In the Market for a PN Canister

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bagintheback

bagintheback

Well-known member
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Jun 29, 2009
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Flagstaff, Arizona
After a few months of using solely my Eureka Express, I've fallen in love with the canister power team set up. However, the Eureka just isn't fitting my needs. Our new home is close to 50% hard flooring with carpeted stairs, and the VGIII power nozzle just is not designed for this. So I'd like to go all out get a decent PN canister. I'd like your guys' help in the decision making. Here the list of features that I need:

*High quality hard floor brush. Does one exist were dog hair won't stick to the bristles?

*Electric mini PN for cleaning carpeted stairs. An air driven turbo brush is not going to cut it.

*A PN that can deep clean plush medium pile carpeting. So no soft bristles here.

I've narrowed the selection down to a few a models that I think will do the job, but I'm open to suggestions:

*Electrolux Silverado or Epic 6500: The bags are cheap, I adore the Sidekick and they are priced relatively cheaply on eBay. However, I have never been impressed with Electrolux PNs. They have always appeared like surface cleaners, and I don't have much faith in them cleaning plush carpeting. But you know better than I do!

*New Kenmore Progressive: I'm leaning towards model#21714.

*Miele S2121 Delphi: Oh boy, that price! Is it worth spending $500 on a BOL PN canister? Should I just take that money and get an Electrolux?

What do you think is the best choice?
 
Nathaniel

My guess is you're going to get a lot of different opinions from many members here. Each of us have our preferences as to what we like and recommend. It's probably not ideal, but if you had access to all of the machines you've listed above, it would be great if you could take them home and "test drive" them so to speak in your environment so you can see which machine would fit your needs best.

Now with that said, I personally will recommend the Electrolux Silverado. I own three of them and one I use as a daily driver, it has a PN 5 power nozzle for my carpeting, a flip over brush for the tile/hard surfaces, and a sidekick for use on either furniture or stairs, or anywhere that's a tight spot you're not going to get a regular power nozzle in place. I have never had the pleasure to use a Miele, however I have heard great things about them. Kenmore vacuums I'm borderline on those, I have owned a Kenmore Whispertone canister in the past and while it had great suction, the connection where the power nozzle connected melted down on me and of course the power nozzle stopped working.

On another line of though, if you're looking to spend $500+ on a vacuum cleaner, Aerus (Electrolux) makes a canister that can be purchased for around $600, it has all of the tools necessary for what you're looking for, plus comes standard with a five year warranty.

These are just my thoughts on them, whatever you decide to purchase, I wish you the best with it and I hope it serves your purposes. Good luck!

s31463221++12-14-2012-12-08-8.jpg
 
Aerus Lux Classic

Now that is one good looking canister! I did not realize they came with the sidekick, and the PN is just what I need. Basic with metal wands.

There is absolutely no Aerus dealers within a 100 miles up here, so are the any members here on Vacuumland that I could purchase from? Maybe at a reduced rate?
 
You can't beat the Kenmore Intuition canister - top rated by Consumer Reports for at least 3 years now in the category of canisters.

It is excellent at carpet cleaning, bare floor cleaning and has strong airflow through the hose for above the floor cleaning with tools. It's got a great bare floor brush that releases from it's home right in the power nozzle - making switching from carpet to bare floors a breeze. The headlight is on the wand itself, so you get illumination on bare floors even when using the bare floor brush. It's got an on-board storage compartment for an electric mini power nozzle. It's also got a wonderfully long 8-foot hose!

Here's a link to more information -




http://www.sears.com/kenmore-intuition-canister-vacuum-cleaner-blue/p-02028014000P
 
Delphi...

