The "Sirena"

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williamr1248

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I was looking at the information and videos on the new machine. Here is just a few thoughts I got on the new machine. Interesting to see what others impressions are on the machine.

(1) I liked the colors
(2) cheaper

But What I did not like so much:

(1)no lights on the power nozzle
(2) no enclosed wiring and connections for the power nozzle
(3) bumper does not go all the way around on the power nozzle
(4) It is cheaper BUT no Aquamate, no hand held Rainbowmate, No Rainbowjet
(5) no door storage rack for the hose and tools
(6) tools are stored on the dolly. I do not like this arrangement on my Hyla because it makes the dolly a more bulky square shape and the user is forced to bend down to the floor to retrieve the tools each time.
(7) no brushless motor
(8) I prefer the 2 piece wand system just because when the user wants to use only one length of the wand, the one piece make it heavier to hold as on my Hyla and Miele machines.
(9) just the fact that is a copy of the Rainbow and what about service and parts on a brand new make machine?
(10) a warranty is only good if you can find service.
This is not to say it won't be a great machine, but these are some observations that I noticed on the machine.
I think I would rather invest in a known and proven product from a almost 80 year old company with parts available everywhere.
The fact that even old Rainbows hold their value says a lot to me.

What do you think?
If it sells for $895.00-what is their mark up?
It is about 1/2 what I paid for my new Rainbow but you are getting about 1/2 the machine and tools. I really like and use the Rainbowjet for hard surface floor cleaning.
It also bothers me when any company copies another product even down to type of advertising slogans and wording. You saw a LOT of this back in the 1930's with other makers comparing their machines to the Hoover Company.

Just some first thoughts on the first look at a new machine.
 
The Sirena

Just watched the videos again. I do like the color of the machine and it sounds like one of the older Rainbows. I did notice it has a shorter electric hose,
and the beater brush uses the old style flat belt.
I did not see any information on the air flow or suction level.

I love seeing a new machine on the market.
 
Sirena

Yes i agree with your points. But i would like to have have one to replace my Rainbow . And i wish the sold Rainbow alot cheaper. I can afford a Sirena . But my only worrie is if needs repair where theres no where for me to take the Sirena.
 
I can't wait for the Sirena to come. I'm getting serial number 2 for the museum. The Sirena is going to be sold in Vac Shops (so service will be available). I consider this to be the 'next big thing' and I'll tell you why:

Most Rainbows are repaired by vac shops, not by the distributor. When a D3, D4, or E series is brought in for repairs, the new Sirena will be shown. With a price of $895, it's less expensive than a D3C cost 30 years ago.

The current retail price in St. Louis for a new Rainbow is $2495. At wholesale, the Sirena costs $100 less than the Rainbow. The Sirena will go from the factory, to the vac shop, to the customer. No distributor, sub distributor, training manager, phone girl, finance company, nor salesman's commissions. There are so many 'hands in the pot' that the Rainbow HAS to sell for over two grand for everyone to get their 'cut'.

As soon as I get mine, I'll make a video for the you tubes.
 
The "Sirena"

Josh,
If they can sell these at regular vac shops, maybe they will get enough dealers to provide local service. The price seems right for a high end vacuum to compete with Miele and Dyson.
I was wondering if it has the lighted basin like the Rainbow?
Our local Hyla dealer has closed up so I am forced to order from Florida if I need any parts or supplies. So far no problems but I do not use it that often.
 
Dysonman1

So do you feel like Sirena will come close to be as good as a Rainbow? I mean the Rainbow has more to offer in my opinion. I'm just wondering if the Sirena will do pretty good in the market Like Rainbow .
 
