cocobird5
Active member
I have asthma,so filtration is the most important to me. My Miele also does fine with the other two criteria.
What's Most Important To You: Filtration, Airflow, or Ergonomics?
- Thread starter wyaple
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eurekaprince
Well-known member
Definitely airflow: that's what gets the dirt moving into the bag. But for carpet cleaning, agitation and brushing is more important than airflow because airflow alone won't disconnect dirt that is buried and entangled in the fibres.
This suggests another aspect of cleaner design is very important: nozzle/tool/brush design.
This suggests another aspect of cleaner design is very important: nozzle/tool/brush design.
gsheen
Well-known member
Ergonomics
For starters let me explain why. While like everyone here I love my vacuums and vacuuming I am also Husband and Dad in a busy household were vacuuming is not a fun acrivity but a nessesity and chore. We have a few animals and genrally the house , main areas get vacuumed 2 or 3 times a day.
The vacuum needs to be easy to use have easy to access on board tools and do carpets and hardfloors It must be able to get the job done as quickly as possible with as little hassel as possible
I have always felt Filtration is overplayed. Yes its important but are you trying to tell me my Grans house was filthy because her choice of vacuum was a clothed bag upright vacuum with no hepa filtration. She would smack you silly if you dared to think it. I live In Cape Town South Aftica with genrally pleasent weather yesr round. Unless it is absolutly pouring down with Rain our patio doors are always open . More impuritys blow in through the open doors than any hepa filtration could ever remove from my home.
Airflow is important but again if you vacuum as much as we do even a orek can keep the carpets clean as the dirt never gets a chance to settle
For starters let me explain why. While like everyone here I love my vacuums and vacuuming I am also Husband and Dad in a busy household were vacuuming is not a fun acrivity but a nessesity and chore. We have a few animals and genrally the house , main areas get vacuumed 2 or 3 times a day.
The vacuum needs to be easy to use have easy to access on board tools and do carpets and hardfloors It must be able to get the job done as quickly as possible with as little hassel as possible
I have always felt Filtration is overplayed. Yes its important but are you trying to tell me my Grans house was filthy because her choice of vacuum was a clothed bag upright vacuum with no hepa filtration. She would smack you silly if you dared to think it. I live In Cape Town South Aftica with genrally pleasent weather yesr round. Unless it is absolutly pouring down with Rain our patio doors are always open . More impuritys blow in through the open doors than any hepa filtration could ever remove from my home.
Airflow is important but again if you vacuum as much as we do even a orek can keep the carpets clean as the dirt never gets a chance to settle
real1shep
Well-known member
I'd have to go with airflow. But it's not really a fair question to just pick one attribute. Becuase right behind airflow in my consideration is filtration and then behind that is WEIGHT. Weight and ergonomics should go hand-in-hand. However, I'm not so concerned about ergonomics as I am about weight. I would hope that when I look at a vacuum, I can suss out whether the ergonomics are OK, or just bat shite crazy.
Because with weight, usually comes bulk and there's nothing worse to me than a heavy, bulky vac. Why I don't have Kirby, but have a Royal upright. And I do NOT ever want a vac that has any kind of self-propulsion drive. I drag around metal canisters most and maybe I have muscle memory, because other than bumping into stuff, I don't consider them to be a weight problem.
Kevin
Because with weight, usually comes bulk and there's nothing worse to me than a heavy, bulky vac. Why I don't have Kirby, but have a Royal upright. And I do NOT ever want a vac that has any kind of self-propulsion drive. I drag around metal canisters most and maybe I have muscle memory, because other than bumping into stuff, I don't consider them to be a weight problem.
Kevin
wyaple
Well-known member
The Results So Far
I wish we had a survey function on this website as it would make questions like this much easier...Some of the answers were difficult to interpret.
