A little pet peeve I have...

[amtraksebo1997]

I know some people on this site like Sanitares and similar direct-air vacuums, and so do I. However, there is one thing about them that I despise, and that is the dump-out bags that certain vacs have. How in the world are these things still allowed to be sold?? That is "technology" that has been around pretty much since the invention of the vacuum cleaner itself. Filtration on those pillowsacks is almost nonexistent, and they're not very pleasant to empty (I hope the janitors and housekeeping staff that use those machines empty them outdoors). I genuinely do not care about what excuses can be made for those things, I'd rather sacrifice some airflow by using a fill tube and bag than have to deal with clouds of dust in my face when I empty it. That's the reason I never use my old Kirby D50, it has a shake out bag. Dump out bags should've been phased completely an extremely long time ago, and yet they're still allowed to be sold.

 

[mark40511]

I've seen a few posts on here over the years of someone mentioning "shake out" bags or something like that and I too can't even imagine that's still even a thing.. Especially since some direct air machines use disposable bags...I mean, Kirby is direct air, right? It uses disposable HEPA bags

 

[oreck_xl]

Cleaning Company owners are cheap

They don't want the added expense of disposable bags, nor do they care about what germs may linger in a reusable shakeout bag. Many we get in reek of Carpet Fresh which is even more unpleasant (gives me a headache).

 

[panasonicvac]

I think there is still a market left for shake out bags. If I were to install brand new carpet for a living, neither disposable bags or bagless dirt cups is what I'd use. Shake out bags would hold alot more carpet fiber, not empty out as much, and save money on not buying disposable bags or filters. Or if I was in construction like picking up saw dust in the wood shop, same thing.

 

[kloveland]

I think shake out bags are economical for the commercial environment. I really don't see the issue in a commercial setting.

 

[kloveland]

With that line of thinking are you going to mandate all commercial environments use Merv 15 filters in their HVAC units and organic cleaning products? Not trying to be rude. Just saying!

 

[human]

The first Sanitaire I ever used belonged to a girlfriend I had almost 20 years ago. It was also my first introduction to shakeout/dump bags. Yuck! I was totally miffed by the idea that there was no inner filter bag. She would just dump it straight into the outside garbage can, and she loved that machine. In many ways, it reflected her personality, in that it was simple, no-nonsense, and just got the job done.

I finally got one myself a few years ago, an SC686, which I subsequently converted to use F&G bags. I bought a conversion kit online for about $25, shipped, that came with a replacement outer bag and a dozen generic paper F&G style bags. The outer bag had the same 'window latch' connector as the original dump bag, so swapping it over literally took about 45 seconds. Like a lot of Sanitaire replacement parts, the outer bag looks just like the OEM dump bag, except it has a zipper up the back, same materials and markings, but for the price I paid, it was most likely a generic one.

 

[repairman]

The only thing I didn't like about the latch style conversion bags was that they had a vinyl filltube which wore out under commercial use.

 

[amtraksebo1997]

Once again,

I've stated my opinion on those things, and it's final. They should have no place in the modern-day domestic and commercial vacuum markets. That is unless there's some really niche need for them, and the bags could be somehow be emptied in a sanitary way. (Like maybe in some industrial setting idk).

 

[huskyvacs]

The reason commercial vacs use dump bags is because of the square footage of flooring they have to cover every single day, bags would be an expensive cost sink and would fill up so fast the job would have a lot of wasted time running around fetching fresh bags. On top of that you have additional downtime to a vacuum if the bag supply runs out. Then there is the other fact of litter and debris which can be sucked up and puncture the bag and ruining it prematurely, and then the stink of it sitting in the bag waiting for the bag to be filled up as well.

Also I have never seen any home use vacuums that use a dump bag. If you are using a commercial vacuum in a residential setting this does not apply because you're using the vacuum outside of the environment it was built for.

 

[panasonicvac]

If you don't like shake out bags, then don't buy one or ever use one again. But some people would still like using them today. In fact, I'd rather take a shakeout bag over a cheap bagless vacuum that uses only one filter like a Bissell Powerforce Compact, I think those are even worse honestly. But as what huskyvacs pointed out, shake out bags have been phased out of the residential market as commercial vacuums are supposed to be used for the commercial market. Commercial buildings have a code nowadays where they need to have more MERV or filtration ratings than residential buildings so using a shake out bag shouldn't be a problem where they should be outlawed. Especially if you're outside like what the White House does.

