An example of how the mighty have fallen. Tacony used to make excellent vacuum cleaners like the Riccar 8850, 8955, R20 Vibrance, Simplicity Freedom, Riccar Pristine etc. Nowadays, they make HORRIBLE Chinese-made vacuums that are POORLY-MADE, OVERPRICED, POORLY-DESIGNED, and POORLY-PERFORMING. The Riccar R25 in my opinion is a TERRIBLE downgrade from the R20 Vibrance. It has terrible performance for a mid-priced vacuum cleaner. Any person that does vacuum performance tests will show you that the R25 has ATROCIOUS suction and airflow. They also turned Simplicity into a company that makes Dirt Devil look like a high-end brand. The only good modern vacuum cleaner I like from Tacony is the Riccar SupraLite, all the other machines that Tacony produces today are OVERPRICED Chinese garbage.
Why Tacony SUCKS nowadays.
- Thread starter ajr2993
- Start date
You may not like it, but customers do..
Let me note first that I'm just as disappointed that they moved production of the unit to China as you are. I don't own any modern vacuums I'll cling to my vintage Eurekas, Hoovers and Electroluxes.
I worked at a Riccar and Miele dealer and for a while we had both the R25 and Vibrance series side by side on the floor until the last of the Vibrances sold and that took quite some time. I had my own skepticism of these new machines and even noted that to the potential buyers and still three to one they bought the new R25 models over the older style machines. They might not have quite the same performance however it is more than adequate for most people. What sells the customers is that it is a modern two motor design with simple switch to turn the brushroll off, not some complicated clutch arrangement that hasn't always been so reliable, lifetime belt, too. The tools and wand are especially easy to pull out and use, especially compared to the older VIBDL.2 model, and all wheels are non-marring rubber. The bags are also far more consumer friendly to change
What Tacony did with these units is to look at what Shark did right to get such a marketshare, all these features are something that Shark was the first to bring to the mid-price field. Like it or not, these vacuums have features customers want.
One more note, they frankly haven't had any more issues than the older models, they are far more reliable than the Tandem Air machines. Will they last forever? No, but they will outlast most anything else at that price-point and they have full parts support too.
Let me note first that I'm just as disappointed that they moved production of the unit to China as you are. I don't own any modern vacuums I'll cling to my vintage Eurekas, Hoovers and Electroluxes.
I worked at a Riccar and Miele dealer and for a while we had both the R25 and Vibrance series side by side on the floor until the last of the Vibrances sold and that took quite some time. I had my own skepticism of these new machines and even noted that to the potential buyers and still three to one they bought the new R25 models over the older style machines. They might not have quite the same performance however it is more than adequate for most people. What sells the customers is that it is a modern two motor design with simple switch to turn the brushroll off, not some complicated clutch arrangement that hasn't always been so reliable, lifetime belt, too. The tools and wand are especially easy to pull out and use, especially compared to the older VIBDL.2 model, and all wheels are non-marring rubber. The bags are also far more consumer friendly to change
What Tacony did with these units is to look at what Shark did right to get such a marketshare, all these features are something that Shark was the first to bring to the mid-price field. Like it or not, these vacuums have features customers want.
One more note, they frankly haven't had any more issues than the older models, they are far more reliable than the Tandem Air machines. Will they last forever? No, but they will outlast most anything else at that price-point and they have full parts support too.
Did Shark really get it right???
I’m not being sarcastic, just curious about a vacuum professional’s point of view instead of a collector’s opinion. My housekeeper uses her Shark when she cleans my house and I’ve noticed that she seems to replace her machines quite often.
I’m not being sarcastic, just curious about a vacuum professional’s point of view instead of a collector’s opinion. My housekeeper uses her Shark when she cleans my house and I’ve noticed that she seems to replace her machines quite often.
Shark..
They got the features right, made a vacuum for how most people tend to use vacuums these days. Because of this many of our customers don't want to replace them even when they do break and will pay handsomely for repairs. As such I can say that the construction of the machine is rather poor. They are actively making it difficult to repair and have longstanding faults that they seem to have no interest in fixing. The lower hose assemblies split after a couple years on almost all of them. The micro-switch in the power heads fail, the board in the power heads also fail, though that seems to have gotten better. Shark also uses security Torx screws and even counter sinks them as most people only have a standard short bit set. Replacement of the cord is a horrible process on almost all of them, and will never approach factory fit and finish due to a strain relief that is a weird custom shape.
