Introduction and a Repair Question
- Thread starter lotsofkirbys
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vacuumman
Well-known member
I have a junker 1-CR motor unit. It's been sitting outside for several years, and the motor won't turn on, even though the headlight does. However, it has the original switch. I also have an original handle with the plastic piece you need. If you are interested, please send an email to the address in my profile.
lotsofkirbys
Active member
Thank you all...
For this amazing welcome! I never expected to get much of a response when I posted on here.
@lesinutah. Oh...that's what you were talking about. Thanks for the pic!
Everyone else! Thank you for all the help! I'll try to pay it back best I can.
For this amazing welcome! I never expected to get much of a response when I posted on here.
@lesinutah. Oh...that's what you were talking about. Thanks for the pic!
Everyone else! Thank you for all the help! I'll try to pay it back best I can.
kirbyklekter
Well-known member
It's obvious,
You hit the jackpot writing here with your project. Welcome. I want to encourage you to stay the course and not become discouraged if you encounter any snags along the way. The bag looks great from what I can see. As you probably know the 1-CR is the first of the new larger size Kirby's.There are little things about this model that make it unique within the Kirby line.
When I got mine it was in pretty crusty shape. Sitting out in the rain, soaked, by a dumpster there's no way I could turn my back on it. All restored it's been a keeper for 21 years and running great. If you keep it, it will be testament to all the help you received from the many generous members here at Vacuumland. Best to you,Billy
You hit the jackpot writing here with your project. Welcome. I want to encourage you to stay the course and not become discouraged if you encounter any snags along the way. The bag looks great from what I can see. As you probably know the 1-CR is the first of the new larger size Kirby's.There are little things about this model that make it unique within the Kirby line.
When I got mine it was in pretty crusty shape. Sitting out in the rain, soaked, by a dumpster there's no way I could turn my back on it. All restored it's been a keeper for 21 years and running great. If you keep it, it will be testament to all the help you received from the many generous members here at Vacuumland. Best to you,Billy
lotsofkirbys
Active member
Billy
Thanks for the encouragement! Yes the bag is in great shape. Would you recommend washing it? If you would, how would you go about it?
Thanks for the encouragement! Yes the bag is in great shape. Would you recommend washing it? If you would, how would you go about it?
lotsofkirbys
Active member
One more thing
What would be the correct technique for separating the motor assembly on these pre-omega Kirby's? I can't find a forum thread that has information on these machines. The assembly looks different to the omega and tradition in thread #34091. I don't want to break something.
https://www.vacuumland.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?34091
What would be the correct technique for separating the motor assembly on these pre-omega Kirby's? I can't find a forum thread that has information on these machines. The assembly looks different to the omega and tradition in thread #34091. I don't want to break something.
https://www.vacuumland.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?34091
texaskirbyguy
Well-known member
First of all, welcome to the forum!
I am a bit late to the party (as usual), but unfortunately work, medical issues, and rehab has been taking up most of my time for the past year or so.
I am happy to see young people working with electro-mechanical stuff like I was at that age (really from age 6 to present!) I was into go-karts, bicycles, and audio equipment back then, as well as fans and other small appliances. You are at an ideal age to learn by doing and we will help you as best we can.
You CAN do this!
Everything looks intimidating when you lack the experience, but as you learn, it becomes almost 'common sense' - if you have the knack, and it sounds like you do... I was intimidated by replacing Kirby bearings until 2017 when I finally just did it. And restored the whole machine since it was all apart. After then I was restoring one vac after another, rapid fire - no major problems. It was fun, too!
I had made a thread with common Kirby specific tips and tricks that might help you out, as well:
https://www.vacuumland.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?34091_7
It looks like you may be set on parts - kudos to all here whom have chipped in to help provide them!
Lots of used parts are available for these models, possibly because I had saturated the members here with 1CR parts units a couple years back, lol... I had brought home a pickup load of them back in 2019 when a friend closed his Kirby repair shop of 40+ years; I could not keep them all due to space constraints.
