Hoover Insight

[motojoejo]

If I had known that this topic would have caused such a stir then I would have never posted.

The same thing has been going on the in the piano industry for over 150 years. Classic example is that of Steinway and Young Chang. When Young Chang came out with the model PG 213, Steinway looked at the scale and found it remarkable similar to the Steinway model B. The most notable difference was the case was 1" longer but the scale of the piano inside was a basic copy of the Steinway B. The icing on the cake was the designer of the PG 213 was a designer that use to work at Steinway. This caused a huge uproar with Steinway. Young Chang defended its self with showing the design being truly different. How different? The thickness of an American dime. Steinway couldn't touch Young Chang for so many reasons beyond what I'm willing to explain.

Flat out copying has been going on for decades in the the piano realm from pedals to duplex scaling to action ratios so it's no surprise it happened to Sebo and Hoover. Copyrights and patents are tricky things and you'd surprised what one can get away with. After all we wouldnt have the modern piano today is makers didn't try to copy the best features of their competitor.

 

[vintagerepairer]

Hello Gary. Well I did think it might have been a cost issue, but then I also considered that if we can buy appliances here in the UK for under £5, things like kettles, kitchen appliances and so on and so forth, why do they not have continental plugs with euro converter plugs too? Pretty much they all come with a screw down reusable plug. It does seem to only be the more expensive appliances which have converter plugs, as I mentioned Sony, which is more or less a premium brand over here. I am not suggesting at all that you are wrong and if anything I think you are right, its costs, I just don't understand why the cheapest appliances of all don't use them.

 

[gsheen]

Vintage repairer 


YOU have a point , here is why 


You will find they are changed at the depot in the UK, we do the same here with kettles and toasters that come with the UK 3 pin plug, we just cut it off and change it here or fit a SA moulded plug and cord , its cheaper to do it here than it is to set up a separate production line in the factory 


 


Kettles & toaster have to be earthed but tv's dvd players and hifi's dont. 


 


When I was still working for Electrolux having the machines fitted at the factory with a 3 prong moulded plug would raise the cost per unit by £ 1 - £ 5 pounds especially if it was cylinder vacuum as the cord winder would need to be beefed up to handle the extra weight. Now this may not sound like allot but when you are importing 1.5 million units a year that is £1.5 million more capital laid out just to have a 3 prong plug.    

 

[vintagerepairer]

Hello again. Thank you for your reply. Would it not be cheaper to attach a converter plug in the UK than go to the bother of cutting off a 2-pin plug, stripping and capping the wires, and fitting the plug?

 

[gsheen]

HI Benny 


converter plugs are normally rather expensive were as the screw on ones are not. Other than that Im not sure to be honest  


Gareth 

 

[sebo_fan]

Um, what about safety tests on those converter plugs? I can see why the cord was cut to make it safer if the company couldn't afford to carry out tests with the plugs.


 


As for pianos, well it's not just that instrument that copying exists in - sadly it's the way of the world - one manufacturer will come out with something and the next rival brand will do the same, even going as far as copying the look to confuse the buyer. Thanks largely to the internet though, and if you are prepared to spend the time to research the models/products, if you want an original article you have to put a bit extra work in. 


 


As a wind player and pianist, I've seen lots of copies over the years and I don't mind what an instrument looks like generally - it's like a bottle of wine, they're all the same until you try it and if the quality, body, taste and feel is different, then you go with what makes you smile.


 


Sadly I'm not a fan of Steinway pianos. I think largely they're overhyped for what they represent and like "Scotch Tape," everyone knows them by brand. If I was to go down the luxury route, it would be Bosendorfer for me every time  - the grand daddy of them all where ostentatiousness is concerned, but still well made and still has a excellent feel when played.


 


Other brands I like are Baldwin pianos - I've played a couple of those and the styles are simple but the performance is pretty good, replacing the English piano brand Kemble who used to be very good but no longer make pianos anymore.


 


My "daily" driver is an old English Bentley piano which I teach on, the grand piano in my living room however is a Japanese Kawai which is just perfect for what I need it to do and I have a couple of Yamaha home keyboards. I did shop around a lot when it came to trying out pianos, and whilst Yamaha make great wind instruments and keyboards, some of their pianos weren't as good at the time as my Kawai.

 

[rolls_rapide]

There is another problem with 2-pin plugs as opposed to 3-pin: that of polarity.

A 2-pin plug can be inserted into the socket (or converter plug) either way, allowing the neutral wire to be connected to the live terminal of the socket, thereby allowing the appliance to become live when it shouldn't be.

A 3-pin plug can only be inserted one way, therefore maintains correct polarity.

 

[vintagerepairer]

I think the whole idea of the UK 13amp plug is far superior to the two pin style we see used in other parts of the world. As you point out Rolls, our plugs allow for correct polarity if the wiring has been installed correctly. The only thing I like about plugs made for other countries is the way the lead is attached at the front and not the bottom. I can think of a good deal of appliances which would be a lot better if the lead came from the front, not least a vacuum cleaner where an accidental tug on the mains lead would remove the plug from socket in one move, instead of bending the plug and possibly breaking the wall socket. I have seen many a cracked wall socket in my years.

 

[sebo_fan]

A cracked wall socket is exactly what happened when my Miele S6 didn't go long enough.

 

[ryry_87]

Ryan - the bag turned up today so cheers for that its going in my Stealth 1 since I use that the most

Roger - can you start another thread about your G1 or add it to my commercial vacs / vintage sebo ones, would love to see it!

 

[sebo_fan]

Pleased you got the bag. I bought the other ones you supplied the link to but they're not the same - these copy ones have a shinier, thinner cartridge at the top, mimicking the kinds of plastic ones you get on copy paper bags for the X. No caps came with them either and they look like they could pull away from the cartridge once the bag gets progressively heavier. Once my Xs start to fill up and require changing, I'll let you know about the performance of those copy synthetics.

 

[sensotronic]

Sebo G1

I'll post some pictures of the G1 in a couple of weeks. I am currently staying at my Mum's in York looking after her house/dogs while she's on holiday.

It's my birthday today and I will soon be getting up and opening my new Sebo D4 Premium which is a joint present from my Mum and partner. I'll be posting pictures of that this week.

 

[ryry_87]

your mum and partner are amazing lol couldn't see my mum or partner willing to contribute to my collection any time soon lol

 

[sebo_fan]

Oh I don't know, some mothers are good to have. Mine bought me my Mini Mac last year and I ended up buying her a rather expensive hand bag at the equivalent price!