They got the features right, made a vacuum for how most people tend to use vacuums these days. Because of this many of our customers don't want to replace them even when they do break and will pay handsomely for repairs. As such I can say that the construction of the machine is rather poor. They are actively making it difficult to repair and have longstanding faults that they seem to have no interest in fixing. The lower hose assemblies split after a couple years on almost all of them. The micro-switch in the power heads fail, the board in the power heads also fail, though that seems to have gotten better. Shark also uses security Torx screws and even counter sinks them as most people only have a standard short bit set. Replacement of the cord is a horrible process on almost all of them, and will never approach factory fit and finish due to a strain relief that is a weird custom shape.
They got it right with the features and marketing, not the reliability. If they wanted their machines to last longer they should start using better cyclones that don't chuck half the dust into the motor
With how Tacony is these days, it makes me appreciate the TTi-era Hoovers.
I agree with SQ here, it's all about marketing and cost savings. Lets face it, the R20 models are getting outdated nowadays. If Tacony kept selling those machines today and not come out with the R25 series, they would've been on a decline. Think about why Scott & Fetzer sold off Kirby in the first place, or think about why Kirby is now being sold online and at retailers including vacuum shops. Kirby is getting beat by other brands that offer features Kirby cannot compete against like on-board hoses and attachments, lifetime belt, swivel neck, etc. This is not just Tacony that's doing this but almost with every other vacuum company, I said almost because the rest like Kirby are still using older technology. So Tacony definitely got some things right with the R25 over the R20. Bags are alot better and cleaner to change out, the brushroll shut off feature is more reliable, and their front wheels are more maneuverable like the Miele S7/U1. That's what most consumers would want over the R20 models. As for R25 being made overseas, yeah it's a shame that we ended up losing more local workers and support. However though, if the R25 was assembled here, they would've costed almost TWICE as much. I cannot blame Tacony for that part. Overall, they're not bad machines. I actually like them to be quite honest here, same goes for the Simplicity Allergy. I definitely would buy one. Though I'm more old school like some of us, Tacony still makes the Titan T4000.2/TC6000.2 which is similar to an R20. I'd rather buy the T4000.2 over any R25. They also sell those old school machines commercially in other brands like CleanMax, Powr-Flite, Tornado, and Nobles. Actually if you want a bypass upright that's dual motor like the R25 but old school like the R20, the Nobles V-DMU-14 offers the best of both worlds. But neither of those machines would be my first choice to buy from Tacony today. If I wanted to buy a Tacony vacuum today, it'd be a central vac which FYI they are NOT made in china. Power units are made in Canada, the hose is made in Mexico, and the powerheads are assembled here just like the Supralites and the tandem air uprights.
https://www.nobles.com/en_ca/1/mach...dmu-14.dual-motor-upright-vacuum.1068027.html
https://www.nobles.com/en_ca/1/mach...dmu-14.dual-motor-upright-vacuum.1068027.html
My vacuum shop is 8 miles from the Tacony factory. I do not carry Riccar, although I've been approached by their rep. who just doesn't understand why I won't. I started carrying Air-Way upright, which I like, because I don't have to enrich Tacony. I trade in Riccar and Simplicity machines almost on a daily basis due to parts unavailability. Steel City is my supplier and if they don't carry a Tacony filter, then it's obsolete for the customer. Tacony makes it very difficult for the small vac shop to repair their machines because they don't release all their parts to the trade, only some. I regret having wasted ten years of my life at the factory working for them.
?
The vac shops I worked at before had but still today carry parts for Tacony and they are Tacony dealers. Also there's more than one place or supplier to get parts at like vacpartswarehouse. I like the Air-Way uprights, they're basically rebranded Evolution machines. But I prefer the Tacony versions better. If I had to get something else other than a Tacony, the Cirrus variants is what I'd get and they're made by the same company who makes the Air-Ways. I like the CR99 model the best. Dual fan motor, better HEPA filter, and the clutch is much nicer.