If you cannot get what you need here, I may have what you are looking for. I know I have the switch mechanism. I have the socket, too, but it can be a bit tedious to wire in depending on how your wiring was modified.
Unfortunately, I will be unreliable as I am scheduled for shoulder surgery next week. I will not be able to dig for parts since most are buried in boxes in inaccessable areas...
I will however be available for online help if you need it. Get my contact email from my profile in the event I am absent here too long.
Enjoy your 1CR - it is an odd-duck for sure. This was the transitioning to wide nozzle and larger motor right before UL double insulated rule came into play and had them redesigning it into the upcoming Omega).
Most of the motor unit parts are unique to this unit, including the motor and large castings. However the bare switches and socket are shared with the D50 and D80. The power switch brackets are unique.
I have a 1CR to restore this fall or spring, depending on my recovery. I will certainly make a thread for it, since it is an unusual machine. I also have a D80 to restore.
Enjoy the adventure of your restoration, and keep us posted!
-Rob Y
I am a bit late to the party (as usual), but unfortunately work, medical issues, and rehab has been taking up most of my time for the past year or so.
I am happy to see young people working with electro-mechanical stuff like I was at that age (really from age 6 to present!) I was into go-karts, bicycles, and audio equipment back then, as well as fans and other small appliances. You are at an ideal age to learn by doing and we will help you as best we can.
You CAN do this!
Everything looks intimidating when you lack the experience, but as you learn, it becomes almost 'common sense' - if you have the knack, and it sounds like you do... I was intimidated by replacing Kirby bearings until 2017 when I finally just did it. And restored the whole machine since it was all apart. After then I was restoring one vac after another, rapid fire - no major problems. It was fun, too!
I had made a thread with common Kirby specific tips and tricks that might help you out, as well:
https://www.vacuumland.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?34091_7
It looks like you may be set on parts - kudos to all here whom have chipped in to help provide them!
Lots of used parts are available for these models, possibly because I had saturated the members here with 1CR parts units a couple years back, lol... I had brought home a pickup load of them back in 2019 when a friend closed his Kirby repair shop of 40+ years; I could not keep them all due to space constraints.
If you cannot get what you need here, I may have what you are looking for. I know I have the switch mechanism. I have the socket, too, but it can be a bit tedious to wire in depending on how your wiring was modified.
Unfortunately, I will be unreliable as I am scheduled for shoulder surgery next week. I will not be able to dig for parts since most are buried in boxes in inaccessable areas...
I will however be available for online help if you need it. Get my contact email from my profile in the event I am absent here too long.
Enjoy your 1CR - it is an odd-duck for sure. This was the transitioning to wide nozzle and larger motor right before UL double insulated rule came into play and had them redesigning it into the upcoming Omega).
Most of the motor unit parts are unique to this unit, including the motor and large castings. However the bare switches and socket are shared with the D50 and D80. The power switch brackets are unique.
I have a 1CR to restore this fall or spring, depending on my recovery. I will certainly make a thread for it, since it is an unusual machine. I also have a D80 to restore.
Enjoy the adventure of your restoration, and keep us posted!
-Rob Y
Ben
Has a diagram of the classic. I'm going solely off memory.
If you remove the safety switch screw you should be able to disconnect the safety switch or if there is an opening near the axle you can leave the safety switch attached and pull wiring. Then above the lever that rotates and holds the top of the nozzle above it to the right and the left arescrewz that need to be taken out.
You then focus on the outer shell ( the pie that goes over the mot I r that the switch and rear wheels connect to. I'm not sure which near the back where the switch and wheels are since yours is modified. Once the shell is removed there is 1 screw that holds the front plate on(the piece you took the screws out first and the safety switch. . There is a few screws holding it in and they need to be removed.
