Bidding on ebay getting out of hand on a Eureka

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The Trouble With Sniping Software:

Petek:

The problem with sniping software is that it can find the max bids of other people, and outbid it by the least amount necessary to win. It does this by raising the sniper's bid in small increments, very quickly, until it gets confirmation that it's high bidder.

Now, if someone bids a max of $100 on an item, and if there were no such thing as sniping software, then other people bidding might have their max take the item - and might not, depending on if their max was higher than anyone else's. But with sniping software, they're able to take the item by the very LEAST amount needed to win. This is what ruffles people's feathers about sniping software - it basically reveals info (other bidders' maxes) that traditionally has been secret, and outbids by only what's needed to rub someone else's face in the mud.

If eBay is so damn pleased with the effects of sniping software, then I say they should build it into the site and their auction process, so that everyone's on a level playing field again. The way matters stand, some people are playing fair by traditional auction rules, and some people are helping themselves to info they shouldn't really have.
 
Are you positive Sandy? I can't fathom information being held privately by Ebay somehow able to be read by outside parties or software. Surely if this was to be so some one or some law firm would have a field day taking them Ebay to court
 
Still I'm still thinking on this...
Regardless of what the sniper software does you don't know as a bidder what the person with the sniper software has their MAX set at.. for example this Eureka.. that person who won it against Lee most likely had a set maximum for it to snipe, Say $200.. well if Lee had put in his max bid days before at $225 he would have won that vacuum.
I don't for a minute believe that everyone using a sniper program has them set to continue bidding up endlessly, the majority of buyers have to have a limit somewhere. Of course there is going to be one person here or there who has millions of bucks and a $1000 bid on a $20 Eureka is pocket change to them but they are the rare exception.
 
Okay,

Lemme preface this by saying that I have been collecting vacuum cleaners for over 20 years and have been on almost every vacuum cleaner site on the internet that I could find at some point or another. I have had lots of opportunities missed, coupled with bad luck and timing when it comes to obtaining vacuum cleaners for my collection thru the obvious auctions,estate sales, garage sales, website purchases and so on and so forth.

I understand, TRULY; that finding vacuum cleaners today is harder than it once used to be. I and others here can possibly remember a time when you used to be able to walk into haunts, and other aforementioned places and literally fall over old vacuum cleaners. I know I used to.

That said for many finding vacuums thru places like e-bay have become an absolute necessity, because it's seldom the case that we ever can find what we're looking for here, or in places like sally Ann, Value Worlds and Villages and all other thrift, and junk type stores. . Seems that , as it should be people on the site here are very attached to their machines; and subsequently aren't really willing to part with them for any sum.

And that's perfectly okay...

That said, Occasionally on e-bay there comes a item that makes us salivate, and go crazy nuts trying to figure out a way we can come up with , and win said item. It's happened to me. even more rare is that once in a lifetime opportunity to buy said vacuum cleaner in NOS form, never touched by human hands, and boy does that make the auction site vibrate like a Vibra-Beat nozzle between all of us bidding for it.

I have been duped mightily by both sides of the coin, lemme explain.

I was one of the bidders on all three of the NIB Premier Swivel Top canister vacuum cleaner with Power Heads. I bid what I first thought was a "reasonable amount" and then as the price rose more and more, I literally ended up bidding a a few days salary, and chose to mortgage my life's basic needs and ostensibly my future of owning a car, and paying for an apartment to have one. I did not Need one, but I was drawn by the rarity of the thing, and the fact that I would be an owner of a NIB Premier Canister Cleaner. I bid what now I look back on , was a RIDICULOUS amount for the first and second machines, and did not even attempt to go there on the third try. Why because when you look back in hindsight, yeah you did not win the thing, but there will be others. It proves it self out time after time, and while maybe not new in box, you did not spend yourself broke trying to get it. Believe me it's far nicer to still be able to eat for a few weeks, drive around happily searching for the "real" finds, and not having it rain on you because all the underpasses are filled with out of work auto workers...in theory; than to own some shiny vacuum that to most of the world is nothing but an old klunker...EVEN in NIB format.

Then their the other side of the coin...

Years back, I was in a fierce bidding war to purchase a Penncrest Cord Reel Convertible that was offered up by another collector; and I became absolutely BLINDED by want and drove myself literally bankrupt for most of a month because I had to have this very machine. Subsequently the machine flew into the stratosphere and I still remained the top bidder because I literally bid a whole two weeks salary back then to win the god damned thing. When I got it, It wasn't what I'd hoped it would be. It WAS beautiful, and pretty, worked like a charm, was in excellent condition but it lacked one MAJOR thing. It wasn't anything more that a old Hoover Convertible with a cord reel on it. It had no special powers, and brought me a few weeks worth of pride of ownership. You know what happened to it?? Jeff Parker now has it in his collection, because in short order I hated myself silly for buying the thing, and again it wasn't doing anything more than picking up dirt, and when not in use, sat silently in the corner of my room like a totem pole. Yeah I loved the machine, but someone else who has a much larger collection and who just so happened to be missing a Penncrest badged machine, seemed like he could use it more. So he has it now.. The end..