Most people use their Rainbow as just a vacuum cleaner, with the occasional wet pick up of a spill. Most people do not have or do not use, the AquaMate. The Sirena does everything a Rainbow does (as a vacuum cleaner) and most people will be thrilled with it. A vac shop will sell it to someone who is either looking for a 'used' or 'rebuilt' Rainbow or to someone who has a Rainbow that needs major repairs (motor, etc.). A D2 had 65 inches of water lift, and did just fine. If the suction and airflow are constant, it doesn't really need more than 65 inches of lift. I don't know what the Sirena will have, but it's an Italian made motor (probably by Rotafil). Once vac shops get them, I believe they'll sell tons of them. To the average person, it will be just like buying a New Rainbow without the high pressure door to door salesman.
 
I won't be surprised if......

Rexair brings a lawsuit against this company. Couplings, Separator, Floor Brush, Air Cleaning etc.

Just my opinion.

PR-21

Bud Mattingly
 
The picture

Of it looks good, the tools look like Rainbow clones, which is a good thing because they are really good.Tom has another water filtration machine that I was really impressed with several years ago, but i cant remember the name of it.
 
Sirena

Well the Sirena isn't the only Water Filtration vacuum to copy another. And Rainbow didn't file a lawsuit against the other brands. Then again im not 100 percent sure tho
 
so will we see Rainbows at cut rate prices on QVC if the Sirena is successful? In other words, will Rainbow feel compelled to change their sales model?
 
Dysonman

Are you saying what sets this apart from all the other water filtration vacuums like OceanBlue, Hyla, Pro Aqua, is that these won't be sold door to door, but only online and in vacuum shops across the country?
 
In my opinion, I don't see Rainbow changing their sales model. I don't think this company will be around in 10 years. The way I see it in 10 years this thing will be an afterthought, Rexair will still be around. However I would by one as a collectors item.

$895 is a steep price for a new startup. Shelling out that kind of dough is an investment. It will be up against a lot of long established names at that price. If I'm left with what is available at $900 I can't see this being that easy of a sell. You could get a used D4 with a proven track record for a long established company and has parts available for less.

Unproven track record and steep price. It doesn't help that it looks like a copy of a Rainbow (why hasn't anyone made a water filtering upright?). I wouldn't be surprised if they get sued on some aspects.

Unlike some other water vacuums it is almost if this one is trying too hard to be a Rainbow.

Lets be honest here, if you've got $900 to plunk down on this, you're probably one that can afford a Rainbow and the $2000 price tag if you buy it new. So you trust a a company that has used this design for decades or a brand new one.

I watched the video on Youtube of this thing, my worry is the guy lifts the motor unit with way too much ease. It looks like it weighs half what even the original E Series weighs. The newest ones are quite a heft.

If these turned up at Wal-Mart for $399 I wouldn't think tiwce. $895 seems like a stretch, even for a vac shop.

Unlike when Fantom first brought the Dyson technolgy to the US, there is no new technology here. Most people have heard of Rainbow. This is the large hurdle, convincing someone that buying this is somehow better than buying a refurb Rainbow (even an actual certified one is only $100 more than this without incentives). I just can't see people running out to buy these without any sort of track record.

First things that crossed my mind watching the video for this is "lawsuit", "cheap knockoff". They should do something to diffferentiate.
 
The Sirena isn't infringing any of Rexair's patents. There's nothing to sue over. A U.S. patent only lasts 18 years. Vac shops are going to be very successful selling the Sirena to existing Rainbow customers when their Rainbow repair is over $400 (a common amount for a new motor). If vac shops have no problem asking a thousand dollars for a Miele, they'll have no problem getting $800 for a new "Rainbow".
 
It's truly impossible to predict what will succeed or fail in a market until it does. Many companies have bet wrong in the past. Remember New Coke in 1985? They THOUGHT the public would love it. They were way, way wrong. Americans decided they HATED New Coke in some cases before they ever tasted it, LOL. People don't always love "new and improved" products. I have to say I probably wouldn't buy it. Just for the fact that it is completely unknown and Rainbow is MUCH more firmly established and well known in the U.S. I would buy a Rainbow and perhaps one of the other models but I doubt I'd spend that much on a machine that as of yet has no major network of parts and service. I doubt they will be able to dislodge Rainbow but they probably don't need to. Rainbow is selling to a relatively small market to high-end customers using a door-to-door sales model. Once customers have been shown the machine and are reminded how long Rexair has been in business they will probably be able to keep selling just like always even if this machine becomes popular. No one knows how long one of these new machines are going to last as of yet.
 
