Whew! I am not the only one that likes Miele vacuums!

[sarasvacshack]

Lots of negative comments regarding Miele vacuums from a few collectors/dealers here in vacuumland, but it is interesting to see how consumers view the line.



http://money.msn.com/business-news/...=20130313&ID=16229592&industry=IND_MEDIA&isub

 

[turbo500]

You're certainly not the only one who likes Miele vacuums. I think they're fantastic and probably the best cylinder on the market, certainly in Europe anyway.

 

[sebo_fan]

Reports are misleading though against actual use.

I don't think there's a perfect brand in my experience but they are near perfect models depending on what takes your fancy. I don't dislike Miele - I wouldn't have bought five of their machines and over the years some of my reviews have been good for the brand. However, when it comes to ownership nothing is perfect and like an expensive to buy car or an expensive piece of jewellery you buy, even the best care can sometimes go against the design or the promise.

Which UK which is probably more Miele-biased orientated than any other brand still maintain that Miele is number 1 for their canister reliability against SEBO being number 1 for their uprights. The data may well be collected from various sources but it all points to Miele in the UK for many years not producing a comparatively similar upright vacuum that could have beaten SEBO - certainly as a brand, Miele are well known compared to SEBO who only produce vacuums and though I've never heard it personally, a lot of people claim that Miele apparently thought the SEBO X machines were so good, they wouldn't be able to produce a model as good.

They could well have launched the same Panasonic U.S based uprights in the UK though but they chose not to - I think that was a bad decision as the Panasonic uprights we got had none of the features that the U.S were lucky to have like auto cord rewind, suction control and a dirt searcher light (okay, maybe 10 years prior buying the older models) - Panasonic's own machines were (and still are) more basic with the older design of 2 drive belts requiring to be replaced as well as some less well thought out design points. I'm happier that my new Panasonic doesn't have 2 belts to replace though but I'm more disappointed to find that the U.S equivalent comes with a brush roll on/off function whereas the UK version doesn't.

The Miele S7 is very good in so many respects - it's just a pity that its too damn big and bulky - in my opinion and experience. The Alternative Stick vac isn't a proper upright in my eyes and it was very short lived in the UK. Had the UK version come originally with a power nozzle and my mind about that machine would have possibly been very different!

The report link you've shown illustrates a lot of unusual findings taking into consideration of brands that are under different companies and for the most part, how the summaries of info were collected when the report was done. Dyson in the UK for example, are rated average for reliability by Which UK. Which? sometimes gets it wrong - they rated Numatic Henry as average and the intro to the SEBO D series as having no bag indicator, clearly located behind the hose mount on top of the machine!

One has to bear in mind a few things regarding this report - the U.S were only introduced to Dyson's products at a time when Dyson design was far better than the DC01, DC02 series that the UK got; therefore no wonder their reliability is better.

Secondly, the other brands that are lower down in the table that suggest poor reliability such as Dirt Devil is a bit misleading for most owners who now have TTI Hoover appliances (and now Vax UK) who are all made under the same umbrella companies. What models for example were found to be unreliable from Dirt Devil - or let alone any other company and their selective models and was the data from Dirt Devil BEFORE TTI took over, thus outlining the separate older designs that Hoover did not share at that point?

 

[luxlife]

I think Mieles are best appreciated by Americans who are willing to look at vacuums differently. We're accustomed to using Kenmores with their 7 foot hoses, Electroluxes with their full size dusting brushes and I won't even say anything about cord length. Mieles are different, no doubt about it. Every piece and attachment of my Capricorn looks and feels as if they were designed with intent and not assembled with aftermarket components. (Alas, I do miss the full sized dusting brush.)

 

[sebo_fan]

End of the day, its probably just a question of choice. Certainly if the UK had the luck of Aerus on our shelves I'd probably say Miele would have a direct rival. Sadly we don't have that option. The closest to Aerus are the Chinese made Electrolux models we get and they are far and aware from the world of performance that Miele give as well as perceived quality.