Filtration = 1/22 = 4.5%
Airflow = 11/22 = 50%
Ergonomics = 4/22 = 18.2%
Refused to answer/Multiple answers/Disliked the question = 6/22 = 27.3%
So without a doubt, AIRFLOW is by far the most important to posters here on this website. With that being established, I have one BIG question:
Where is the outcry to insist/demand that manufacturers post airflow specs? Dyson posts airwatts and claims their vacs have the most suction (which they do), but airflow never enters their marketing equation because it is so very poor (think 50-ish CFM at the nozzle).
Even though bag less machines are all the rage, all of them are plagued with really lousy airflow because the cyclones, the very thing everybody can't seem to get enough of, eat up nearly half of the nozzle airflow.
Will this trend of lousy performance/efficiency with bag less vacs ever end? Does anyone outside of Vacuumland care?
Bill
I wish we had a survey function on this website as it would make questions like this much easier...Some of the answers were difficult to interpret.
Filtration = 1/22 = 4.5%
Airflow = 11/22 = 50%
Ergonomics = 4/22 = 18.2%
Refused to answer/Multiple answers/Disliked the question = 6/22 = 27.3%
So without a doubt, AIRFLOW is by far the most important to posters here on this website. With that being established, I have one BIG question:
Where is the outcry to insist/demand that manufacturers post airflow specs? Dyson posts airwatts and claims their vacs have the most suction (which they do), but airflow never enters their marketing equation because it is so very poor (think 50-ish CFM at the nozzle).
Even though bag less machines are all the rage, all of them are plagued with really lousy airflow because the cyclones, the very thing everybody can't seem to get enough of, eat up nearly half of the nozzle airflow.
Will this trend of lousy performance/efficiency with bag less vacs ever end? Does anyone outside of Vacuumland care?
Bill
real1shep
Well-known member
That's a.....
resounding NO. The vacuum buying masses don't give a damn about airflow. They want trendy convenience at a price point. And if a trendy convenience manufacturer has sold enough units over a period of time, they can/will start to raise prices. So....it's not uncommon to see vac junk sold at the $400 mark.
And I'd be fine with that if it didn't affect old vacs, but it does. More and more of the older vac companies were merged or bought out completely. And that almost always translates into NLA parts. You can't sell all the trendy, convenience price point vacs you want if there are still older vacs lingering about with parts support. The fastest way to kill an appliance's reign is to stop the parts flow.....
Kevin
resounding NO. The vacuum buying masses don't give a damn about airflow. They want trendy convenience at a price point. And if a trendy convenience manufacturer has sold enough units over a period of time, they can/will start to raise prices. So....it's not uncommon to see vac junk sold at the $400 mark.
And I'd be fine with that if it didn't affect old vacs, but it does. More and more of the older vac companies were merged or bought out completely. And that almost always translates into NLA parts. You can't sell all the trendy, convenience price point vacs you want if there are still older vacs lingering about with parts support. The fastest way to kill an appliance's reign is to stop the parts flow.....
Kevin
mixman
Well-known member
Yeah the masses only care about the ease of use (ergonomics) and how well it can clean the pet hairs. As long as a vacuum is easy to use for what they need it to do and it can get the pet hairs and mess off the floor, they are fine with it.
gsheen
Well-known member
Well then the Masses must be telling you somthing
For your avarage home owner vacuuming is a chore not something fun to do.
I would be interested to know how many of those here on Vacland who reponded have Kids, Ie under 17 years old.
When I was single and even before Joanne and I had kids , life was busy , I thought it was atleast but it was not. Been a petrol head I had time to wash and detail both our cars, do all maintanatce myself, I had a fantastic garden that I tended to myself, Grass cut every week, never a blade out of place. My vacuum collection was up to date, in perfect condition , I used a Kirby because it was the best I had at that time, I could spend the time it took to clean each room disasembeling half the machine every few minutes to fit the attachments.
Then we had Joshua , The kirby was quickly replaced by a Hoover elite and then a Electrolux widetrack, I no longer had the time to spend a hour just vacuuming every day. The garden while still neat was no longer the masterpiece it once was, The cars get washed when dirty , the maintenance is done by the workshop now.