Now getting to what I think the point of what Pete is trying to make is.... Regardless of sniping software used and allowed by Flea-Bay, you have "personally" set forth in your mind what you 'feel" you are willing to pay for the said item on the auction block.

Meaning, If you are only willing to pay the MAXIMUM amount of $75.00 for a new in box Eureka, and your outbid by 20,30,40, even a hundred dollars; it makes NO difference how that person who had the deep pockets got the auction to end.

You PERSONALLY made a choice to only spend said amount. If it was so near and dear to you, as he stated....You should have bid the most exorbitant amount that you possibly could have afforded , lets say $200.00.

If you were still outbid, that's the way the cookie crumbles guys. If you only have said amount to spend, and the auction closes for higher than your amount you have, and there are no more amounts forthcoming from you, YOU"VE lost the item, and the auction process ends.

So what if it "sniffs" out a max bid..that's the way of the world. Life is unfair. That's WHY as he was trying to get across, it seems pointless to get so angry and upset over something that you clearly had no control over.

A final thought is... If it bothers you so much that your always being outbid, set yourself up a "snipe' account. that way you are Never going to find yourself in this position of anger when you loose an auction thru the Bay...

Amen.
 
Good msg Chad, still regardless if the sniper account sniffs out your maxi bid the sniper has to decide also whether he wants to set his max snipe higher. Let's say you Chad are the sniper on that Eureka and you want it dearly but you only have $1000 and really know you can't go higher.. Me I want it dearly too and so 5 days before the auction ends I put in my max bid at $1500.. what are you going to do, reset your snipe to $1510 or walk away.
 
I don't think...

...the sniping software can actually figure out your max bid...it just races with you in a cyber ping-pong fashion until one or the other hits max bid. Now I do think whatever bid is in the system (max or not) when the clock stops ticking on the auction -- is the winner.

But that is totally up to the computer, neither snipe software or eBay's Max Bid can change that scenario.

Myself, if I see something I like...I put it on a watch list if it's early in the auction. I set my max amount about 5-10 minutes before the auction ends (unless I absolutely know I can't be at the 'puter when the auction ends). If I get it, great, if not -- something else will come along :)

And, if you absolutely, positively hate the bidding process on eBay, you can always filter results to dipsplay "Buy It Now" items.

Anyway, that's it for me on this topic....enjoy :)

John
 
Petek:

"Are you positive Sandy? I can't fathom information being held privately by Ebay somehow able to be read by outside parties or software."

Here's how it works: A buyer wants a Lux XXX real bad. The bidding is currently at $45, but what you cannot see is that someone has placed a max bid of $125 on eBay; that's how eBay works. Now, the buyer who wants the XXX so bad can bypass all that; he can set a max in his sniping software. Let's say $250 for the sake of discussion. Now, here's what happens at the end:

- The bidding is at $45.
- Some deluded soul bids $55 in hopes that will take the item, which it doesn't, because there is a max of $125 actually bid. The bidding goes up to $60 as a result of the $125 max bid.

Now, up to this point, everything's fair and square, okay? BUT -

Mr. Sniper turns on his sniping software, set to his max of $250. What his software does is to place incremental bids, very rapidly, until it learns that it is high bidder, at which point it stops bidding. That means two things. One, Mr. Sniper gets the item for $130 - $120 less than his max - and two, the previous max of $125 is, for all practical purposes, revealed to Mr. Sniper, because sniping software stops when it has won; Mr. Sniper now possesses information that was once strictly eBay's.

Without sniping software, Mr. Sniper would have to bid his max within the eBay system like everyone else, and would have to risk other bidders running up the price closer to his max, the way everyone else has to do . With it, he holds an advantage over other bidders that I consider unfair, both as to chances of winning the item, and sometimes, as to the final price.
 
danemodsandy:

That all depends on Mr. Sniper having deep pockets, because he runs the risk of a similarly-deluded bidder having bid $249, either manually or by software, just before his software enters his bid.

He may have won, but he's left to pay $250 for the Lux XXX. If he really was happy to pay this much, and bid $250 manually, long before the auction ended, he'd still have the upper hand because unless this Lux has generated a lot of interest, it's likely he'll win anyway.
 
vintagehoover:

You're absolutely right that it can work that way. But if I had to guess, I would think that Clash of the Titans happens less often than Goliath laughing at that silly little slingshot and stomping David.
 
