Lamb Advantek motors

[DesertTortoise]

Has anyone here replaced an old through flow canister motor with one of the new Lamb Advantek motors? Some of the air watt numbers on these are eye-popping. It is tempting to give one of the 5.7 inchers a try in an old vac and see what kind of Frankenstein monster one could create. Just wondering if anyone has gone this route and what to look out for. It is tempting, very tempting.

 

[bikerray]

Never heard of a Lamb Advantek motor, do you mean Lamb Ametek?

 

[LionKCommander]

If the Ametek blows your mind try a Domel 5.7, I put a two stage Domel in my old eureka Ironside and it was like putting a big block engine in a pinto and I also have a Domel in my lux renaissance and it increased the suction so much the check bag light will not turn off and it's also smoother and quieter than it's ever been.

 

[eurekastar]

I've done it. The motor in my Tristar DXL got fried so I replaced with the motor with a Lamb motor with more umph. I had to modify the exhaust basket so that the new motor would fit. That's one thing I would check is the motor length and make sure there is plenty of clearance for it.

The suction and airflow in the new motor are significantly higher than the factory motor. It basically turned the Tristar Animal into the Tristar BEAST!!!

 

[DesertTortoise]

Here are the two motors I'm thinking of.

The first is basically the same 115923 motor I use as a spare motor in vacs that have motors out for rebuild, but with a new type of fan system. 501 air watts is nothing to sniff at. The 115923 version with an older style fan has 447 air watts. Same motor, different fan, big difference in performance. This motor would drop into pretty much any old Kenmore canister vac through the early 1990's. The fan shape won't work in a Whispertone or later. At 11.3 amps max you are not going to pop any breakers in the house if you run this motor with a powered floor brush, but suction of 142 inches of water lift might suck the hose flat or lift the carpet off the padding!

http://dev.ametekfsm.com/Bulletins/119800-00.pdf

This motor will also fit my vacuums motor bays ok (I've measured), and 557 air watts has my full attention (boy howdy does it) but peak amps are 13.2. I think I might pop the breaker if I used that motor with a Powermate. I might melt the cord too! Interestingly the higher amp motor has less water lift but higher airflow.

http://dev.ametekfsm.com/Bulletins/122093-00.pdf

Tell me if I'm wrong but my gut is telling me that the lower amp 119800 motor is the way to go. Is that the motor you used Eurekastar? Or did you use 115923?

 

[eurekastar]

I wish I knew which motor I selected. I searched for an email from I ordered the motor and nothing is coming up. I do remember that I searched for about two weeks for exactly the right motor before making a decision. The number of 5.7" thru-flow motors is mind boggling. I looked at Domel motors too. I'd like to try one sometime. Other then taking the darn thing apart and looking at the stock tag, I just can't tell which one it was. I do recall that the motor was rated at around 10.5 amps and it seems like its airflow was rated at 140 cfm. Hope that helps!

 

[DesertTortoise]

Does Domel sell a through flow motor? All I see on their website are tangential and peripheral discharge motors and nothing over 2 hp. They don't show data for water lift, air flow, air watts and what rpm they are doing what at.

 

[eurekastar]

Take a look at this!

http://www.usavacuum.com/Domel-Vacuum-Motor-p/095-49637202.htm

 

[DesertTortoise]

I was getting all excited looking at the specs on that Domel motor until I saw the peak amps. Heh, heh, heh, 14.35 amps, that motor is for central vacs only. Put a powered floor brush on it and you pop the breaker. Heck, 14.35 amps might pop a weak 15 amp breaker. I also think the air watts are a misprint. It's probably 685 which is still darned healthy. 1685 air watts? That's the intake on an F-16!

The motor you show in your Tristar I'm pretty certain is the 115923 motor. The rubber mount makes it hard to tell. Great motor, it is the same one I use as my spare. 447 air watts at around 22000 rpm, a nice understressed old school motor. They are very well regarded and sold by many vacuum suppliers as replacements for any number of old Lamb motors. Lamb didn't cheap out anywhere on that motor.

On the Avocado Bomber that motor had so much suction it visibly flexed the bag lid cover inward if you put the palm of your hand over the hose end! You could get the tools jumping on the lid by popping your hand on and off the hose end a few times. That's 447 air watts. The 119800 motor has 501 air watts, top of the line Aerus Lux territory. I'd love to put that motor into an old square beige Kenmore canister.