The vac shops I worked at before had but still today carry parts for Tacony and they are Tacony dealers. Also there's more than one place or supplier to get parts at like vacpartswarehouse. I like the Air-Way uprights, they're basically rebranded Evolution machines. But I prefer the Tacony versions better. If I had to get something else other than a Tacony, the Cirrus variants is what I'd get and they're made by the same company who makes the Air-Ways. I like the CR99 model the best. Dual fan motor, better HEPA filter, and the clutch is much nicer.
I love the Cirrus CR-79 I have... but it's so confusing because there are so many brands that look so similar...At one point, I thought Cirrus was Tacony...
I love the design of mine...it's around 4 years old and although I've taken great care of it...the motor will sometimes sound a bit OFF to me (almost like a slightly higher pitch with some vibration) but as it warms up from use, that goes away and it sounds normal...It's certainly nothing that I've done...I don't abuse vacuums or anything I own..
I love the design of mine...it's around 4 years old and although I've taken great care of it...the motor will sometimes sound a bit OFF to me (almost like a slightly higher pitch with some vibration) but as it warms up from use, that goes away and it sounds normal...It's certainly nothing that I've done...I don't abuse vacuums or anything I own..
Todays modern vacuums make me appreciate my faith in my Kirby(s) #1, All metal Royal uprights and the Hoover convertables of the day. Yes it is true all old school. None the less tried and true and still going strong.
Look what I picked up today from the thrift store
This is actually the CR89 model, the predecessor of the CR99 but without the turbo brush which I personally don't care about anyways. It's also the successor of the CR88 but without the quick draw telescoping wand which I also personally don't care about either. Again, I like these machines the best from ESSCO. It's a very nice vacuum, my old local vacuum store sold a ton of them. But I still prefer the Tacony machines better. I wished they hadn't cheapened the hoses on these nowadays, I don't like that they're clear. I wouldn't have a problem paying more of staying the way the hoses were before like on mine.
Regarding vacuums nowadays, I'd agree that most of them just aren't what they used to be anymore. At least as far as build quality goes. I say most because there are some companies like Sebo that's actually improved their vacuums even better than before. My other local vacuum store, they used to sell Sebo before a while ago but recently they went back to selling them again because the newer versions were proven to have zero problems.
This is actually the CR89 model, the predecessor of the CR99 but without the turbo brush which I personally don't care about anyways. It's also the successor of the CR88 but without the quick draw telescoping wand which I also personally don't care about either. Again, I like these machines the best from ESSCO. It's a very nice vacuum, my old local vacuum store sold a ton of them. But I still prefer the Tacony machines better. I wished they hadn't cheapened the hoses on these nowadays, I don't like that they're clear. I wouldn't have a problem paying more of staying the way the hoses were before like on mine.Regarding vacuums nowadays, I'd agree that most of them just aren't what they used to be anymore. At least as far as build quality goes. I say most because there are some companies like Sebo that's actually improved their vacuums even better than before. My other local vacuum store, they used to sell Sebo before a while ago but recently they went back to selling them again because the newer versions were proven to have zero problems.
When I bought my CR-79 over 4 years ago...brand new.... the price was like $340 or something like that...and the CR99 was in the $400s. Now, that SAME vacuum is in the $500's and the CR-99 is in the $600's... Crazy..
I like that the operating costs of these are not that high at all. The HEPA filter is inexpensive as are the HEPA bags, belts, and motor filter..
I like that the operating costs of these are not that high at all. The HEPA filter is inexpensive as are the HEPA bags, belts, and motor filter..
I think part of the reason why they've gotten more pricier is not just because of inflation but they've also updated the warranty as well. Both the CR79 and the CR99 originally had a two year warranty but now they both offer a 5 year warranty. I'm sure prices would change again if a company leases those machines and rebranded them like say Sharp for example if they ever returned to the North American vacuum cleaner market, they may possibly make a comeback someday from what I was told by Sharp. I do agree about the prices to maintain these machines, they are so cheap to run and it's one of the reasons why I'd recommend a Cirrus over a Tacony product.
Gotctha..
I never noticed the extended the warranty
I'm always eyeing some Tacony products too... I know some people don't like them but I like some of the designs..