 

[panasonicvac]

Clarification

The commercial buildings must have more filtration in the HVAC system.

 

[amtraksebo1997]

HuskyVacs and Panasonic Vac

This thread was more of a personal opinion rant on dump-out bags. If you like them, that's fine. That's your opinion, but I simply think that they should not be able to be sold in the vacuum market (with some exceptions, I think). I've heard the argument that cleaning staff burn through bags on some of the vacuums they use, and to be honest, I kind of find that hard to believe. I can imagine them using bags up a little more quickly than they would in a domestic environment, but to such an extreme degree as described seems a little out there. Then again, I'm not a commercial cleaner, so I can't relate, but if I were one, and was experiencing that issue, I'd try to get a machine with a bigger capacity, like an Oreck XL Commercial upright. As for bags getting punctured and filtration, I'd try to use HEPA bags in m machines. They are more resistant to tears, and will filter better than the paper alternatives. I also wouldn't want to rely solely on the building's HVAC system to do the filtering, because who knows if that system is even up to code (better safe than sorry, especially after Covid). But then again, this is my speculation/opinion.

 

[panasonicvac]

I can actually concur that argument about going through alot of bags in commercial applications. I've worked at many commercial buildings before, the problem wasn't because the places were really dirty, it was because the dust was so fine that it clogged up the pores of the disposable bags especially cloth ones. Lots of bags that I changed out didn't even make it through halfway, especially bigger bags. That's what I like about the shake out bags at least on the direct air machines because not only they didn't clog up as much but also I wasn't wasting so much on buying disposable bags as what huskyvacs pointed out. Especially when I remember there were times we'd ran out of bags, we had to put the vacuums out of commission. I also concur with huskyvacs that disposable bags especially cloth ones can tear apart if somebody picked up something very sharp, I've seen them happen before.

 

[tseg]

I used a Dyson for years before I “got into” vacuums and the benefits of hypo bagged vacs. I only thoroughly cleaned the Dyson once… after I discovered the vacuum hobby. Up until then I did not even know it had foam filters that were supposed to be regularly cleaned by hand. It was gross, then I gave it away. I now find all bagless vacs disgusting. I actually see the commercial merit in dump out bags and their place in society a lot more than the dirt bin bagless designs of of modern big box residential vacs. Does this make me a vac snob? I think it is more the case that I now have a greater appreciation of how gross “dirt” is in a home. If any design gets banned, it should be residential bagless vacs.

 

[human]

I agree about bagless vacs. About 12 or so years ago, I had a girlfriend who moved in with me and insisted I vacuum with her bagless Bissell, POS that it was, and clean the filters each time. It would take me twice as long to clean the filters than it did to vacuum, and I would come out of the experience covered in dust. Never again! I have enough vacuums to last me the rest of my life and then some, and they all use disposable filter bags.

 

[amtraksebo1997]

Panasonic Vac

if I were burning through HEPA bags at an alarming rate due to tears in them, and/or them getting plugged up with fine dust (which makes me genuinely curious as to what kind of debris people pick up with vacuums in commercial environments for that to even be a problem), I would probably just throw up my hands and just get a commercial bagless vacuum that's sealed, because I would not want to deal with the visible clouds of dust that are produced when I turn on a vacuum with a shake-out bag. At least bagless vacuums can have some filtration (at least according to VacuumWars on YT). Now granted, I am a little hypocritical, because I have and still do use machines that are unsealed, and have used paper bags in said machines, but at least there's something in those machines to contain some of the fine dust, and I'm working to stop using paper bags in my machines to make their filtration even better.

 

[panasonicvac]

Unfortunately there's not very many options out there for bagless vacuums in the commercial market, alot of the commercial vacuums are bagged. Probably the only one that'd fit your needs the best would be a Hoover Commercial TaskVac. If I had to replace the Shark at my work with something that is also bagless, it'd be that one. Unless if I could convince my office to go for a VacuFlo 566Q with a Acclaim powerhead instead since I find nothing better than central vacs.

 

[amtraksebo1997]

Is it sealed?