Royal 882 - Need quick advice

[97widerider]

Ok. Hooked on vintage Royals. Found a cheap 4000, cleaned it up, shined it up, new roller, belts, bags...good to go $60.00 altogether. Not bad. Love it, pull my medium height pile straight up and a pleasure to move around and store.

Found a 1992 (MINT) Royal 882 on ebay. With shipping I estimate it will be around $135 - 150 range. That's really not bad for the price compared to a lot of others on ebay that are in much more used condition. This 882 has a 5.4 amp motor, oil ports, carbon brushes on the side accessible by removing two caps on each side. You Royal lovers know the deal. I like the nostalgia of the older Royals that have these features.

This vacuum is really in pristine condition. My only concerns are if the bearings had not been oiled properly over the years, or the carbon brushes are worn, can they be easily found and replaced? I bet the bearings are just common stock found at any place that sells variety of motor bearings.

Last question. How is the 5.4 amps? enough power? Will it do as nice a job as my 10.5 amp Royal 4000?

I'm selling a Kirby Sentrial to a coworker to get the money for this vacuum. I love the Sentnria but I like the older Royals better. It still leaves me with a G& Kirby so it isn't the end of the world.

Or I could just wait until my Royal 4000 motor fails and buy a new replacement motor for under $100.00 that already has new brushes and bearings. Its the drop in style so I could do it myself.

Talk to me....

 

[madman]

Well...

If it has oil ports, it's probably using sintered bronze bearings, which are porous and come with oil soaked into them. There is probably a felt wicking around (which is what you oil) and they capillary the oil out of the felt as they go along. They *may* be available commercially, but I personally don't know. New bearings would be a good idea if it appears that nobody oiled them, which you'd have to disassemble it and check how dry the felts are. From my personal experiments, sintered bronze bearings don't just re-absorb oil if they've been run to the point where the felt oil wicking is dry. They need to be put in a vacuum chamber while submersed in oil to refill them, which isn't difficult if you have the equipment.

The brushes, like any brushes, are available as generic ones, and probably even as model-specific ones. I can't imagine you'll have any issue coming up with some kind of replacements.

 

[huskyvacs]

MadMan, I ran across this Slavic video that looks like "the right equipment" you described. Is this the same concept?

 

[97widerider]

Thanks for the info MadMan. This 882 may be more than I am capable/willing to deal with in terms of maintenance. Looking at the condition of the vacuum, it could very well have dried up bearings . Does not look like it was used much therefore, not oiled much. Furthermore I would be buying sight unseen so Who knows.

I am leaning more towards saving my money and just dropping in a new motor if my 4000 dies. At that point I would basically have a new vacuum again. Amazon has the motor I need for $85.00 and although Made In China, it is authentic Royal motor and I read that they are actually decent motors. Good news is the 4000 sounds and vacuums great so it could have a long long life left still. I only vacuum three 10 x 12 rooms three times a week (maybe 5 minutes of run time) twice a week.

 

[lesinutah]

Hey

The 882 is like every other royal since 1978. The bearings are odd. I have a few called old oilers where an oil port is right behind the fan. It has a felt washer in them. You can't find them anywhere. I took the felt out and loaded it with grease. I'm not putting another piece of felt in it.
I could pop rivets off and take copper bearing housing off and put a new bearing in it's place. I imagine jb weld would hold it to bearing plate. I cleaned the one out really good and packed great compact in as I have a tool I got at parts store that packs grease. It actually fixed my issue. Royals have the oil ports on the back of the motor housing base of armature sits in. I just clean and great those. The oiler port behind bearing you either cut out oiler bearing or repack bearing. I'm not a fan of doing either. I'd rather put new bearing plate with bearing in it. I guess taking housing off and putting new bearing on is same idea. I have 4 royals with these ports and I'm going to just clean bearing and regrease them. I don't want to ruin original part and greasing it is going to yield the best results. I'm not a fan at all of design as it's flawed.
As for royals there actually very user friendly. The 5.4 motor is commercial motor. It's very close to my 880s and they are not loud and clean well. Once you get the hang of it the royals are very very simple to work on. I could disassemble clean polish put back together in 2 hours. There is no Kirby that can be done that fast.
Dude look at Craigslist and thrift stores for royals. I paid $200 for my 880 and you won't find a nicer royal out there. The only ones worth over $100 are royal Everlast. The motors range from 7.5-10 amps and are a little loud. Other than that just stick to local finds for royals.
There cheap easy to work on and clean up. Fixing one up you learn quite a bit. They are suprisingly easy to learn. I take 4 screws holding front motor and nozzle on. You clean fan chamber and nozzle out. You take off fan clean bearing plate uo. Take bearing plate off and get all the shredded fabric out of motor housing. You can vacuum out or just blow out. Grease bearings. This point you can polish and put back together. The only 2 things is wiring take pictures of it. The other is when you pop off aluminum covers for carbon brushes gentle with the black plastic. Other than that nothing else. The vacuum is very easy to work on.
Les

 

[97widerider]

Thanks guys! I'm not giving up on collecting a couple more Royals I'm just not paying premium for them (even if it is still a good deal compared to what you get today for $150.00)

Furthermore, garage, thrift store and flea market finds are really more fun and you get more of a sense of, "look what I got for $25.00 honey". Not really, I have to hide them from my wife. But you get the point.