 

[georgect]

Yet another survey I wasn't included in

Ohhhhh come on, JD Power & Associates must be off their rocker.

I always thought they were shady.

They didn't even include high end vacuums like Aerus Electrolux, Filter Queen, Rainbow, TriStar etc.

And Riccar made the upright segment but not the canister segment...how come?

I don't buy this for a second.

FLAWED...I tell ya, that survey is flawed.

 

[vintagerepairer]

I still think Miele are one of the better brands of vacuum cleaners, but the quality is nothing at all like it used to be. It seems to me they have kept their quality above that of most others, but it's still only a percentage of what it was, proving if you will what I have often said, which is that a high-quality product only has to be the best in the field; it does not have to be the best it can be.

Of course, the relative retail price has dropped as time has progressed, and this does at least go some way to make up for the decline in quality, but it is not the answer for the type of consumer who is happy to pay the price for a product of supreme quality. As I understand it, Meile whitegoods continue to be of the quality of which they are famous for.

 

[electromatik]

Definitely not alone...

They are desirable machines. Thier filtration alone should make them worthy of consideration and make competitors take note. My flaws with them are quibbles and you can quibble any machine.

 

[sebo_fan]

Miele's changing prices and re-releasing old models.

Case in point - for years the old S380 and S381 was the basic starter cylinder vac before the S2 came along. The S4 sat above it in terms of price because if was smaller and lighter. I had both, firstly the pastel blue S380 and eventually the S381 - both cost £99 at Comet and Currys. The S4 was next model upwards, costing £149 and upwards before the S5 range. Now that effectively the S6 has taken over the S4 (and prices range from the obligatory £149,) Miele have re-released the S380/S381 at a cost of £199!

Currys are selling old bodies in the form of the S700 series but priced it at a jaw dropping £199! Now several months later the price has dropped to £149

Based on the fact that the S6 is closer to £200 and they're still selling the excellent S4212 at £149 makes no difference - both use the same FJM bag that the much heavier S700 uses and about the only difference is the choice of floor heads, the comfort auto rewind on the S6 and the much lighter weight and plastics that both the S4 and S6 offer. Still, for some at least one could argue that the old box S700 is still around - but I'd never spend so much on the older models when the newer ones offer better features and far lighter to cart around.



http://www.currys.co.uk/gbuk/miele-cylinder-vacuum-cleaners/337_3169_30257_2005_xx/xx-criteria.html

 

[thermokid]

I Love my Miele Capricorn

BUT, I will probably never use it again after I got my new Aerus Lux Gaurdian Platinum...... Dan

 

[sebo_fan]

Dan, is the Aerus lighter, heavier or similar by the body weight of the main machine before the hose?

 

[turbo500]

Sorry Ryan, but I have to bring up your Panasonic point made earlier.

From the launch of the 50 series in 1992, the higher end Panasonic's all had variable power, electronic controls with LED displays, headlights, cord rewind and beater bar on/off switches. From the launch of the 400 and 500 series in 1995, ALL Panasonic uprights had beater bar on/off with the mid and high end 400 series having variable power and the mid and high end 500 series all having variable power, cord rewind and (in the case of the TOL model) a headlight.


 


The TOL of the re-designed 500 series that appeared in 1998 and the TOL Icon from 1999 both had the dirt sensor. 


 


None of these cleaners had the 2 belt system. 


 


The only cleaners not to feature these were the post-2007 models when production was moved to China.  That was when the 1700 - 1900w cleaners that we have now first appeared and although these have acceptable performance, they're not a patch on the earlier machines. 


 


I suspect Miele never used the Panasonic upright rebrands in the UK/Europe because Panasonic were still selling thousands of them anyway. In the early 90's and again in the 2000's with the MC-E468 machine, Panasonic were the best selling upright in the UK. Why would Panasonic make these cleaners for Miele when they were doing a pretty good job of selling them anyway? It was a different story in the US, where the European style Panasonic's were never sold (apart from under the Miele name)

 

[sebo_fan]

Okay Chris, time to learn.


