HOOVER Ranger Broken Down...

[twocvbloke]

Well, I doubt that Hover will have fitted the plug, as back in those days, appliances generally came without a plug, and either the retail shop it was bought from, or the customer themselves fit a plug, and some people didn't (and still don't) quite understand the meaning of fuse ratings...

A 13 Amp fuse is for devices that use up to 3 Kilowatts, and I don't think your 600 Watt Ranger uses that much power, if your motor shorted out, then your cable will heat up pretty fast, catch fire, burn you, your carpet, the vac itself and maybe even your entire house before the fuse blew, if it blew at all, this is the reason why you NEED to fit a 3 Amp fuse, they're designed with different ratings for a damned good reason, regardless of whether some low-IQ person in the 70's fitted it, it's for your safety, if you don't, well, I hope you have Home and Life insurance........

Just because a plug says it can have a 13 Amp fuse fitted doesn't mean it HAS to have one fitted, be smart and fit a 3 Amp Fuse...

 

[jmurray01]

Yes, lucky indeed!

I could be wrong, but if the hooks don't have any visible screws, perhaps they just pull or twist off ?

I was going to post this as another thread, but I guess I'll ask it here:

What do you guys use to polish the plastic on your Vacuum Cleaners ?

 

[jmurray01]

OK, you've convinced me, I'll buy two 3 Amp fuses for my HOOVER and Electrolux (all the others are above 700W) as soon as I can and get them fitted.

 

[juniorsenior]

All my machines have 13amp fuses and the only one with an origonal plug is my 1354A which has a Manweb plug on where it was purchased many years ago but not by me.

 

[jmurray01]

I guess you'd better replace your fuses too then.

Must be a common mistake by the first owners/retailers putting 13 Amp fuses on when it should have been 3 Amp fuses.

 

[twocvbloke]

For the others above 700w, use a 5 Amp fuse (good for up to 1200 Watts), and yes, I spelled Hoover wrong...

Sorry to be so brash about it, but, I'm very cautious when it comes to electrical safety, and there's just not enough education about even the simplest things like fuses in plugs, why they're there, and what the ratings mean...

3 Amp - Up to 700 Watts
5 Amp - Up to 1200 Watts
10 Amp - Up to 2400 Watts (not a common fuse though)
13 Amp - Up to 3000 Watts

Note it down somewhere...

 

[jmurray01]

So I should replace all the other 13 Amp fuses in my other cleaners too ? Even though they have moulded plugs which WERE made by the manufacturers who fitted them with 13 Amp ones ?

 

[juniorsenior]

Well i aint replacing them they have been there for years without a problem.

 

[twocvbloke]

In simple terms, yes, I never trust ANY moulded plug with a factory-fitted fuse, I always fit my own (I do keep a stock of the ones I remove though), I'd rather have my wiring properly protected than rely on anything from a factory, especially so if the appliance originated in China...

 

[twocvbloke]

"Well i aint replacing them they have been there for yea

Well, if you use a 3 KILOWATT fuse in a 250 Watt vacuum's plug, it ain't going to blow if there's a fault, and if it doesn't blow, you get a lot of heat in the cable, like the heating element in an electric fire, and with heat on plastic, you get fire, and when you get fire, well, suffice to say, I'm sure you've seen plenty of reports on TV about people dying in house fires due to electrical faults...

You're choice, fit the right fuse and be safe, or stick with the 13 Amp fuse and risk losing your, or someone else's life...

 

[juniorsenior]

Ok i checked my Hoover instruction manual and it says connect to a 13amp plug fused at 3amp so Twocybloke you were right enough and i will change my fuses. i think the cunfusion is with the plug if it does say 13amp on it doesnt mean that you have to put a 13amp fuse in it as was said earlier.
Anyway its good to learn something new everyday

 

[twocvbloke]

The plugs are rated as being suitable for Up-to 13 Amps, that's where a lot of people make the incorrect assumption that you must fit a 13 Amp fuse, hence why I said there's a lack of education about the simple fuse ratings and what they can supply up to before blowing...

 

[juniorsenior]

You are right
well i dont have any 3 so i put in a 5 for now.

 

[jmurray01]

Well I checked my Electrolux and to my surprise it has a 3 Amp fuse in it! I could swear I saw a 13 Amp one when I last had the plug open... Must be my memory failing!