With the outer motor housing and screws off the front and rear motor housing the front of the fan chamber should come off. Leave the carbon brushes in until you remove the fan. There will be a small opening wher you put a screw driver to stop the motor from twisting when you spin the fan to remove it from the top of the armature. Then with the fan off If you remove the 4sma screws holding the bearing plate on. Take the screws off. With the bearing plate off take out the carbon brushes but leave the carbon brush housing. The top of the armature pull the armature out. Leave the coil in and don't mess with the wiring. This should be all you need to do without removing or breaking anything.
Has a diagram of the classic. I'm going solely off memory.
If you remove the safety switch screw you should be able to disconnect the safety switch or if there is an opening near the axle you can leave the safety switch attached and pull wiring. Then above the lever that rotates and holds the top of the nozzle above it to the right and the left arescrewz that need to be taken out.
You then focus on the outer shell ( the pie that goes over the mot I r that the switch and rear wheels connect to. I'm not sure which near the back where the switch and wheels are since yours is modified. Once the shell is removed there is 1 screw that holds the front plate on(the piece you took the screws out first and the safety switch. . There is a few screws holding it in and they need to be removed.
With the outer motor housing and screws off the front and rear motor housing the front of the fan chamber should come off. Leave the carbon brushes in until you remove the fan. There will be a small opening wher you put a screw driver to stop the motor from twisting when you spin the fan to remove it from the top of the armature. Then with the fan off If you remove the 4sma screws holding the bearing plate on. Take the screws off. With the bearing plate off take out the carbon brushes but leave the carbon brush housing. The top of the armature pull the armature out. Leave the coil in and don't mess with the wiring. This should be all you need to do without removing or breaking anything.
lotsofkirbys
Active member
Thanks for the help!
@texaskirbyguy. The link I attached to this thread was the same one you put up! It's greatly helped me!
@Les. I have the fan off. I found an old thread (2006-ish) that was someone asking how to remove the fan on a D80. Is the bearing plate supposed to just pop off after the screws are removed? I removed all of them but it's pretty rusty...so I'm not sure if it's just stuck and need to just pry it off, or if I need to do another step.
Also. Isn't the fan supposed to have a date stamp/wheel on it? All I can find on mine is 1189 (The Scott Fetzer logo) 14 and three circular indentations right above that. The fan is metal so I would assume it's original right?
@texaskirbyguy. The link I attached to this thread was the same one you put up! It's greatly helped me!
@Les. I have the fan off. I found an old thread (2006-ish) that was someone asking how to remove the fan on a D80. Is the bearing plate supposed to just pop off after the screws are removed? I removed all of them but it's pretty rusty...so I'm not sure if it's just stuck and need to just pry it off, or if I need to do another step.
Also. Isn't the fan supposed to have a date stamp/wheel on it? All I can find on mine is 1189 (The Scott Fetzer logo) 14 and three circular indentations right above that. The fan is metal so I would assume it's original right?
texaskirbyguy
Well-known member
The bearing plate is supposed to just come off but usually it is stuck since it is a close fit and rust, corrosion, and dirt holds it tight.
See picture 7 at the top of my 505 resto thread for how I get them off.
https://www.vacuumland.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?34158
Some penetrating oil at the motor shaft and bearing can help break a corroded or rusted bond at that point.
Tapping a screwdriver against the plate only will rotate it, breaking it free.
Then getting some small screwdrivers (at least two on opposite sides) in the holes between the shell and bearing plate can help pry it off.
Be gentle enough to not bend the plate...
If all fails, remove the carbon brushes, put the fan back on finger tight and yank out the plate, bearing, and armature as an assembly. Beware the grease washer and spring finger behind the rear bearing - they will stick to the bearing and fall when you are not expecting it...
Then you can work at getting the plate and bearing and armature separated. Just be careful with the armature...
I see date stamps on some fans (mostly later ones like my Omega) but not others. It could be original or an old replacement. The plastic fans have been used as replacements for the past 20 years or so, unless a metal one was in the used-parts bin at a general vac shop.
See picture 7 at the top of my 505 resto thread for how I get them off.
https://www.vacuumland.org/cgi-bin/TD/TD-VIEWTHREAD.cgi?34158
Some penetrating oil at the motor shaft and bearing can help break a corroded or rusted bond at that point.