 


 


<p class="p1">I referred to the same Panasonic uprights that Miele produced - the Powerhouse range, S171 up to S184 and they are based on the Panasonic MCE 464, MCE 468 and MCE 469 ( released and sold in the UK 2002/ 2003)</p>
<p class="p2"> </p>
<p class="p1">If you read my post you'll see that I said "10 years prior or so," and in the right context going back to 2003, yours truly had the MCE 3001 white bagged upright in 2005, two years after AND that one had those horrid double belts as well as being basic and sparse. My point is that Miele had the upper hand when Panasonic had changed over to the larger motor capacity AND 2 drive belt uprights much later in life, because Miele were still selling their single belt driven high spec Powerhouse uprights right up until 2011! </p>
<p class="p2"> </p>
<p class="p1">FYI the following vacs from Panasonic have double belts with launch years:</p>
<p class="p2"> </p>
<p class="p1">Panasonic MCE 3001 2005</p>
<p class="p1">Panasonic MCE 4001 2005</p>
<p class="p1">Panasonic MCE 4003 2003</p>
<p class="p1">Panasonic MCE 4011 2005</p>
<p class="p1">Panasonic MCE 4013 2004</p>
<p class="p1">Panasonic MCE 3002 2007</p>
<p class="p1">Panasonic MCE 3011 2006</p>
<p class="p2"> </p>
<p class="p1">The point I'm making is that right up until 2011, Panasonic were continually churning out the basic versions in the UK when Miele had the upper hand for more premium features; one can't deny that if there is any brand that springs to mind for fitting the earliest example in the UK of a modern hard box upright brush roll on/off function, it would be Panasonic - but the brand ignored this and stopped the production of that feature, allowing it to pop up years later as a "new" advancement for the bagless upright brands to brag about. Panasonic weren't losing money either - they were still busy churning out motors for Dyson or Bosch as well as developing small canister vacuums with Bosch to cut production costs.</p>
<p class="p1"> </p>
<p class="p1">Therefore I don't think it would have harmed Panasonic at all if Miele had brought their U.S vacuums here. But I know why Miele didn't bring the Powerhouse range here as I had written to Miele UK about them- it wasn't a question of money, it was a question of the lack of perceived quality against Miele's other products at the time AND secondly public perception of the brand. Lets not forget Miele and so many other brands have only been online in the last couple of years - past Miele recognition was either stemmed from word of mouth or Which?UK testing where Miele could present the awards they had won in the past and bring them to light to a much bigger audience for product saturation, recognition and approval. Miele in Germany didn't feel that the Miele Powerhouse uprights were as well made as the rest of the Miele family.</p>
<p class="p2"> </p>
<p class="p1">The best selling tag however doesn't wash with me - not when Hoover use the same tag to describe their Purepower uprights as well as other brands.</p>
 

 

[turbo500]

Ryan, that white Miele is a re-badge of the TOL Panasonic MC-E452, from 1995. This cleaner was part of the original 400 series launched in the UK in 95 and featured the same features as the Miele. Both cleaners were made in Spain. The 1700w Panasonic pictured above is from 2007 and was made in China. 


 


All the cleaners branded as Miele were on sale at some point or other in the UK. 


 


The Purepower is currently the best selling bagged upright in the UK - not surprising as people still think of the Hoover name as being quality and they're pretty cheap. 

 

[sebo_fan]

No but you are missing the point Chris - its not a question of whether these Panasonics were on sale "at any point in the UK"- its the fact that whilst Miele had the vacuums up until 2011, the UK market made do with the more basic versions and less practical given that the Miele models made do with a single drive belt as well. Miele would have had interested buyers for the fact that they had better/convenient features and a far more purposeful upright than the "stick vac" that Miele only offered to UK buyers.