Is an amazing machine... With a few draw backs.
1. Miele has no mini PN.
2. Delphi comes with no bare floor brush and I would suggest an upgraded PN.
3. Stock dusting brush is crappy, but it can be replaced with the one from an S5.
4. Bags are expensive! If you don't need super filtration stick with the filters you get for free in boxes of bags, it'll still filter better than most anything else.
5. Short hose and cord. (an extension cord is an easy solution, and the canister is light so its no problem to lift)
Now lets look at the positive.
1. The SEB-217 PN that comes with the Delphi is amazing. For its size it deep cleans well, with brushes turned off it cleans bare flooring better than many dedicated tools. It also is small, light, and gentile enough to be used on both upholstered furniture and carpeted stairs, with its bigger cleaning path making quick work of stairs.
2. The upgraded PN's from WW will IMO clean circles around a Lux/Aerus.
3. Miele has a large selection of tools to make any cleaning job easy and quick.
4. Miele bags filter insanely well, the bag compartment will never have any dust in it if you maintain the machine. They also are about as close as a bag will ever get to the realm of "No loss of suction." The bags are also big and though they don't unfold completely while in the S2 series they do fill completely.
5. Its light weight and easy to clean with.
So basically for the Lux I'm pretty sure coming from a VGIII PN you'll be disappointed with its deep cleaning (or lack thereof).
Kenmore is a good machine but the new models seem to be getting so cheap and unreliable, if you go for something like this I'd suggest one more like the Panasonic I'll attach a link for.
And the Miele... It is a pricy machine, the best way I can explain it is to compare to the recent discussion we had about Macintosh. Miele has a complete system designed around their vacuums and components, meaning so that it all just works flawlessly no matter what you're trying to tackle at the time.
If you do go with a Miele go into a friendly dealer that will hopefully give you a good deal on a package, Including the Delphi, Either a SEB-228 or 236 PN, a better natural bristle dusting brush from an S5, and a bare floor nozzle if you see fit (the SEB-217 will more than suffice).


http://www.amazon.com/Panasonic-MC-...1355514255&sr=8-1&keywords=Panasonic+Canister
 
As an Amazon Associate we earn from qualifying purchases.
I was going to mention the red Kenmore canister but then I looked up the model number you said you were interested in and that's it! That Kenmore power nozzle is an amazing cleaner. It is the same one used on the Progressive Glide upright, which is one of my best cleaning vacuums in my collection. Out of the others you listed, I think the Kenmore would be the better route. Better attachments, more user-friendly, cheaper, and you get the electric mini power nozzle. That's what I'd do, but that's just me.

Chase
 
Electrolux

Nathaniel, I think an Electrolux plastic bodied canister would be your best choice. Yes, you will find the powerhead performance disappointing, BUT you can buy a new powerhead, such as a Wessell EBK340 or Sweep & Groom, & then take your wand into a vac shop & have them install a buttonlocker & shorten the powerhead's cord. This will allow you to have an Electrolux with a better powerhead that will give you the performance you desire out of it.

The other choices you listed are good, but they do have problems you may want to avoid. The Miele....Unless you go for the SEB 228 or 236 powerhead, chances are you would find the SEB 217 powerhead too wimpy & dissatisfied with it's performance cleaning carpets. Also, while you can use a Turbo Hand Brush with a Miele, there is no electric mini PN available on the market that will fit it. The reason for this is that Miele's hose receptacles are unique enough that it won't accept a generic plug, even if you do have a generic adapter to convert from 1 3/8" attachments to 1 1/4 attachments. And while Miele is legendary for their reliability & quality, the cost of their repair parts & bags & filters in HIDEOUSLY EXPENSIVE....expensive enough I wouldn't recommend anyone buy a Miele.

The Kenmore/Panasonic canisters....although they will give you the performance you desire, unless you buy an older machine from the 1990's, the new canisters have HUGE problems with the motors dying prematurely, about 4 to 5 years old. And most people know of their problems with the electrical connections in the hose, wand & powerhead neck. So, although they are an option, it's an option that will give you headaches.

On the other hand, if you buy an Electrolux & get another powerhead for it as I suggested, you will have a reliable cleaner with good performance, & reasonable costs for parts should the cleaner ever break. Also, Electrolux supplies are very inexpensive, & you can use HEPA cloth bags in your Electrolux if you desire. The afterfilter will capture the dust just as well as Miele's Super Air Clean filters they include with the bags, & combined with the HEPA cloth bags, the Electrolux would filter just as well as a Miele would with the Super Air Clean filter fitted. And of course, Electrolux vacuums come with the Sidekick mini powerhead that you wanted. The only suggestion I would make is to buy an older Electrolux plastic bodied canister, like the brown one in your photo....those models have the double-stage motor that will outlast the newer ones, like the white ones in the pics here.

Good luck finding a good vacuum....Rob
 
How about either a rebuilt TriStar CXL w/Wessel Werk HEB160 mini PN?

U can put a Vibra Groomer II on the TriStar PN or use a Eureka Express PN & buy the mini wand from AirStorm/Patriot.

floor-a-matic++12-14-2012-19-50-31.jpg
 
Power Nozzle Canister

Nathaniel,

With the type of flooring in your home you will definitely appreciate the quality of the Lux attachments and the standard and optional floor brushes with the Classic canister. The Sidekick is perfect for your stairs and the Lux power nozzle is very good at cleaning carpeting without causing damage to the ends of the fibers. The thing to remember is while a stiffer brush roller generally deep cleans carpeting better, it causes damage to the ends of the fibers you can see with an electron microscope when compared with several years of vacuuming with a standard Lux brush roll. The idea here is to vacuum on a regular basis your traffic areas (daily) and this ceases to be an issue. I prefer the current series of Lux plastic canisters with the Johnson Electric brushless motor over the previous Lux double fan and VM3 styles.