Tapping a screwdriver against the plate only will rotate it, breaking it free.
Then getting some small screwdrivers (at least two on opposite sides) in the holes between the shell and bearing plate can help pry it off.
Be gentle enough to not bend the plate...
If all fails, remove the carbon brushes, put the fan back on finger tight and yank out the plate, bearing, and armature as an assembly. Beware the grease washer and spring finger behind the rear bearing - they will stick to the bearing and fall when you are not expecting it...
Then you can work at getting the plate and bearing and armature separated. Just be careful with the armature...
I see date stamps on some fans (mostly later ones like my Omega) but not others. It could be original or an old replacement. The plastic fans have been used as replacements for the past 20 years or so, unless a metal one was in the used-parts bin at a general vac shop.
lotsofkirbys
Active member
Ok, that makes sense...
I hadn't thought about it possibly being a replacement from a shop's parts bin. I thought they started replacing the fans with plastic when the tradition debuted?
I know mine is an earlier 1-CR as it has no holes for the Shag-king, so maybe they started doing the date stamps somewhere around the time of the first revision.
The lettering on the labels is coming off. Should I try to fix it or hope I get lucky on eBay? I'd prefer to keep it original.
After turning it with a screwdriver (and using a lot of penetrating oil!) The bearing plate popped off. The front bearing appears to be riveted in and is absolutely shot. Do I need to buy a new plate? I have no tools to remove rivets.
I'm already writing down a list of parts it will need. I've looked at the diagram Ben posted and my bearing plate doesn't match. Though I have a wonderfully rated Kirby dealer about an hour away from me. If I can't find something online I'll check with him.
Sorry for asking so many different questions! I'm very concerned with causing an issue I could have prevented. I know I'm supposed to learn myself, but I can't afford to break something and have to replace it. I already have a rapidly climbing parts list as it is!
I hadn't thought about it possibly being a replacement from a shop's parts bin. I thought they started replacing the fans with plastic when the tradition debuted?
I know mine is an earlier 1-CR as it has no holes for the Shag-king, so maybe they started doing the date stamps somewhere around the time of the first revision.
The lettering on the labels is coming off. Should I try to fix it or hope I get lucky on eBay? I'd prefer to keep it original.
After turning it with a screwdriver (and using a lot of penetrating oil!) The bearing plate popped off. The front bearing appears to be riveted in and is absolutely shot. Do I need to buy a new plate? I have no tools to remove rivets.
I'm already writing down a list of parts it will need. I've looked at the diagram Ben posted and my bearing plate doesn't match. Though I have a wonderfully rated Kirby dealer about an hour away from me. If I can't find something online I'll check with him.
Sorry for asking so many different questions! I'm very concerned with causing an issue I could have prevented. I know I'm supposed to learn myself, but I can't afford to break something and have to replace it. I already have a rapidly climbing parts list as it is!
texaskirbyguy
Well-known member
Glad to hear you got the plate off. Please post some pics of it, both sides to refresh my memory of what they look like. I have run across these, replaced bearings, and never had to drill out rivets. This must have been an early plate as the later ones did not have rivets. I am pretty sure they can be replaced with a non-rivet plate if needed.
Sounds like you need a drill and some bits for your next B-day! (I got mine at 14 or so and still have it...)
BEFORE you order parts online, call your Kirby shop (if they do repairs) just to see what he has. Have your list of parts, too. You never know what he might have lurking around in the back in dusty bins (speaking from experience!) He might even have 25 1CR parts units in the warehouse like my friend did!
No prob on the questions - this is how you learn. Breaking stuff is also how I learned, so if it happens, we fix it and learn from it as well. So far you seem to be doing well. Take lots of pictures so you know how to reassemble it.
I have almost any motor unit part you need, as long as you are not in a hurry for it; just pay for shipping and I will send them when I recover (probably a month or two out).