Back when I bought mine I was watching youtube videos.. a few vacuum shops on youtube were selling it and showing it. Also they would have this aftermarket extension kit that comes with it...(which I use the hell out of, by the way)... but they would always connect the hose to the PORT on the back of the hose... I tried that and the suction was horrible through the hose...but, if I took out the wand and connected the wand to the hose, the suction through the extension hose was excellent. I never use the on board tools.. Needless to say, the Cirrus hose itself doesn't get a lot of stretching and abuse....
but it does make a higher pitched noise when I connect the hose...as most vacuums would because you're restricting some airflow...but I can't imagine that would be othering the motor much...
I never noticed the extended the warranty
I'm always eyeing some Tacony products too... I know some people don't like them but I like some of the designs..
Back when I bought mine I was watching youtube videos.. a few vacuum shops on youtube were selling it and showing it. Also they would have this aftermarket extension kit that comes with it...(which I use the hell out of, by the way)... but they would always connect the hose to the PORT on the back of the hose... I tried that and the suction was horrible through the hose...but, if I took out the wand and connected the wand to the hose, the suction through the extension hose was excellent. I never use the on board tools.. Needless to say, the Cirrus hose itself doesn't get a lot of stretching and abuse....
but it does make a higher pitched noise when I connect the hose...as most vacuums would because you're restricting some airflow...but I can't imagine that would be othering the motor much...
Personally, I love Tacony. I'll admit to say that they aren't the same they used to be 10 years ago but I'd still recommend them. I can't say however that I'd prefer a Tacony machine over a Cirrus anyday, no. There are some Tacony machines that I personally would pick a Cirrus hands down. Example would be this Simplicity 7 Series or 7350 where it's VERY similar to the Cirrus CR78. Even though the Simplicity had a longer warranty, it was made in the USA, and that it cleans better, I still would buy or use the Cirrus over the Simplicity. I like that it was cheaper, the clutch is nicer, and it just feels much better in my hands because it uses the Panasonic wheel design. Plus I could still get all the parts for it today, they quit making that 7350 a long time ago which was a real shame because that's my all time favorite vacuum from Tacony.
Regarding the hoses. I remember when I used to vacuum my neighbor's house with one of their two Simplicity 7350s' they have or had at the time, one of them had a genuine extension hose to fit in the back inlet port and it too wasn't very good either. Because it didn't seal all the way through where there was still suction coming in from the main hose. So instead I just connected the extension hose through the main hose and it was ALOT better. The only vacuums I've experienced that didn't had a problem with connecting the hoses to the back inlet ports were the Panasonics regardless if it was a genuine or an aftermarket extension hose. One of the other reasons why the back inlet port is there in the first place so that you can easily unclog it if larger objects made it through the hose but not into the bag.
Regarding the hoses. I remember when I used to vacuum my neighbor's house with one of their two Simplicity 7350s' they have or had at the time, one of them had a genuine extension hose to fit in the back inlet port and it too wasn't very good either. Because it didn't seal all the way through where there was still suction coming in from the main hose. So instead I just connected the extension hose through the main hose and it was ALOT better. The only vacuums I've experienced that didn't had a problem with connecting the hoses to the back inlet ports were the Panasonics regardless if it was a genuine or an aftermarket extension hose. One of the other reasons why the back inlet port is there in the first place so that you can easily unclog it if larger objects made it through the hose but not into the bag.
On that last pic of the cirrus... where's the wand? It looks like the wand was taken off the hose... but on mine there's like a wand holder area that's missing too... it looks like this must be a different model... Looking at that... that would actually totally work for me as well because I don't really need the wand itself...just the hose to pull out and connect the extension hose to. That's the reason I didn't get the blue model... because I don't need a turbo brush and I would rarely ever use low speed.. I want full power all the time....I definitely don't want a vacuum where the brushroll keeps spinning...It takes me forever to fill a bag even remotely to the point it needs changing...I think a pack of 6 bags lasts me 2 years...
It's a different model. That's the CR78, not the CR79. Instead the CR78 offered a plastic telescoping wand that extends out twice which I much prefer over the quick draw aluminum telescoping wand. The CR89 that I picked up recently above didn't come with a turbo brush which again I don't personally care about. The only thing I wished both the CR78 and the CR79 had that the blue ones do have is the twin fan motor. I also don't personally care for the variable speed controller on the blue ones, however I've never seen one fail.