Rainbow may be more established, but at 2.5+ times the price they are a dubious value. And then there's the insufferable sales pitch that can go on for hours. If you don't buy a water vacuum you'll be wallowing in mud. The air in your home will be so filthy that your glass of water will be dirty, blah, blah, blah. On top of the awful salespitch, you get hit up for names. My friends probably wouldn't be my friends anymore if I set them up for Rainbow demonstrations. A Rainbow costs more than many built in vacuums.
 
Most Rainbow customers are NOT 'high end' customers. They are people who were talked into taking out a loan to buy a vacuum cleaner. The real problem is when that vacuum breaks down, they go to a vac shop for service or to Wal-Mart to buy a new vacuum. Most people don't throw away broken Rainbows, they take them in for service. That's where the Sirena will come in very handy for the Repair Shop. When someone decides they want a Rainbow (for whatever reason), they go to a vac shop for a rebuilt (or used) one. The Sirena will cost less, new, than a reconditioned E2 Rainbow. Vac shops who are Sirena dealers will carry the parts, just like they do now with Tacony products.
 
Pretty sure "wet dirt doesn't fly" is trademarked.

Rainbow patents I know of are the lighted water container, sideways spinning brushes on the power head. An ambiguous patent about how the power head connects to the canister (this is vauge enough that the Sirena probably infringes upon it). The oldest of these expires in 8 or so years. I'll write them all down when I get my hands on a current model on Friday.

Even if Rexair didn't sue, it is what a multi cyclonic Bissell is to a Dyson a cheap knockoff.

In the video the guy lifts the motor portion like it is a feather. If you haven't lifted a current Rainbow motor portion that thing is heavy.

None of the other water vacuums seem to be as much of direct copies.

There is a musical artist Sirena who has recorded songs about Rainbows.

This thing leaves a bad taste im my mouth. Rather have a refurbed D4.

It also was designed in Canada using an Italian motor... Probably assembled in China.

If it was from China I might spend $300-400 tops....

Even that I'd search craigslist for a used Rainbow.
 
Sirena

Man114 your right. i asked the Sirena company on facebook where the vacuum was assembled . they said in china. Under the supervision of the canadian engineers.
 
I own a Vacuum shop and can tell you one thing. Unlike big box stores most of your customers are either return customers or referred by other customers. Selling a unknown brand can be fairly easy as the customer is not buying a vacuum from an unknown company but from you, the vacshop they have been going to for the past 5 years, the vacuum shop their whole family and neighborhood uses.

The best thing a company that is launching a new brand can do is launch it through existing vacuum shops.

Gareth
 
I think it's "Wet Dust Can't Fly"

I don't think it's "dirt"

But if you watch the video, it's funny how it's almost as if they invented the first water filtration vacuum.

Still, I think it looks kind of cool, but I doubt that quality is not the same as Rainbow.
 
Well ralph123, Rainbows command high prices because they normally last for decades while the lesser models do not. The Rainbow is a higher level of equipment. The Sirena may pan out to be durable or it may not. It's not known as of yet. I don't find Rainbows "dubious" values at all and a great many of their users don't either. Most of their machines are sold new in the home and I've known several people personally who invited them to come and demonstrate the machine because they wanted one. I hate their demonstration model also as they are by far the pushiest but it wouldn't stop me from buying it for the reason that I like the wet pick-up ability and the shampooer in addition to the durability of the machine.

