New "EU" vacuums have less suction than 30 year old vacuum!

[vacerator]

It is most

confusing, because global ecological initiatives were supposed to move us all away from a throw away society. Cars have lasted longer since the 1970's with world class quality, but other durable goods seem to not last as long, like vacuums, and other appliances.
So is the global money machine bleeding our wallets? if so, what do they do with the profits? Are they invested in our retirement accounts, and or portfolios via the stock markets, or into developing nations economies of scale, or simply taken by the corporations in a greedy scheme?
I'm not a Zeitgeist proponent now, nor will I be.

 

[turbo500]

Mike, I think one of the problems is that people expect to pay cheap and get quality. Vacuums are cheaper now than they've ever been, but of course there has to be a sacrifice somewhere and it's usually the quality that is given up.

 

[vacerator]

True Chris,

A Kirby, Filter Queen, or a Rainbow costs upwards of a thousand dollars US.
However, when our daughter purchased an Electrolux Oxygen 3 cylinder for $500 in 2010 that was a lot of money to them, as they were just starting out. It only lasted a few years. The cost to repair it was more than $200. They opted to scrap it and get a Shark, which has already lasted almost four years at half the price.

 

[turbo500]

Kirby, Rainbow, Filter Queen and Vorwerk are all expensive here too, all retailing for over £1000 and only sold D2D.

The price of vacuums here has pretty much stayed the same, dating back to the mid-80's. Prices range for around £80-£250, give or take. But of course, the value of £80 now compared to what it was worth in 1985 is a huge factor. Prices don't seem to have changed with inflation.

 

[vacerator]

Rule of 72?

My brother in law is a CPA. $28,000 US in 1980 roughly equates to $72,000 in todays dollar value.

 

[oliveoiltinfoil]

The EU go to far on most regulations....

 

[Mike81]

Importance of good design

Although EU regulations will limit the suction/airflow in the new vacuums good thing is that now manufacturers have to carefully designed their vacuums to maximize the performance.
One good example is my Simple Value Bagless Upright vs Electrolux UltraFlex Canister (bagless).
Both have 700 watt motor, but suction and especially the airflow is totally different. Electrolux has MUCH better airfow and suction comparad to the cheap Simple Value vacuum.

 

[Mike81]

It is too far

oliveoiltinfoil
I totally agree with you. Something like 1200 watts would be much better without energy label, so manufacturers wouldn't need to "hunt" A for energy = around 700W.

 

[keiththomas]

Poor Fan Design

I have heard the wattage argument back in the 1980's, The trouble is many machines have a poor Turbine design, Thats what makes the different not a fast running motor. The Proof some older machines lasted becasue the motor did not burn out so quickly and had a good turbine design. Strange they went the other way. This is to con people that higher wattage meant better cleaning

 

[n0oxy]

today's motors spinning faster

These days, most vacuums are using one stage motors that spin much faster which is why many vacuums sound like high pitch screamers. Compare the sound of many of today's vacuums with the sound of many vacuums from the 1970's and 1980's such as those from Kenmore, Electrolux, Eureka, etc. Many vacuums used two stage motors that could move just as much air while spinning slower and using less power, and personally I think they sounded better. I'm thinking the reason manufacturers switched to the screamer motors was because they are lighter and cheaper. I actually didn't get in to collecting vacuums until a few years ago, does anyone know when the screamers actually started to make a big appearance?

 

[vacerator]

"when did screamers appear"

About 1985 or so. When Eureka moved to plastic canister design on their Express line. Yes, on full speed, they are quite loud.
A middle range dark red and white model was used by Allie Sheedy in "Maid to order" with Beverly Deangelo.
I think Hoover switched to single stage 12 amp screamers on their Futura models after discontinuing the Dimension 1000 range.
Electrolux stuck with 2 stage motors I believe.
Not sure about Kenmore. Probably when Panasonic came in.

 

[turbo500]

when the screamers actually started to make a big appearance

mid-80's for us but only on the very cheap brands. Goblin cylinders of the 80's were noisey - a combination of cheap motors and no sound insulation. Infact, at one point, Goblin recommended wearing ear defenders in the manual for some of their cylinder and multifuctional cleaners.

The real explosion of screamey motors happened in the late 90's though.