Yea I like it too.. I wonder if any company still makes that design?
What happened to Tacony is what has happened to most of the vacuum world. Most mainstream companies have had no choice but to move production to cheaper locales. The problem is that American consumers no longer expect more because they have commoditized vacuums. Where once they were considered an expensive appliance like a water heater or fridge and were expected to last accordingly, now they are throwaway items to be replaced at most once every 5-10 years. People seem to complain a lot about how long they last, but they sure don't BUY better. They only care that they see a jazzy design and flashbang technology features.
Gone are the days of 70 year old Electroluxes and Kirby's for most people. And it is the fault of the buying public. If they wanted better, the market would respond. Just my 2 cents.
Gone are the days of 70 year old Electroluxes and Kirby's for most people. And it is the fault of the buying public. If they wanted better, the market would respond. Just my 2 cents.
Add on to previous comment:
To be fair, a vacuum that only costs $200 dollars and lasts for 10 years is a good deal. If you want longer lasting machines, you got to pay for it.
To be fair, a vacuum that only costs $200 dollars and lasts for 10 years is a good deal. If you want longer lasting machines, you got to pay for it.
As a matter of fact, yes. The Koblenz U-900 still uses that design today. Much more simpler but I'd still buy the Cirrus CR99 over the Koblenz. And Tacony also still uses a similar design on their CleanMax CMP-3T which I much prefer over the Koblenz U-900. Cheaper, uses rubber wheels, it has a twin fan motor with an extra year of motor warranty, and a pressure gauge like what Panasonic had used before if there was ever a clog.
Regarding to the last post. I agree that the more you buy on a vacuum cleaner, the longer it'll last usually. That's why if I were to buy a vacuum cleaner today, at least as far as single motor uprights go, I would buy not a Tacony or a Cirrus but rather a Sebo X Series (preferably this bright green X4 if they still made them) which is one of the more expensive vacuums. I've been very impressed with them over the last few years. I used to think they weren't as reliable because they use circuit boards and heard that they've had issues with them. But no I was wrong, they last longer than I realized especially in the commercial market and it's really rare to see them have problems. They're so reliable that they could even outlast a Kirby or a Aerus Electrolux today. And again they make their vacuums even better than they've ever had been before. I know one of my Kenmores that's made by Sebo has a issue with the circuitry but that's because it was very heavily abused when I first got it. However if I completely rebuild it with all the new and upgraded parts, it'd last longer than previously. That's why I think they were the best Kenmores ever sold.
Regarding to the last post. I agree that the more you buy on a vacuum cleaner, the longer it'll last usually. That's why if I were to buy a vacuum cleaner today, at least as far as single motor uprights go, I would buy not a Tacony or a Cirrus but rather a Sebo X Series (preferably this bright green X4 if they still made them) which is one of the more expensive vacuums. I've been very impressed with them over the last few years. I used to think they weren't as reliable because they use circuit boards and heard that they've had issues with them. But no I was wrong, they last longer than I realized especially in the commercial market and it's really rare to see them have problems. They're so reliable that they could even outlast a Kirby or a Aerus Electrolux today. And again they make their vacuums even better than they've ever had been before. I know one of my Kenmores that's made by Sebo has a issue with the circuitry but that's because it was very heavily abused when I first got it. However if I completely rebuild it with all the new and upgraded parts, it'd last longer than previously. That's why I think they were the best Kenmores ever sold.
Oh yea... I've always eyed Sebo.. I LOVE their vacuums and have always wanted one SOO bad...I know you get what you pay for... My Gold 2 speed rainbow from 2006 will outlive me I'm sure.
About the Cirrus..My first thought was when I saw that (CR88) was the wand looked like it was totally taken out of the equation...so you had just the short hose connecting at the bottom which = less length and possibly a little more airflow at the nozzle... Just a guess... Maybe not enough to make that much of a difference..
On that cleanmax... just curious, does it have a clutch to turn off brush roll?