Dysonman1 you misunderstood what I wrote. I didn't state that Rainbow's customers were all "rich." I stated that they are selling to customers who are willing to purchase a higher-end machine. How they purchase is up to them regardless of the sales pitch. You cannot make people buy something if they don't REALLY want it. I've had many door-to-door reps come to my door and leave with no sale.

Anyway, I don't really care whether Sirena makes it in the U.S. market or not as I have no investment in it and am not currently in the market for a water vacuum. It may or may not be a success but it probably won't ruin Rexair. There's room enough for all.
 
Our local office does it strictly by a no pressure sales instead focusing on the merits of the machine. They also do all in house service cheaper than the the vac shops. I'm sure there are others like that, and others that aren't, a fault of the distribution system.

Unlike the Kirby guys you practicallly have to call the police on to get them out of your house.

I digress though. The Sirena is made in China, which I pretty much suspected. If it was maybe $300-400 at Sears or Wal-Mart I'd probably buy one. At $895 it seems really steep for an unproven Chinese version of a Rainbow. You could buy a used D4, possibly an E Series for that price & know parts are available, and will be in the future.

I know Rexiar sticks to that model for a good reason, because it allows them total price control.

My concern buying this would be is that it seems like an overpriced but cheaply made knockoff, they can prove me wrong by delivering a quality product. I'd still prefer it it was USA or Canadian made. This isn't like plucking down $399 for a Fantom when they first came out, this is double the cost and not even made in North America.

There are plenty of used Rainbows around. I just can't see it, maybe its me.

Maybe if they sold it on late night infomercial for $399.
 
Sirena

Its like most products designed somewhere then made or assembled in another country. But you never know it could be a really great product.
 
Since we're back on the Sirena subject I contacted them directly last night to get some more information about more technical aspects of the product. I'll see how they respond. A quick and professional reponse would leave me with a better feel for how things are going to be. Particularly if you try and buy parts or get warranty service. All the closest authorized "dealers" appear to be nothing other than internet websites.

This means that service is going to have to come from a vac shop or Sirena directly at least until a dealer network gets established that includes vac shops to repair them. Consequently I'd even set up to service them if they became a big hit, someone has to do it. If you buy from some internet site you'll be shipping it off to Canada or to a vac shop, but if the vac shop isn't a dealer they're still going to have to go to Sirena for parts.

Here we're close to the company (much like Fantom), Fantom set up to import them through Buffalo for US distribution, they eventually got into major retailers but had to establish their name through infomercials (something Sirena could do). If Sirena were to use infomercials they'd simply have to be careful as to their wording as to not infringe on any Rainbow trademarks (some of the stuff is pretty close).

So as of now they've got mostly internet dealers, not many and aside from the Canadian ones not many close to me. Price seems pretty much fixed at about $895. The markup has to be pretty hefty as they're assembled in China. I remember back when the Fantom Fury was coming from Canada (if I recall the last of them were from China) the markup was still pretty decent for a north american built product. That means it can't be totally cost prohibitive to build over hear, especially at that price.

But it can be done, Fantom did and it was only their doing that also undid them. Time will tell, I'll let everyone know if they get back to me.
 
Sirena Dealers

Sirena has only been shipping product since October 10th, 2013. There are currently 30+ North American dealers, and only 2 are solely internet based (Allbrands & Unbeatablesales). With 5 representatives currently on the road (2 in Canada and 3 in the USA) the number of dealers is expected to rise quickly.
BTW a special congratulations to our Puerto Rico and Edmonton AB dealers who sold out of product in their first 2 weeks!
There is no question the Sirena is best retailed in traditional storefront locations where customers can handle the product, ask questions and be assured they will get ongoing customer service. Of course we could offer the Sirena to the big box stores (we have other products in Costco and TheBay), however in the end the consumer would suffer and our reputation would be tarnished.
Rest assured that once we have sufficient volume (approximately 2000 units a month) production will be moved to North America, and the volume should keep the price static.
Follow this link to see the current retailers:
https://sirenasystem.ca/dealer-locator/
 

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