My point is that as someone who lives in the world of Kids, Homework assignments, and all that goes with that, like the rest of the masses Air flow means nothing if I dont have the time to use it.A average vacuum does a good enough job for the masses.
Its one thing that most vacuum collectors fail to see, yes Kirby is has great airflow, Yes it will last a life time ( most of the time ) but it will lats even longer in your average household because after the novelty wears off it either ends up in the cupboard or on Craigslist and Ebay when its replaced with a Eureka that is easier to use, Or even worse the carpets get ripped up and hardfloors replace them because they are easier to manage
For your avarage home owner vacuuming is a chore not something fun to do.
I would be interested to know how many of those here on Vacland who reponded have Kids, Ie under 17 years old.
When I was single and even before Joanne and I had kids , life was busy , I thought it was atleast but it was not. Been a petrol head I had time to wash and detail both our cars, do all maintanatce myself, I had a fantastic garden that I tended to myself, Grass cut every week, never a blade out of place. My vacuum collection was up to date, in perfect condition , I used a Kirby because it was the best I had at that time, I could spend the time it took to clean each room disasembeling half the machine every few minutes to fit the attachments.
Then we had Joshua , The kirby was quickly replaced by a Hoover elite and then a Electrolux widetrack, I no longer had the time to spend a hour just vacuuming every day. The garden while still neat was no longer the masterpiece it once was, The cars get washed when dirty , the maintenance is done by the workshop now.
My point is that as someone who lives in the world of Kids, Homework assignments, and all that goes with that, like the rest of the masses Air flow means nothing if I dont have the time to use it.A average vacuum does a good enough job for the masses.
Its one thing that most vacuum collectors fail to see, yes Kirby is has great airflow, Yes it will last a life time ( most of the time ) but it will lats even longer in your average household because after the novelty wears off it either ends up in the cupboard or on Craigslist and Ebay when its replaced with a Eureka that is easier to use, Or even worse the carpets get ripped up and hardfloors replace them because they are easier to manage
mixman
Well-known member
Gsheen
I totally agree for most people vacuuming is a chore and whatever makes that chore easier.....ie... a vacuum that is easy for them to use is the most important thing. Everything else is a distant second.
Mike
I totally agree for most people vacuuming is a chore and whatever makes that chore easier.....ie... a vacuum that is easy for them to use is the most important thing. Everything else is a distant second.
Mike
real1shep
Well-known member
But the fallacy in that argument is that the masses are always correct. I raised two boys and now I'm raising my grandson. I know all about homework, balancing a business and losing the ability to manicure everything I owned, as I had done previously without kids. But despite all that, we always sought the best vacuum we could find.....which in our case were Elux canisters. That plastic crap has been around for decades now...never felt even the slightest impulse to take the plunge.
You don't have to follow the masses' choice toward trendy convenience and price point. Sometimes it's about stopping and using your head.....like; should we pay $300 for some plastic POS that will probably be used up in three to five yrs or plunk down $1,500 for a vac system that will last for generations? Same in major appliances, cars and everything else. In the US basically, you get what you pay for, although the choices for quality products always seem to be dwindling with China making about everything we touch.
I have some dear friends that raised five children and I've been a part of their lives since their kids were small. I've watched them go from one plastic fantastic vac to the next. They started a driver's ed school and they have a plastic fantastic vac there too. They might take a vac for repair ONE time and after that, it's down to WallyWorld to get the next one. We've never had THE vacuum discussion. In part because I know their mindset. They are not going to buy an Aerus or anything like that...even if it would outlast them. They consider vacs disposable and anything more than that is just kooky. Oh and their carpeted floors are filthy too....I wouldn't lay on them for a bet. They're not getting any deep cleaning with those vacs and the dirt has built up over the yrs.....their rugs just look bad.
