LUX suction

[Real1]

I'm frustrated for my efforts....need some assurance.

The other day I was using one of my 1205's and I thought I heard the motor slightly spool down...in other words, decrease in RPM accompanied by what I thought was a change in suction. So....I took the motor out, cleaned, re-oiled the bearing, checked the brushes and burnished the commutator. Put it all back together and the same suction...nothing changed. Then....I figured I'd try my other 1205 motor (vac in the process of restoration, so partially disassembled). Took out that motor, worked the same magic, tried it, same suction and rpm (by ear)...no change.


 


Baffled, I took out my restored G and tried the two against each other in suction tests (informal like against my arm skin, don't have any tool yet to check vacuum) and it seemed that the G has slightly more pull.  Both hoses are genuine LUX replacements. Shouldn't the 1205 have a slight edge in suction over the G?? I've been using the 1205 everyday because I thought it had more suction, now I'm really confused....

I doubt if the windings are weak in both 1205 motors, although I guess it's possible. When I restored my G's, one motor was definitely stronger than the other, but I never checked the brush holder colors to see if I had the updated motor. The motors on the 1205 are identical in appearance and work the same..


 


Kevin

 

[henry200]

Don't quote me on this but I believe the late Gs and early 1205s shared the same motor so theoretically they should pull the same suction.   Many years ago I had a late model 1205 that started doing what you describe: suddenly, unpredictably slowing down a bit.  When it started doing that consistently I took it to my local vac shop for repair but ended up trading it for a brand new Olympia model which had just been traded-in for a new Rainbow.

 

[venson]

@Real1

Hi Kevin,

If my recall is correct -- and it may not be -- the 1205 had the same wattage draw as the Model G -- 535 watts. Nonetheless, the lower wattage draw in general is what wins my praise for the older Electrolux machines. They were designed -- machines and cleaning tools -- to make best use of air flow without having to go for overkill re the motor's juice requirements. I've never loved the Electrolux power nozzles much but as for general cleaning other brands of the '60s had long been using motors with higher power draw and Electrolux held its own right along with them.

The company did step up motor power I believe with the J.

I've always maintained that design means everything and earlier Electrolux machines seemed to never fail to incorporate good looks and efficiency without having to be dynamo powered. That also applies to all those 350 or so watt uprights Hoover made back in the day.

 

[Real1]

Well.....

in defense of the 1205,  it still cleans just fine. I'm just a stickler for things that change in motor functions-the urge to 'fix it' I guess.  I would be content if the G and 1205 pulled the same, but I think the G has a touch more suction. I know it's not the best method, but I even pulled off the hoses and just put the palm of my hand against the suction end of the machines for comparison.


 


I asked before to Mason 'silence', but was curious how some of you guys measure vacuum....you talk about a tool....something other than the steel ball tool the LUX salesmen used...? I guess that's the next step-to accurately measure vacuum 'lift'. And I totally agree...it's not always about power but cleaning efficiency. The old metal body LUX's do that and then some.

 


Yeah, I think that's correct; late model G motor is the same as 1205...come to think of it. My two G's are turquoise,  but I think one got the tan G 'updated' motor because it's always had more suction.. 


 


Kevin

[this post was last edited: 3/6/2012-22:34]

 

[frank1002us]

to check which vacuum is stronger

put a new strong post card between two hoses and try to separate them when both vacuums are running. the post card stays with the stronger vacuum

 

[r2d2]

Hose Pilot

I have piloted Electrolux vacuums my entire life and sold them in the 70's. I began selling 1205s but often pushed customers into a rebuilt G with a power nozzle upgrade. The whole package along with a hose wrapper cord was $152.00 when the 1205 was at $279.00. I love the G because they are so quiet and I enjoy their dependability. I have used a friends 1205 and it did the same thing although his would speed back up again so I attrtibuted it to electrical draw somewhere else, like when the lights dim when the refrigerator kicks on or the washer goes into spin. I use a Silverado at home as my daily driver downstairs and tan model G upstairs with an Electrolux Gaurdian upright for quick pick ups between using the Silverado. I also been known to suck around a little with other brands on the side.

 

[danemodsandy]

KW:

Was that $279 price for a 1205 with or without the PN? And which PN would it have been - the PN-1 or PN-2?

 

[danemodsandy]

Oh!

I just figured out who you are, KW.

Still treasure my Dormeyer Princess, and think of you often.

 

[pnluxconvlvr]

Same power drop

The 1205 I sold last year did the same thing. The motor tone going lower for a minute or two and then coming back up. The 1205 I have now does not do it. Maybe it has something to do with the armature and temperature as it seemed to happen after it had been running for a while. Does it vibrate at 60

 

[venson]

@Real1

"I know it's not the best method, but I even pulled off the hoses and just put the palm of my hand against the suction end of the machines for comparison."

