Yet more utter garbage from The Daily Mail regarding EU vacuum laws

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turbo500

turbo500

Well-known member
Joined
Aug 24, 2007
Messages
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Location
West Yorkshire, UK
I see The Daily Fail are at it again. They're now encouraging people to panic-buy high power vacuums, which is completely unnecessary and pointless.

And reading some of the comments on this article is making me cringe. People really don't have a clue what they're talking about - "I love my Dyson, it's super powerful blah blah"..."yeh, love, it's only 1200w".


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/ne...es-ban-best-models-September-warns-Which.html
 
I agree with you it's stupid don't need 2000 what's the clean the carpet The new Dyson have 700w and I've just got the exact same suction as the old ones today I went to go and see the new DC 41 and that has the exact same suction as the old one it is really powerful I will make a theme on that separately later and the Daily Mail is completely wrong And Manufacturers are making better products that don't need 2000w
 
Well, I wrote a blog post about buying new vacuums quite a few months ago with the new EU law in mind. 


 


Not so much for the purpose of panic buying but rather for the fact to inform buyers that they can snap up good vacuums at reduced cost prices than a lot of the new EU law uprights in particular which have gone on sale WITH far too high asking cost prices. 


 


Witness the "E" version of the Vax Mac Air Reach. It now costs £250 to £300 or even higher for this "new" lower watt model. Compare that to the old Vax Mach Air Reach which always had 1200/1300watts and it really doesn't make sense.


 


A lot of buyers need to know that whilst 2017 will require vacuums to be made with less than 900 watts, it is not yet the rule. What the rule means is that vacuums that have a total of 1600 watts or lower will be allowed to go on sale and that the old stock of "high power" vacuums can be purchased for the benefit of the buyer who might not feel justified to spend £300
 
Who among our European members is going to test the new low wattage vacs against the old dinosaurs? Take pieces of clean, new carpet, a lane for each vac to be tested, put equal amounts of dirt on each lane, give each vac 25 or 50 or whatever number of passes in their lane and measure how much dirt each vac picked up. Maybe measure suction at the hose and at the floor brush for each vac as well. That should settle most arguments, especially if you can test new and old banned machines from the same manufacturer side by side. Speculation is just that, speculation. Data answers questions.
 
One thing you guys must take into account with E vacuums is that the motors are much more advanced. They cost more to make and suppliers are not as many as with normal motors. Consumers aren't going to settle for less suction .Manufacturers have  have to redesign the motors ( normal brush driven motors ) to get similar suction while spinning much slower. The advantage is that the slower spinning motors make less noise so that is a benefit. The problem is that the costs of these motors are high and as such that gets passed on to the consumer. Go and buy a motor for a green vacuum and it will be almost double the cost of the normal one. I have been really shocked at how much green motors cost straight from the supplier. Were as a Normal 2000watt hs ss motor would cost about $ 5.00 each a green motor of 900watt but with the a similar air speed as the 2000watt will cost between $9 -$13 each. Remember these prices are per unit but with a minimum order of 5000. 


Green does cost more but it will come down as it becomes more popular 
 
I do agree with a few of the comments regarding more European bureaucracy which is ridiculous and I don't buy this "oh saving the environment BS" when you have countries like India and China building coal fuelled power station every week, cutting the wattage on a vacuum motor isn't going to save the day, although it does help, there are many other appliances in homes which consume more energy and are used more frequently.

What I do think is good is that it will force manufacturers to actually put time and effort in R&D, something like the good old days. The Eco vacs I have used and got, from vax especially have very much impressed me.

Brushless, magnetic motors I think is a technology that should be developed properly for vacuum cleaners, and that is something I will give credit to Dyson for, even though he didn't invent the brushless motor, and calling it "digital" is over exaggerating it to be honest.
 
Many years ago California enacted efficiency regulations for home appliances such as light bulbs, air conditioners, refrigerators, washers and driers, etc.. The exact same arguments were made then as are being made over this EU regulation. California's strategy was that the cost of building more new power plants to supply electricity to the increasing number of energy hungry appliances made the old way was far greater than the cost to force manufacturers to design and construct more efficient appliances. There was an additional layer of trying to minimize the amount of investment in upgrading local power delivery grids that were beginning to require higher capacity transformers, switches, everything, as homes loaded up on TVs in every room, big screen TVs, mulitple home computers, appliances of every description that had microprocessors and LED displays on them. Energy demand per home more than quadrupled since many neighborhoods were built and this was putting a severe strain on power companies to keep their grids ahead of demand. The obvious, in hindsight, effective strategy was to use regulation to damp down the growth in energy demand. The alternative was an expensive investment in new power plants and associated power lines and switch yards.