 

[n0oxy]

screamers

Yes, I think there were some Kenmore whispertone models that still sounded decent in the 1990's. The European Electrolux uses one stage motors I think, my ultra one is a one stage. In the United States, the company that used to be called Electrolux, now called aerus, has now switched to a one stage motor on their classic model, it's not quite as screamy as some others, but you can definitely tell the difference.

 

[real1shep]

I don't agree with the cars are made better since 1970, comment. There are a lot of things at play;better metallurgy(understanding of), better lubrication(oils/grease are better), better electrical connectors(something time/experience has made available to the auto industry) and a better understanding of road wear and consumer treatment.

It's not uncommon for a modern car to have its first major tune-up at 100,000 miles...a point when cars of old often needed their engines rebuilt or at least the head(s)done.

But the downside to this is that modern cars are made to a price point and with the idea that you trade up every 4-8yrs. They have become incredibly complex with an array of computers talking to each other(on average, Mercedes has 46 on board computers). The majority of parts aren't fixable which leads to the high cost of parts replacement.

There are pros and cons to each side of the argument. Many cars of old were simple to work on and with some tinkering, could conceivably last you your lifetime. Today's cars are safer and require less maintenance, but they're made at a price point and are sacrificial as they age out and fall apart.

I think with vacuums, it's the same and a good analogy here. When Electrolux made the Super J, they were trying to make the most powerful canister vacuum they knew how and with quality. That mindset is long gone for most consumer vacs.

Kevin

 

[sptyks]

I can think of...

a few vacuums still made today with high performance and High Quality:


 


Miele


Sebo


Kirby


Royal


 


These are expensive machines but you get what you pay for.


 


 

 

[vacerator]

Well of course

todays engines last longer, run cleaner, need less tune ups, but other dynamics are not like they were in the 70's.
An Oldsmobile V8 engine for example was as smooth after 100,000 miles as when it was new. Tolerances are much closer today, requiring better lubrication also.
There is accuracy, and precision. Do we get both today?
An Olds Toronado made a cross country trip using one quart of oil with it's 455 cubic inch engine. That type of extended driving is hard on an engine because of the sustained heat and friction. Modern engines have lighter blocks, pistons, etc.
Synthetic oils operate at a higher temp., but lubricate better.
More aluminum is also used instead of malleable and nodular iron, which oil could better permeate. Lighter weight attributes to higher efficiency and fuel economy.
We may get what we pay for, but eventually modern high tech cars all have problems, and yes electronics are a major factor in that.

 

[oliveoiltinfoil]

@Mike81

Without turning this political, its one of the reason I voted leave. Not because i care too much for vacuum motors, but its an example of meddling in our affairs, pointless, useless legislation that does nothing but cost us money.

You know they want to target kettles and toasters next, as well as lawnmowers?

 

[turbo500]

The legislation was welcome. Manufacturers were getting away with using high power motors as a way around doing any real R&D. Vacuums were becoming lower in quality and more unreliable, with all those broken, single cyclone, high power vacuums cluttering up landfills. Something had to change.

 

[Mike81]

I personally hate those screamer vacuums. My sister gave to me her couple years old cheap bagless vacuum, because it was constantly glogging and loosing suction due to the poor cyclone design. It has 2100 watt motor and it sounds awful. Loud high pitched motor will make my ears ring.
If I compare it to my Philips P74 with 1000 watt two stage motor difference in sound is huge. Philips sounds very smooth and it basically has just sound of airflow and it truly move a lot of air.

 

[real1shep]

The US auto manufacturers finally took a cue from the Japanese and Germans for making tighter tolerances and more precision in making their autos. They had to....sales were draining to overseas cars. So now US cars are often an amalgamation of foreign drive trains/engines etc, but assembled here. I've lost track of who does what and what parts are foreign. It's a price point game in autos now.

Take any of those old motors and blueprint them and you usually had fantastic results if the shop knew what they were doing. Now it's normal for close tolerances and better metallurgy/lubrication to eek out fuel economy and the mistaken belief that you can go longer between oil changes and tune-ups. Aluminum, composites...all have a hand in this.

As expensive as cars are today along with higher payments, it makes sense to many to go back and buy older cars and funnel money into them. Depends what you want out of your auto experience. Same thinking in vacuums of today and yesterday.

Kevin