Sounds like you need a drill and some bits for your next B-day! (I got mine at 14 or so and still have it...)
BEFORE you order parts online, call your Kirby shop (if they do repairs) just to see what he has. Have your list of parts, too. You never know what he might have lurking around in the back in dusty bins (speaking from experience!) He might even have 25 1CR parts units in the warehouse like my friend did!
No prob on the questions - this is how you learn. Breaking stuff is also how I learned, so if it happens, we fix it and learn from it as well. So far you seem to be doing well. Take lots of pictures so you know how to reassemble it.
I have almost any motor unit part you need, as long as you are not in a hurry for it; just pay for shipping and I will send them when I recover (probably a month or two out).
If
The bearing plate isn't like the diagram it may be the one built into the metal rear fan housing. If the bearing plate doesn't have screws holding it in then it's built in like just mentioned. There will be two pieces of the motor housing coming down to almost where the carbon brush housing is. Between the two metal pieces if you use a flat head screw driver prying the inner I believe white hard plastic but it may be metal. I know that the bearing plate housing and the housing holding the armature and coil separate from each other.
I hope this makes sense it's hard to describe the pieces correctly. I have an all original classic that I got given to me from the original owners son. If you take pics maybe we can give exact directions.
There are few kirby dealers that can help you. The machine is 50 years old and if they opened a vacuum shop when they were 20 that would make the owner 70. I would call before driving as the closest kirby person near me is Kent oyler who is kirby needs on ebay.
The shag king I don't know if it was on the classic. It could've been on cb1,cb2 and cb3. That's omega, classic 3 and the tradition. I'm not positive but I know it's on all the cb models for sure. If it was on thee cr1 aka classic it would be the later models.
I'm sorry my posts all over the place. I will check my Google drive and see if I have pics I can attach.
Rob nice to see you post and I hope your health is good.
Les
The bearing plate isn't like the diagram it may be the one built into the metal rear fan housing. If the bearing plate doesn't have screws holding it in then it's built in like just mentioned. There will be two pieces of the motor housing coming down to almost where the carbon brush housing is. Between the two metal pieces if you use a flat head screw driver prying the inner I believe white hard plastic but it may be metal. I know that the bearing plate housing and the housing holding the armature and coil separate from each other.
I hope this makes sense it's hard to describe the pieces correctly. I have an all original classic that I got given to me from the original owners son. If you take pics maybe we can give exact directions.
There are few kirby dealers that can help you. The machine is 50 years old and if they opened a vacuum shop when they were 20 that would make the owner 70. I would call before driving as the closest kirby person near me is Kent oyler who is kirby needs on ebay.
The shag king I don't know if it was on the classic. It could've been on cb1,cb2 and cb3. That's omega, classic 3 and the tradition. I'm not positive but I know it's on all the cb models for sure. If it was on thee cr1 aka classic it would be the later models.
I'm sorry my posts all over the place. I will check my Google drive and see if I have pics I can attach.
Rob nice to see you post and I hope your health is good.
Les
Edit
Disregard my last post.
I believe if you use a set tool or a socket and tap it the bearing comes off. There is a trick for keeping the bearings in once reinstalled. There not riveted on.
If you go to this link. It has Mike's videos. I'm not sure if he uses a socket but the blind pilot bearing puller isn't the only way to remove the bearings.
https://youtube.com/channel/UCZisZSO5_BKJzxUxjIsslOQ
Disregard my last post.
I believe if you use a set tool or a socket and tap it the bearing comes off. There is a trick for keeping the bearings in once reinstalled. There not riveted on.
If you go to this link. It has Mike's videos. I'm not sure if he uses a socket but the blind pilot bearing puller isn't the only way to remove the bearings.
https://youtube.com/channel/UCZisZSO5_BKJzxUxjIsslOQ
lotsofkirbys
Active member
Here's the pics/I've think that may be right
@texaskirbyguy. It's still a little dirty, (I took it apart a few minutes ago!). Looking at it closely, I don't believe it's riveted.