The 4000 I found for $15.00 is a gem.

Hey you got me thinking about my 4000 and the bearing I need to grease. I assume this bearing is where the fan screws onto the motor? I did not do that with mine but should I?

Thanks

 

[broomvac]

I would be shocked if you ever had motor problems with either you 4000 or this 882 you are considering. Even cheap-o vacuum motors last much longer than people expect. Something durable like a Royal motor will live longer than your carpet.

 

[97widerider]

True so true. I'm sure part of the reason is that people don't vacuum near as much as they probably should. Can't say I have ever had a vacuum motor die on me.

 

[lesinutah]

Hey

I'd not worry about the 4000. It should have 2 oil ports just grease those. I may put mine together tonight I just need to find my spindle.
Ya I have bought quite a few royals at thrift store. I bought a mid 90s for $35 has 50 ft. Cord and type b bag assembly. I got a burgundy early 90s 6 amp for $15, I got 1949 royal for $20. Paid shipping on mid 20s royal bought 880 on eBay for $75 it was made month and year I was born. The 4000 I got for $60 shipping included on eBay. I got a 1977 3 amp on eBay for $60. I had a 1030z I got from my work for free I cleaned up and sold to Blackheart. That is upright he got highest cfm and vaclabs avalir just surpassed it. The 1040z I took apart polished up and sold. I didn't ask much but I got it for free. I believe I bought a new brush roll. The bearings I just greased ports and he said it was quieter than expected. If my royals make noise small amount of WD 40 behind fan usually fixes that.
The royal you have has drop in motor and no other royals motors are like it. They are all similar to 882. Very simple design and quick repair polish and repair.
Don't pay alot for royals. I only got 4000 low ball offer and Motor is biggest I have seen. I should put it together. It is flawless and I got scratches off with steel wool. It's in mint condition and motor is freaking huge.
Ya thrift or Craigslist you can find super cheap. It's not often but it happens.
Les

 

[97widerider]

Les so the 4000 is the only Royal with an easily replaceable drop in motor? Why? I mean why wouldn’t all the models have that? Seems like the easiest and cheapest way to keep it running. I mean if my motor simply stopped working for $86 I can drop a brand new motor into it myself and basically have a brand new vacuum again.

 

[madman]

Husky, yes but in concept only. Putting oil into a ball bearing just seems like you're desperate. And using a vacuum cleaner in place of an actual vacuum pump is... not right, for many reasons lol. Also the dude sounds Finnish. Just a guess.

97widerider - don't let it scare you. It's an old-fashioned machine. Its mechanical design is from a time when it was expected that any middle class office worker would be able to take it apart with a screwdriver and a crescent wrench on a Sunday afternoon.

Les - you've been greasing sintered bronze bearings? You know that'll plug up the pores of the metal and render them useless? I mean, if you greased around the shaft, it'll work for a while until it spins the grease out.

 

[broomvac]

Yep. Ball bearings require grease. Sleeve bearings require oil. Putting the wrong lubricant in either bearing is a big no-no.

 

[broomvac]

Sleeve bearings require *non-detergent* oil, I should specify. You don’t want detergent residue clogging up the pores over time.

 

[sptyks]

Royal drop-in motors...

Derek,


 


I believe (someone correct me if I'm wrong) that all Royals made after the late 90's use Drop-in motors.


 


I own a Royal 8300 made in 2008 with 10 amp Drop-in motor. What a fantastic carpet cleaning machine it is!


 


~Stan


 


 

 

[97widerider]

Hey Stan are all these drop in models the same motor?

 

[lesinutah]

Hey

The 4000 isn't a drop in motor. Royal commercial vacuum cleaners have a line of vacuums with drop in motors. The royal catalog I posted I believe it was the 5.4 amp motor. You swap motors being a commercial line vacuum. If you bought a drop in motor it would be smaller than 10.5 amp motor. The motor would be just like 4000 having all components for easy replacement. The royal drop in motors ranges the 5.4 up to 10 amp and everyone in between. It's just a convenient time saving for commercial customers to repair vacuum as quick as possible.
Each vacuum model has a few motors it can take. My 3 amp I can't stuff a 10 amp motor in it probably a 5.4 would be the biggest.
Madmen no I grease bearings correctly. I have two copper oiler tops I ordered the last 2 for them. I lubricate with correct grease oil etc. I know what to use on bearings as my brain isn't on same page as my mouth at times. The vacuums are done correctly and my head was up my arse.
Long work week blah.
Les

 

[sptyks]

Drop-in motors...

Derek,


 


Les is correct. The Drop-in motors range in size from 5.4 amp to 10 amp. My 8300 has a 10 amp Drop-in motor.


 


~Stan


 


 

 

[97widerider]

Since my 4000 is a 1999 model and does not have oil ports nor accessible carbon brushes and a 10.5 amp i was under impression it was drop in so....

Since it is not and I can still buy a complete motor assembly for it from either ereplacement parts and amazon, is it easily replaceable by a novice if my current motor dies?

 

[kirbyklekter]

I thought "drop in" motors

were like the motor in say an old Hoover Convertable or Sanitaire. Self contained, just drop it in, wire it up and go to town. Motors with the field windings attached to the housing and usually have access to the brushes with the caps on outside I thought were the non- drop in types. If you stood two Royals side by side, one with drop in , the other with other type, how different would they appear. Still learning!