As for the Lux power nozzle performance and deep cleaning the VG you are currently using will probably slightly outclean the Miele 236. Perhaps someone else could chime in here. In my 2013 Lux Guardian Platinum I use the Lux green high performance roller (48011) that picks up about 20% more dirt that the standard OEM assy and close to the Miele in performance. I used a Miele 236 and Lux Guardian side by side for years in Boston and had very clean carpets so you will too.

As for Miele, you are better off with the Callisto (sp?) and the larger nozzle it comes with. Better performance from the power nozzle, decent attachments and a decent floor brush. An excellent machine for your application w/o breaking the bank. The downside is obviously the cost of the bags which filter great and maintain their power longer than Lux bags and also filter and OEM replacement part costs. The 217 nozzle is a nice addition for small areas, oriental rugs and stairs. The issues with the 236 nozzle have been corrected and I do prefer it over the 228 this unit ships with.

Finally the Sebo D4 with the ET-1 nozzle is also ideal. High quality unit, 40 foot cord reel, swivel hose and a super power nozzle.

I would be all set with the Intuition.

You can e-mail me if you are interested in a new Miele or Lux.


Brian

I
 
It's really a tough choice.

I agree with you about Electrolux power nozzles not being deep cleaners.

I didn't think Miele had a mini-power head, and I've never been impressed with the Sidekicks (the one for my Renny rattles and isn't powerful, and the youtube videos I've seen seem the same).

I have a bottom of the line Miele Plus, and while it's older than the one you are intrested in, it has some similar qualities that I want to point out... the SEB 217 power head is great for thin flat carpet, but the bristles are soft and there is no height adjustment.... it will not work as well on medium or thick carpet to deep clean as more capable power nozzles... So, definitely upgrade the power nozzle. A lot of people like the parquet twister bare floor tool, but the last time I priced them, they were like 80 bucks... you'd have to add that to the price, unless you are planning to just use the power nozzle with the brushroll off.

Another thing that sucks about the bottom of the line Mieles is that they are not direct connect... the loose cord for the power nozzle gets in the way and is more annoying than you can possibly imagine. You constantly have to worry about it tangling around the hose and have to completely unplug it just to change the bag. And, of course you have to go back to the machine to turn the power on and off instead of having the switch right in the handle.

I used to always recommend Kenmores to anyone who was looking for a decent canister, but lately, the attachments have gotten cheap and the quality isn't there like it used to be. I can't tell you how many I've seen that are just a few years old that have broken wheels, elbows, handle release, or quick release pedals... or the height adjust wheels just fell out and are completely missing. Another common issue with the newer Kenmores is that the hose will develop problems and short out and the machine will run intermittently or not at all (since that is where the power switch is).

If you get a Kenmore, and baby it (don't drop it or bump it into walls or furniture or even let anyone sneeze in the same room with it), and possibly buy a couple of extra power nozzles and hoses to have when the original ones fail, you will get some nice features... I love the quick release and direct connect hose and wands and parking system and fingertip power switch... the electric Powermate Junior works better than the Sidekick and the bristles are stiff on the regular power nozzle...

Sorry I couldn't give a more definite suggestion, but maybe a few things to think about :o)
 
I know there is no such thing as a perfect vacuum, but I'd really like to get something that won't require expensive or aftermarket upgrades. Just something that works well as it is. The Electrolux seems to be the machine of choice. Is it worth the hundreds of dollars I have to spend to get it? Two years ago, I thought a Miracle Mate was worth the investment, but I was proved wrong very quickly...
 
Tristar or Patriot

If you can find one for a decent price go for a patriot they are wonderful the airflow at the end of the hose matches my miele silver moon with both reading at 5.5 but you get a longer hose with the patriot. It's also been my experience that the patriot retains it's airflow better than the miele reading in at 4.5 after a deep cleaning of a living room and usage while the miele reads in at 3.5 after a few usages. The medikaire filter doesn't cut down on airflow too much and they usually come with a quality power head (sebo or wessell werks)

Of course the Tristar cxl having close to the same design has similar stats but it's motor is just a little less powerful than the patriot
 

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