Hi,

With the 1205 and G that's not a great way to test pull because the 1205 has the slots inside the suction port to allow for the hose's electrical connection hook up. Air for suction may bleed without the hose in place.

Steel ball and even bowling ball tests don't prove much either. I did that last year with Oreck's Ultimate Hand Vac. It actually did latch onto the bowling ball and hold it. However, I had an irate customer come back roaring like a lion because he thought if it could do all that he could use it to clean the heavily trafficked stairways of a multiple dwelling he owned. I don't think his view was practical but at $150 a pop whose prone to question a buyer's plan for use though, had I known, I would have said something. The bag and the machine were way too small and clogged up quickly.

Taking a lesson from the experience I took to being sure buyers knew in advacne that particular vac was meant for general household duty only.

 

[Real1]

After.....

I was here last, I Googled around a bit and found a gauge that's meant to measure vacuum lift in inches of water. Probably get that to have as a tool anyway...thanks Frank for the postcard idea;sounds simple but effective.

 


Interesting feedback on the 1205, thanks guys. @venson...probably serve you well to ask the customers exactly what they intend to use the vacuum for. Folks get some crazy ideas with vacuum models and price points. Good point on the electrical slots of the 1205, although they're pretty small.


 


Kevin

 

[elux89]

@Real1

Go to a vac shop, or look on line to purchase a suction/waterlift gauge. That will tell you how strong the motor is pulling. But be forewarned, you will get different ratings with the same motors (standard deviation), plus atmospherice pressure will cause differences, plus the amount of voltage coming through the lines will also affect suction.

Also, consider purchasing a Baird aiflow meter as well. With this, you now can test for CFM in addition to your suction (inches of lift) with the suction gauge.

Hope this helps

 

[elux89]

@venson

Nice to see you on this site. Haven't seen or heard Carmen comment on the other site for quite some time. Haven't chatted with you for a while either. We need more individuals here like yourself whom have well thought out, almost scientific evidence, conversations/advice. Me, like many others don't post much here anymore, we are tired of the "childish" behaviour that goes on.

 

[rugsucker]

1205 motor

May not be a factor in this case but some 1205 brush holders will with time and vibration have the metal sleeve slide toward the comm on motor.Should always be looked at and if sleeve is sliding toward motor,remove brush holder and tap until sleeve and rear edge of plastic portion are flush at top and bottom.Then with pliers or cutters make a downward crimp so sleeve will stay in place.Later brush holders had a fix of small bump on sleeve fitting in groove of plastic holder.If sleeve has touched motor make sure carbon brush will slide freely before reassembly.--The G and 1205 are both good but many salesmen,collectors and users do consider the G as the best of the 2.The 'greatest' Elux are probably the XXX(older,no pn)G(newer with power nozzle).

 

[venson]

@elux89 . . .

Hi,

How are you? Thank you much for the kind sentiment.

Carmine, is out west with wife and family living quite the life I understand. It's been a couple of months since I last touched base but, per the best of my knowledge, he's well and having a great time.

Venson

 

[floor-a-matic]

My 1205 & Model L are doing the same thing as described above; at times the motor slows down a bit, then spins normally fine.

VERY many thanks to those that post the problem/solution about this.

 

[Real1]

@Vernon

Thank you for the heads up on Baird airflow meter. Sounds very much like a worthy tool to own.<a name="start_16153.172287">

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I read a primer on vacuum facts last night that explained a lot of principles on lift, CFM, watts/amps, flow-through cooling etc.  


 


Kevin

 

[electrikbroomgu]

Motor slow down

My mothers 1973 newly purchased L has had the motor slow down issue since new. She would be vacuuming for about 10 minutes and the motor would literally die down with a crackle and then straighten it'self out shortly after. Sometimes I would turn it off, count to 10 and then turn it back on and it would be fine. I have had her motor apart several times, one to replace the fan end bearing and the other to run a polishing stone on the commutators. Hers does not have the brush holder issue as there is a small bump on the sleeve portion to keep them from sliding. Incidentally mom has said that the machine has been running perfect for several years now and hasn't noticed it slow down in a while.
The 2 model L's I have in my collection both have the slow down issue but none of the 1205's seem to so this seems to affect certain years mainly the early 70's motors in both L and 1205.

 

[gsheen]

@real one

vac gauges and airflow meters are valuable tools, but from what I have read you need a rpm meter, we use one all the time to make sure that motors are spinning at there correct speed. this will also be able to tell you if the motor is dipping a bit.

when getting a airflow meter make sure of the range, direct air machines move more air than most can handle. also get one that can Handel a fair amount of suction.

We have one system that incorporates both to give a more a curate result.

Gareth