@Les. It has an 1/8" "lip" (That's the best I can describe it.) on the motor side of the bearing. That lip appears to be holding it in.
@texaskirbyguy. It's still a little dirty, (I took it apart a few minutes ago!). Looking at it closely, I don't believe it's riveted.
@Les. It has an 1/8" "lip" (That's the best I can describe it.) on the motor side of the bearing. That lip appears to be holding it in.
lotsofkirbys
Your new front bearing plate will be part no. 116884, and it will also have the new-style front bearing (116073) that is used on models Classic Omega 1CB to the present Avalir II. Also order four (4) 193281 #8 screws to attach new front bearing plate to housing.
~Ben
Your new front bearing plate will be part no. 116884, and it will also have the new-style front bearing (116073) that is used on models Classic Omega 1CB to the present Avalir II. Also order four (4) 193281 #8 screws to attach new front bearing plate to housing.
~Ben
lotsofkirbys
Active member
Ok, thank you!
That pic is exactly what I needed! I'll try it tomorrow.
@texaskirbyguy. Thanks for the advice! You've been a great help.
@ben. Looks like I don't need the bearing plate after all. Thanks for the bearing part number though! The screws, strangely enough, weren't rusty...
Y'all have helped me so much, I'll be sure to give updates!
That pic is exactly what I needed! I'll try it tomorrow.
@texaskirbyguy. Thanks for the advice! You've been a great help.
@ben. Looks like I don't need the bearing plate after all. Thanks for the bearing part number though! The screws, strangely enough, weren't rusty...
Y'all have helped me so much, I'll be sure to give updates!
texaskirbyguy
Well-known member
No problem - glad to help!
Les has you on the right track - set the plate on a 1.25" to 2" pipe or something to allow the bearing to come out the bottom as you tap it out with a socket in the hole contacting the bearing inner race. The pipe is to keep the plate from bending. This is stamped sheet metal so it should tap out easily. My 505 resto thread should have some details on this procedure...
However, before removing bearing, clean out the crud to allow it to come out easier and make sure nothing else is holding it in. Take a close up picture then to aid reassembly, noting the inner race...
Front bearing is Kirby #1160 and rear is #1155. They will cost about $12 each but will last for another 30 years under routine use and make it sound like new for a long time.
Note these bearings have a small protrusion on ONE SIDE of the inner race - they have to go back in the correct way. Here is the reason for taking good pictures along the way.
Looks like you are making good progress! Nothing broke yet, either!
)
Les, thanks for the 're-welcoming' and wishes - it has been a rough road for sure. Degenerative joint disease at my age is not for wusses!
Oh - your post way above referring the scuff plate as a 'skid plate' had me laughing. If it were a skid plate (like on a truck) you would have been pushing the vacuum upside down and backwards, lol...) Looks like spell-UNcheck got you there...
Les has you on the right track - set the plate on a 1.25" to 2" pipe or something to allow the bearing to come out the bottom as you tap it out with a socket in the hole contacting the bearing inner race. The pipe is to keep the plate from bending. This is stamped sheet metal so it should tap out easily. My 505 resto thread should have some details on this procedure...
However, before removing bearing, clean out the crud to allow it to come out easier and make sure nothing else is holding it in. Take a close up picture then to aid reassembly, noting the inner race...
Front bearing is Kirby #1160 and rear is #1155. They will cost about $12 each but will last for another 30 years under routine use and make it sound like new for a long time.
Note these bearings have a small protrusion on ONE SIDE of the inner race - they have to go back in the correct way. Here is the reason for taking good pictures along the way.
Looks like you are making good progress! Nothing broke yet, either!
)Les, thanks for the 're-welcoming' and wishes - it has been a rough road for sure. Degenerative joint disease at my age is not for wusses!
Oh - your post way above referring the scuff plate as a 'skid plate' had me laughing. If it were a skid plate (like on a truck) you would have been pushing the vacuum upside down and backwards, lol...
) Looks like spell-UNcheck got you there...