 


Also there is very little data to actually support "the best selling" tag  - where did you find that personal statement? Its on Hoover's website of course but there is no actual sales percentage shown that supports that as well as other brands as well and it is a three pronged attack to the buyer's awareness. (Hoover actually do themselves a disservice on their site using www.reevoo.com as a review site to support their model's use as some reports are desperately negative.)


 


Firstly, Unless you request sales reports every year from each brand and then tally up the amounts sold and produced, it is nigh impossible to believe the statement. Which UK do produce good results though - although I don't believe that they have always produced fair test results with their Miele vacuums, with some models citing poorer performance just because of the filter type on board or choice of floor head. One can see that when you sign up to their company and read their reports.


 


Secondly "The best selling" tag is a pure and simple USP tag that brands use to promote their products - and Hoover doesn't have the best reliability around if you believe Which and read their statistics- or for the fact that the company itself has only offered ONE bagged upright range, concentrating on the cheaper bagless cyclonic design. The Purepower is far from a good quality vacuum  - the adjuster dial and the release handle pedal are two of the more common faults to break early on I've seen in countless reviews from owners. I've also had Purepower uprights and I found out the hard way! So my knowledge stems from experience and ownership. Where it does fight well is on price and for the fact that, being Hoover means spares, bags and filters are plentiful on a national scale.


 


Thirdly, the brand name "Hoover" in the UK has always been popular. Even Dyson, Miele and other brands that are posted on auction sites are wrongly tagged with the "hoover" name because the UK have always used the "Hoover" name to describe a vacuum cleaner. Thus, UK buyers are always loyal to the point of going with what their family had or going with a name that they feel stands up well to create the illusion of the perfect vacuum cleaner. As well all know, despite Hoover Europe's efforts - the company just isn't what it was when the American company owned it. That's the true sadness of the brand. 

 

[turbo500]

its the fact that whilst Miele had the vacuums up until 20

Well, I'd imagine the more basic versions on sale in the UK now, being made in China and with less features, will be cheaper to manufacture and sell for the same price. I don't think Panasonic has any vacuum production left in Spain since the Miele deal ended. The cheaper manufacturing has meant that Panasonic can concentrate on producing more cleaners, so it's not entirely wasted

 

[sebo_fan]

No, its not entirely wasted but as with all major brands, its been left to brands like Sebo and Miele to bring in high end high price bagged uprights compared to Panasonic, Electrolux and Hoover who used to supply more than one model line up and who also used to fit more features than very little you will find now. Brush roll on/off, variable suction and even dirt searcher LAMPS have been fitted to the cyclonic uprights or Miele. Bagged uprights have thus whittled down to just a few now but Miele could have had a good market at the time and had a proper full size upright to offer before the S7 came in. 


 


By the way the new Panasonic MC UG522 I bought recently is made in Mexico. 


 

 

[sebo_fan]

Bye Bye Sebo, Hello Miele.

So yesterday, there I was yaking away to a friend of mine who has moved into a new house near mine and talking about vacuums and general appliances. She has a Miele S5 Red Pearl vacuum that she feels is too heavy for the smaller home and along with the turbo brush head, it had the old style Miele S571 suction floor head - the type where the central part pivots up and down - the one of few Miele suction heads I adore. I allowed her to test drive my Sebo K1 Komfort and a swap was duly done and dusted!

Bye bye K1 Komfort - hello S5 Red Pearl. I've always liked the S5 but the red pearl one reminds me of my slightly lighter red S381 I had for many wonderful years before selling it on (and regretting). No more putting up with the lousy external tool storers anymore! She bought it brand new in 2008 and its been well cared for. Apart from a stinky hose (I replaced it with a spare S4212 one I have with the 3 part tool storer nibs on them.) everything else has been well looked after.

Tsk to any one who thinks I hate Miele vacuums!

 

[richardc1983]

http://www.panasonic.co.uk/html/en_.../Upright/MC-UG302/Overview/5075735/index.html

My brother has just bought one of these from argos as a replacement for a morphy richards.