As for the Ranger, I went up 5 minutes ago and fitted an old 3 Amp fuse I found in my cupboard, so hopefully it hasn't already blown. I'll find out next time I go to use it, but providing it hasn't blown, all is electrically safe there!

As for the other cleaners with 13 Amp fuses fitted, I'm going to leave them as they are, as I read on a couple of sites that the standard rule of thumb is 3 Amp for under 700W and 13 Amp for over 700W.

 

[vacbear58]

Electrolux

Whilst I agree with 2cvbloke in general, older Electrolux 90/100/310/330/345 models actually do need a 13amp fuse - they will blow a 3 amp. Dont ask me why, it may have to do with a surge on startup. Some later versions lower range models (80 for example which started at 400W but ended up at 550W) which had uprated motors may also be the same

 

[twocvbloke]

Yeesh, "It should be fitted with a 13 Amp fuse", talk about a serious design flaw, it's probably a good thing I don't really like older euro-design Electrolux vacs, even my 600w Electrolux Sanitaire ZC-880 and Electrolux C12 are both fine with a 3 Amp fuse in the plug.... :S

Might aswell just stick a Million Amp Drillbit fuse in there for all the good it'd do in the event of a fault...

 

[jmurray01]

I knew I was unlucky, but not this unlucky!

After only vacuuming half of my bedroom an hour ago, I heard a "bang" and heard the dreaded high pitched noise that comes from a motor spinning freely!

Needless to say I took the belt cover off to find it snapped in half.

One problem after another!

I've ordered a pack of two new belts from eBay, so when they arrive I'll be back in business.

But man, how unlucky... The belt was only about a month old too!

 

[hooverbaby]

Re: Fuses..

What you need to bear in mind when fitting fuses on vacuums is that the motor can draw a high initial current on start up, so the 3 amp fuse may not be suitable. This is especially the case if you use the attachments on the senior, which boosts the motor power.

Hoover used to recommend a 5 amp fuse on the Hoover Junior 1354 for this reason (current surge). I would not be inclined to use a 3 amp fuse on the Senior, since it is likely to blow if used on tools. This happened to me at Al's with Seamus's Hoover Convertible, albeit a 110 volt imported machine. I only had a 5 amp fuse in the transformer and it took it out when powered up on tools. To be honest I'm not sure if the wattage on this compared with the UK 240 volt model; the current draw may be a bit higher?

In many cases 13 amp fuse are fitted since 3 and 13 amp are the common sizes in the UK. I know what you mean about protection..but remember that you are protecting the cable, more so than the appliance. eg if you used a table light flex on a fire with a 13 amp fuse then the cable would set on fire. This is not likely to be a problem on your ranger, since a dead short on the cable or machine will take the fuse out. Just make sure that you use a suitable 2 core cable. 0.75mm 2 core is more than adequate for up to 6 amps. I would expect the Senior to take roughly 1.7 amps under no load when set up without tools (400 watts), approx 400/230 and 2.6 amps with tools. However, it could be 2 or 3 times this amount when switched on!


Stephen

 

[hooverbaby]

I have just checked..

the recommended rating for the 6525C Senior and it is 13 Amp..so DO NOT use a 3 amp fuse on the U4002/4014 Ranger; it is NOT suitable, due to high start-up current!

The standard motor fitted will not draw more than between about 1.7 and 2.6 amps under normal running conditions but it will briefly be somewhat more than this on start-up. However, if a 6 amp cable is fitted this is more than adequate to cope with the load, unlike a 3 Kilowatt fire with a 3 amp cable and 13 amp fuse, which will draw more than 12 amps under normal running and set the cable on fire.

Whilst wishing to guard against the possiblity of more current being drawn in the event of a short circuit fault, what usually happens is that there is a dead short, the current drawn is much greater than the value of the fuse..but only for a short duration and this will take it out whether 3 or 13 amp regardless of motor power.

Stephen

 

[twocvbloke]

I use 3 Amp fuses in my two Juniors, neither one has popped, and the Senior 652A I had I put a 3 Amp fuse in the plug and it never popped, I think the documentation recommending the higher rating fuses is long out of date, heck, even a fully qualified electrical engineer I know states that using those higher ratings on such small motors is completely wrong, and I'd rather defer to their knowledge than "what Hoover recommends"...