 1936 on the 150...and no one has yet made one that worked as good in my opinion!And the thing is...it works on plush carpets that had not been invented yet!!!
 
You're missing the point ...

"Whilst that's true that the brushroll is not, the cleaner head is moving and therefore engaging in action."

Not in terms of the brushroll "adjusting" itself in relation to the carpet surface.

You could take your argument to absurd lengths, saying that *everything* is "engaging in action" because the earth is spinning.
 
*everything* is "engaging in action" because the ear

Well, no, because we're not discussing the earth moving, we're discussing the cleaning moving to adjust to different floortypes.

Whilst the brushroll isn't moving, the cleaner head IS. No manufacturer has claimed "automatic brushroll adjustment", in which case you'd be absolutely spot on. But as I'm sure you know, the brushroll doesn't necessarily have to move.

The Hoover Senior/Convertible height adjustment works by adjusting the rear wheels, thus angling the floorhead in a particularly position. The floating head design of automatic height adjustment does the same thing, but replaces the height adjustment with a pivoting floorhead and floating rear wheels, so there is very much still an "action" occuring - the pivoting of the floorhead and the constant movement of the rear wheels (not just round and round like normal, but actually moving position) is still an action, thus making it "automatic".

And I'm not saying that the action of moving the cleaner back and forth across the carpet is an action either(I mean, it is, but not one relevant to this particular discussion), I'm talking about the floorhead actually moving and adjusting as a result of the surface, without the user having to make any manual adjustments.
 
I've held off until more replies came into this subject - you are ALL forgetting one vital thing where auto adjustment is concerned (and that concerns ALL uprights).

Carpets are porous compared to hard floors.

Thus air sits between the carpet pile and the suction caused by the vacuum from the brush roll.
If it was the case that carpet wasn't porous, you wouldn't require a beater bar or a moving brush to beat dirt out as it would all sit at the top surface, ready to be collected.

Thus, not all conventional uprights with "auto adjustment" deliver poor performance. There's a bit more to the eye where pick up is concerned and from what I have observed.

There are auto types like the Dyson DCO1 and (countless others that have followed suit) with the "handle angle user adjustable" floor head style where the owner will stoop or stand up straight with the upright to get the ideal cleaning angle that automatically pivots the floor head onto the carpet. The more you stoop with the DC01, the more the floor head will drop further down onto a carpet - same with the Panasonic bagged uprights.

However other "auto adjusting" models like the Vax Mach Air don't have the hinged floor head where the user's angle of placement of holding the vacuum doesn't determine the floor head height. Morphy Richards Clarity/Shark Navigator doesn't have it either.

As for the manual height adjusters - the best ones I've ever found have been on the Hoover Convertible/Senior/Ranger or the Junior - nothing else seems to be that well made - or so conveniently located.

Alex - literally using a TP1 hurts my ears and I'm surprised they don't annoy your neighbours each time you use one. Yes, A 4-height adjuster is good - if it works and if it remains intact. Sadly in my hands I seemed to have broken more Hoover Turbopower 1 height adjustment knobs far more times than I care to remember. Everything past the handle just seemed so brittle on that model.
 
Chris, there are probably more people that don't like the X series than the ones that do, it is not my opinion that the Sebo skims the carpet IT DOES, fact!! Watch Rogers X5 video from floor level it is practically hovering over the carpet.


How is it not appropriate to bring the X range into it...Have you not read the title?
 
Whenever Sebo is mentioned all you ever have is something negative to say about the ageing 20-30 year old Turbopowers. They are noisy, yes but they don't scream and plus it is irrelevent they are dirty fan.
 
Well I did refer to the manual height adjuster on the TP1 Alex - a little detail you've failed to notice.

The term and the post is down to current vacuums, surely, Alex?

This post was, after all created in the contemporary forum, so why mention the Electrolux Contour?

Your Contour is no longer made, quelle surprise. I've had two - not easy to push, not easy to use on carpets in general.

Funny how I found the much heavier Hoover Senior easier to push than the awful plastic Contour - but then I think it points down to metal base quality and far bigger wheels with a more comfortable design.

Oh no I can't mention that - the Senior isn't made any more - but wait - there's far more of them on EBAY than the crusty old Contour.
 
I mentioned the Contour because they are not that great really with a sparse soft brush, brushroll and whimpy suction, the 600W models, that is. So I said that even a Contour would of picked up what the Sebo did after the ill designed Panasonic pivoting cleaning head...Meaning the Sebo X wasn't that great, it isn't the Sebo it's self, it is that silly computer that makes it not as good as it could be. (In my opinion!!)


Now I will agree that the Contour can be difficult to push and likewise the 600 series but a bit of furniture polish on the wheel shaft and sole plate can help do the trick.


Also, I did see the part about the TP1 height adgustment, I noticed you said that you said it often broke, well I haven't had that issue, although, I am not rough with any of my cleaners so perhaps that is down to man handling...


 


I do love the Juniors and Seniors dearly and of course where better built than the heap of plastic which came out in the 80's but they can be quite impractical for hose use and picking up such things as rice and little stones off of shoes.
 

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