About the Cirrus..My first thought was when I saw that (CR88) was the wand looked like it was totally taken out of the equation...so you had just the short hose connecting at the bottom which = less length and possibly a little more airflow at the nozzle... Just a guess... Maybe not enough to make that much of a difference..
On that cleanmax... just curious, does it have a clutch to turn off brush roll?
The CleanMax doesn't have a clutch, same with the U-900 since they're both commercial models.
The CR88 you've mentioned which I'm assuming you meant the CR78, that's the blue one I've talked about earlier which came out before the CR89 and the CR99. It also doesn't have that quick draw aluminum telescoping wand but it does however have a little bit more of hose length unlike the CR78 where it would wrap up just right where the bottom cord hook should be. And if you notice, the cord is wrapped on the side instead of the back. I also would've liked this one more than either the CR89 or the CR99
The CR88 you've mentioned which I'm assuming you meant the CR78, that's the blue one I've talked about earlier which came out before the CR89 and the CR99. It also doesn't have that quick draw aluminum telescoping wand but it does however have a little bit more of hose length unlike the CR78 where it would wrap up just right where the bottom cord hook should be. And if you notice, the cord is wrapped on the side instead of the back. I also would've liked this one more than either the CR89 or the CR99
And to those who complain about the lack of a brushroll shut-off: get yourself two extension wands and a hard floor tool.
I also hear it's better because the user has more control on what area they want to clean.
I also hear it's better because the user has more control on what area they want to clean.
No brushroll shut off... that's exactly what I do... Use an afterrmarket extension hose with its tools to do above floor hard floor. I never turn the brush roll off and go over hard floor with the nozzle
Just yesterday I cleaned 3 rooms in my house and spent 2 to 3 hours top to bottom using extension hose and tools... I can't imagine it would be good for the vacuum to be constantly spinning the brush while it just sits there in the same spot.. It just seems like unnecessary wear/tear moving parts.
You were right... I got the model # wrong.
Just yesterday I cleaned 3 rooms in my house and spent 2 to 3 hours top to bottom using extension hose and tools... I can't imagine it would be good for the vacuum to be constantly spinning the brush while it just sits there in the same spot.. It just seems like unnecessary wear/tear moving parts.
You were right... I got the model # wrong.
Personally, I'd rather have a vacuum that would shut the brushroll off whenever I'd vacuum bare floors and use the attachments. That's why the Lindhaus HealthCare Pro is my first overall choice if I wanted to buy a new upright vacuum today. I've used vacuums before where I'd use the hose while the brushroll is still spinning, and I'd see dust spit out of the brushroll. Plus if not careful, you could either accidently tangle up the brusholl from lets say a fishing line while you're busy using the hose without noticing. I think that happened to me once before. Or you can cause a burn mark on the carpet if the brushroll stayed on the same spot for very long. Overall, it's ideal to have a secondary vacuum like a canister where it'd be much more suited for vacuuming barefloors and using the attachments if your other vacuum can't shut the brusholl off. That was one of the reasons why my aunt got a central vac because her old Hoover Concept Two can't do bare floors and it didn't had a hose or attachments other than the Hoover Help Mate which is not very powerful, same with her Dirt Devil Ultra hand vac that had a hose on-board. Also that same neighbor with those two Simplicity 7350 uprights I was telling about earlier, they also have or had a couple of Eureka Mighty Mite canisters that I had used to vacuum their barefloors with because I was concerned about accidently tipping the Simplicity over while using the extension hose.
The only thing I've got against Sebo machines is the fact that NONE of them are equipped with a headlight. It may seem silly to some, but I like having that feature cuz I often shove vacuums under beds and couches and they really do help you see some small thing that you may have forgotten that could get sucked in. As much as they cost, it isn't a lot to ask.
Higher cost doesn't ALWAYS mean "better" but usually superior engineering costs more.
Higher cost doesn't ALWAYS mean "better" but usually superior engineering costs more.
Actually their X7 and X8 models now have a headlight.
https://www.sebo.us/upright-vacuums/automatic-x/automatic-x7-x8-best-vacuum-cleaner.aspx
And so does Lindhaus as well.
https://www.sebo.us/upright-vacuums/automatic-x/automatic-x7-x8-best-vacuum-cleaner.aspx
And so does Lindhaus as well.