I see what you're saying Sandy but in the end the person being so called sniped isn'r really being sniped, they are being outbid plain and simple. If they really really really wanted it they would have put in a higher max bid to up their chances greatly that their max bid exceeds what the sniper will pay.
 
But that's not always the case. Someone who has snipeware and sets it to outbid AT ANY PRICE will have the upper hand and get the item anyway. Sometimes with snipeware there is no max bid, the sniper will get it at any price, so the bidding process for everyone else is totally pointless. The Sniper wins, and like Chad said, the only way to level the playing field is to use snipeware as well. I wonder what would happen if say a Hoover Model "O" were to appear on eBay and several bidders were using snipeware. The auction could go up by hundreds if not thousands within the last few seconds. Like I say in an economy where everything is down and so many people are out of work, it's astounding that eBay seems recession-proof.
 
My practice...

...is to bid on something that I want only if I am going to be home when the auction ends. That way I can be there at the last minute and try to win the auction honestly. Sometimes I win, sometimes I don't. That is the name of the game.

If an auction ends when I am at work then I don't bid because most likely I lose the auction.

I don't do bidding wars. I don't bid against someone I know. I know ebay is an auction and everything is fair game, it's just my choice not to bid against someone I know.

I do like to watch bidding wars however, kinda like watching a match and its always interesting to see how much something will go for.

Marty
 
Two more things..

I won't use snipe ware and I don't judge people for how much they pay for something. I have paid waaayyyy too much money for things in the past based solely on the rarity of the item or for the sentimental value of the item.
 
I for one

Did not bid on the item, I was just watching the item to see how high it would go, and sure enough it sold for WAY more than what it was worth, even NEW at the time it rolled off the factory assembly line. I can remember this same unit being sold in stores for 50-60 bucks back in the 80's, and that was NIB. We all know that life is unfair, that is a whole different ball park, it's just sad that a item that is only worth say 30 bucks even in pristine condition as this vacuum was, is sold far more that it's actual value.
 
$120

If that vacuum sold for $60 in 1985 NIB it would be about $115 to $120 in 2009 dollars. How much did it finally go for?
 
US $129.50 it sold for, Bill.

I've been staying out of this discussion trying to figure out what it is I do, how to word it and how it might be termed. I echo Marty in my method. I honestly don't think 'sniper software' has any advantage over my brain, fingers, watch's second hand, mouse and connection speed.

My practice also is to bid on something that I want only if I am going to be home and awake when the auction ends. That way I can be there at the last minute and try to win the auction honestly. Sometimes I win, sometimes I don't. That is the name of the game.

I am also able to access wireless at work and so 5 minutes or less before auction end I will make my play - same results. Win some, lose some.

The reason for waiting for first bidding is to not draw attention to one's self or intentions. I certainly don't want to drive the price upwards days in advance. If someone I know emails me - or viceversa - expressing intent to want it it is between us if one or the other withdraws or goodnaturedly, please, dukes it out to the end.

Once EBay made the policy decision to hide all identities including the winner (among other poorly conceived changes), informed & friendly co-operative competition ended and we have no choice but to bid against strangers...all bets are off and may the deepest pockets win...with admiration, grudgeing or respectful, again, your choice.

One man's Roll-Easy is another man's Dirt Devil, eh?
Dave
 
You are so right Fred, and I am sure that for most of us if we were the seller we would be very happy if someone wanted to pay more us more than the item was worth!!
 
Ebay bidding

HI, new here, also known as Maxx19692004 on Ebay, the guy that bought the vacuum.
I do collect Eureka's and bought 3 from the same seller, all either NIB or floor models, not a chance to often to get a 25 year old vacuum still in the box, made my eyes bug out.
They were one of the first vacuums I used to take apart as kid, so I had to have them.
 
Hi Max39! You are one lucky Eureka fan!

I would love to have the room to collect New In Box Old Stock Eureka vacs. I drool everytime I see one on ebay.....oh well....one day, when I get out of the renter's nightmare!

Welcome to the club.....now let's see some photos of those old-new Eurekas!!!!!
 
Early Hoover Portapower

Another eBay seller is listing an early model Hoover Portapower (1975 or '76, going by the color of the logo/text that appears on the floor nozzle). He also has a Model 100 Dustette (1949-55) for sale.

The Portapower was the successor to the Swingette which Hoover had introduced in 1970. The PP was replaced by the Sprint and Tempo portable canister line in 1989.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170313159589
 
ooh that IS an early Portapower. All of the Portapowers ive seen have the lousy plastic hose-grip that doesnt swivel. This has a proper aluminum grip with the better-style air bleed. The Swingette/Portapower is a genius machine, and its THE machine I turn to when I need a cylinder or canister.

If only they came with a proper rug nozzle and bare floor brush...
 

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