 

[eurekastar]

That's hilarious! I'd love to see the Eureka "flex" its muscle! I once owned a Metropolitan Vacuum that would easily launch when placed near a wall. That's a design flaw. There should be some kind of baffle in the exhaust to direct the airflow upward! It always blew up debris (mainly dog hair), making it hard to vacuum a bare floor.

 

[eurekastar]

That's it!

I typed in that part number and recognized the website from which I ordered the motor. Sure enough, I had an account set up and check my account history. There was my order from 2012. That's the motor. Lamb 115923

http://www.blowermotorsplus.com/Ametek_115923_Blower_Vacuum_Motor_4M903_p/115923.htm

 

[DesertTortoise]

According to the data tag on the underside of the lid of the Avocado Bomber, the original motor has 44 cfm airflow and sealed suction of 100 inchs of water. 115923 pulls the same 100 inches of water but airflow is 122 cfm.

http://dev.ametekfsm.com/Bulletins/115923.pdf

 

[floor-a-matic]

<span style="font-family: comic sans ms,sans-serif;">I put in a Ametek 115923 motor on my EXL TriStar; & usually put on TriStar A101s & MGs that originally had the VM3 motor</span>

 

[eurekastar]

Wow! That's a vast improvement in airflow!

 

[DesertTortoise]

So which of these two to choose?

http://dev.ametekfsm.com/Bulletins/115923.pdf

http://dev.ametekfsm.com/Bulletins/119800-00.pdf

The somewhat older design 115923 has a bit more airflow than the newer motor with the Advantek fans but look at the suction of the Advantek motor 119800! It's also interesting, if you study those data tables, to see their performance through a 1.25 inch orifice, the size of most vacuum wands and at .075 inches where both motors have their highest air watt readings. Hard to make a good choice isn't it. Suction vs airflow? What cleans your carpet better?

The one last thing I have to contact Lamb for a bulletin on another motor that is a version of 115923 with "eternity brushes" and I think a different fan. They don't have the bulletin for it on their website.

Fun to consider the possibilities for a hot rod vacuum project.

 

[eurekastar]

I think it would depend on the design of the power nozzle. If you use the high suction motor, it seems like you would need a nozzle/brush roll combination that would do a better job of setting up positive agitation. I would think the positive agitation would assist in moving the nozzle if a suction seal occurs. For me, that is the only reason you'd want to use the higher suction motor. Otherwise, it is airflow for me.

 

[jade_angel]

Seems like the loss of a little airflow to gain a lot of suction, there. One factor with high sealed suction, is that it helps to maintain airflow over a restricted air path (like a hose). I wonder if, in practice, the 119800 wouldn't produce better airflow at the carpet than the 115923 would? I know that happens with tandem-motor central systems: those with dual parallel motors have more airflow at the unit, but those with dual serial motors - for more suction - end up with more airflow at the nozzle due to maintaining it better through the restricted air path.

Now, the question would be, what vacuum to hot-rod? Tristars and Filter Queens seem like obvious options; what about, say, a Kenmore?

 

[DesertTortoise]

I'm thinking about this thing.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/19126842668...DX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1426.l2648#ht_576wt_1265

I have two of these already, a 3.9 with a two speed motor and a 4.1 with an infinitely variable speed motor and the on/off switch on the hose. Without writing a dissertation, of all the vacs I have these are my favorites to actually use. As a tool, not a collectable, but as a day to day working vac these are very tough to beat.

They are amenable to being fitted with modern filtration, which I have done, and HEPA dust bags intended for several Numatic vacuums. Motor exhaust is well confined making it possible to HEPA filter the exhaust and not have air leaking out other seams. On my Electrolux and newer Kenmore vacs, motor exhaust circulates everywhere and comes out of several places.

The 115923 motor is a direct swap for what is in there now. The 119800 motor might require me to drill some new holes to line up with the mounting bolt holes. It is hard to tell from the dimensions on the bulletin for that motor. The motor seal ring would seal the old holes. Dimensionally it'll fit. The Advantek motors have longer fan with a conical end, making them very difficult or impossible to mount in more modern vacs with their motors laying on their side. I have not seen one with any room to spare for a bigger motor. On the beige lunch box this is not a problem. Lots of room for a bigger fan on these.

Based on owning one for 32 years, the only things that fail on them are the cord retractors and hoses. I can get new cord retractors. Yep, I found two sources for them. Cord color won't match but who cares if all you are doing is making a working vac? Only the unavailability of hoses makes me reluctant to pull the trigger. If I could build up a small supply of straight hoses I would do it. Without good hoses it's just a pipe dream.