Kevin
You don't have to follow the masses' choice toward trendy convenience and price point. Sometimes it's about stopping and using your head.....like; should we pay $300 for some plastic POS that will probably be used up in three to five yrs or plunk down $1,500 for a vac system that will last for generations? Same in major appliances, cars and everything else. In the US basically, you get what you pay for, although the choices for quality products always seem to be dwindling with China making about everything we touch.
I have some dear friends that raised five children and I've been a part of their lives since their kids were small. I've watched them go from one plastic fantastic vac to the next. They started a driver's ed school and they have a plastic fantastic vac there too. They might take a vac for repair ONE time and after that, it's down to WallyWorld to get the next one. We've never had THE vacuum discussion. In part because I know their mindset. They are not going to buy an Aerus or anything like that...even if it would outlast them. They consider vacs disposable and anything more than that is just kooky. Oh and their carpeted floors are filthy too....I wouldn't lay on them for a bet. They're not getting any deep cleaning with those vacs and the dirt has built up over the yrs.....their rugs just look bad.
Kevin
gsheen
Well-known member
I Hear you Kevin . I too get the best I can. Not the most expensive but the one that worked the best.
With my business and my vacuum collection and I not at a loss of which vacuum to use. I do however tend to use a light weight bagless upright for every day cleaning and a Royal for a good deep cleaning every 2nd week on the weekend
What I was getting at was ergonomics. It must be easy to use. A Lux canister is easy to use. Most canisters are easier to use in a multi floor home. I prefer uprights though.
In my home i must admit that since iur first dyson cordless vac a dc 35 and we have had every model since then with the old models been passed on to various family members or doing duty elswere in the house. I tend to grab a upright and use the dyson v6 with a crevice tool on the end of the pipe for the edges.
As for filthy carpets, if you have kids and animals you need to get those carpets washed regularly by a profecional company with a truck mount. No vacuum is going to get rid of the mess that kids bring to a carpet with spilt food and drinks
With my business and my vacuum collection and I not at a loss of which vacuum to use. I do however tend to use a light weight bagless upright for every day cleaning and a Royal for a good deep cleaning every 2nd week on the weekend
What I was getting at was ergonomics. It must be easy to use. A Lux canister is easy to use. Most canisters are easier to use in a multi floor home. I prefer uprights though.
In my home i must admit that since iur first dyson cordless vac a dc 35 and we have had every model since then with the old models been passed on to various family members or doing duty elswere in the house. I tend to grab a upright and use the dyson v6 with a crevice tool on the end of the pipe for the edges.
As for filthy carpets, if you have kids and animals you need to get those carpets washed regularly by a profecional company with a truck mount. No vacuum is going to get rid of the mess that kids bring to a carpet with spilt food and drinks
real1shep
Well-known member
That's true....
if kids are spilling stuff on the carpets and dog accidents happen, the carpets need to be professionally cleaned. However, there are a fraternity of people here that have their own machines for shampooing carpets and the like. I can't make a call one way or the other on that, since I don't do it. When I was younger and still moving around, I'd always rent those 'steam' cleaner devices before I moved in and when I was leaving....out of economic necessity (to get my deposit back). After that when married, I just hired a service. I guess they still argue about chem clean or steam clean......I read the verbiage, but I'm not sure there are any clear winners.
In the big farmhouse in MO, we had carpeting in the kitchen and eating area. That was about the dumbest idea I ever saw with kids. I soon pulled that up and went back to hard floors.
Kevin
if kids are spilling stuff on the carpets and dog accidents happen, the carpets need to be professionally cleaned. However, there are a fraternity of people here that have their own machines for shampooing carpets and the like. I can't make a call one way or the other on that, since I don't do it. When I was younger and still moving around, I'd always rent those 'steam' cleaner devices before I moved in and when I was leaving....out of economic necessity (to get my deposit back). After that when married, I just hired a service. I guess they still argue about chem clean or steam clean......I read the verbiage, but I'm not sure there are any clear winners.
In the big farmhouse in MO, we had carpeting in the kitchen and eating area. That was about the dumbest idea I ever saw with kids. I soon pulled that up and went back to hard floors.
Kevin