It isn't all about "out of control regulation". There is considerable logic behind these decisions but most consumers have absolutely no clue about the economics of allowing them to turn the lights on with the flip of a switch.
 
That article is true Chris... My house will never be as clean as it once was if I can no longer buy a 2400 watt vax bagless machine. You know the ones I mean... With the cheapo direct filter design.

Once these are outlawed we're all destined to end up like pigs living in our own filth.

I mean a well designed machine with a 900 watt motor, a sebo x1 for example, could NEVER clean as well as a 2000 watt hoover dust manager.

I think I might just end my life now. These imminent changes are too much for me to handle and I just can't bear the thought of my carpets never being as clean lmao
 
Gareth I don't really believe that smaller motors are going to be quieter from the stats already supplied in the UK for some of the "new" low Eco vacuums. 


 


Take Hoover's Purepower - statistically according to their own website, the 2000 watt Purepower has 82 decibels of noise - the new 700 watt Purepower upright has 89decibels - so much for being quieter!


 


Also if you look at this sound level chart, you can see just how dangerously close Hoover are to the "dangerously noise causing ear damage," levels. 


 


 

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The comments are hilarious, all idiots that have no idea of what they are talking about! 'Er more power means it takes less time'.
Hmm, in the past have we ever moaned about the vacuums not being powerful enough?

I doubt Which? actually said this because they state on their website:

''Is vacuum cleaner wattage important?
Manufacturers often use the wattage or power of a vacuum cleaner as a selling point. But a good performance is about design and suction, not how high the wattage is. A high wattage doesn't mean you will get a better vacuum cleaner, but it does mean that you will use more energy. From September 2014 the wattage on vacuum cleaners will be restricted to a maximum of 1600 watts, so the design of the vacuum and floorhead will be more important than ever in delivering the best suction.''


I put out the new dc28, with the energy label, on the back it mentions all the nonsense james was spouting.
Ok James, sure. Review it all you like, all he's bothered about is his sales!
 
Sebo Fan 


 


Technically they should be as the motor is spinning at a far lesser speed, Some of the ones i have tested and much much quieter than their 2000watt counterparts. That said I have not tested a British hoover in a long time. 


 


In South Africa we have no laws in place yet for this, and South Africans are hugely power hungry, If its not 2000watt they don't want it. I do wonder how it will effect AEG and Electrolux here though as the TOR models are all direct EU imports were ass the entry level models come from Chinese factory's. You are going to have a case here were the entry level models will be more powerful than the TOR models .


 


 


On the topic of Noise I am doing some testing on a shopvac style vacuum for a friend of mine, I was given 15 different competitor machines as well as 7 different sample machines to decide which would fair better against the competition. One of the samples the least powerful in suction as well as wattage was the nosiest , 94 db 
 
My Dyson DC24 has a 650 watt motor. It's pretty good on carpets and hard floors but the hose suction is just ok for stairs and the mattress. Never found the DC24 great to use for car cleaning due to the small hose and low suction but I either use my parents more powerful machine when I visit or the handheld I have.

I find the SEBO Felix great for car cleaning with its variable power as the whole body just lays across the seat and heats up the car too on a cold day ;)
 
The US uses 120 VAC, 60 Hz power and household circuites are limited to 15 amps for safety reasons. The most powerful vacs in the US outside of home central vacs advertise drawing 12 amps including the floor brush (figure 9.5-10 amps for the vac itself), which is 1440 watts. We are not hurting for cleaning power over here.

As a practical maximum an appliance could draw maybe 14 amps before risking tripping a weak 15 amp breaker, so figure 1680 max watts. In reality vacuums draw 1400 watts or less under most usage. 2000 or more watts seems like wretched overkill, but since I have no experience with such powerful and power hungry vacs I cannot draw a direct comparison. All I can say is that in the US we have made do with 1400 and something watts total draw for as long as any of us have been alive.
 
I noticed a noticeable difference between my modern USA vacuums and thier 220v counterparts. I have a few machines that I have bought off people who have brought them back to SA after living in the states. 


Most noticeable is the Miele vacuums. The models that come from the USA are good but the 2000watt 220volt ones have much much more suction. the 220v versions stick to the floor like glue were as the 110v versions are easier to move.


 


My AEG Ultra one is also a mean sucker but its 110v Electrolux counterpart was a little unimpressive on the power front although it had the advantage of a cool PN . but using the attachments and the 220v 2100watt wins hands down
 
As I have said in other threads with a view to the EU laws, the only aspect that worries me is that brands won't be redesigning motors that well, but rather just capping them for a lower wattage to justify the law. 


 


I don't think brands will go far enough to produce efficient vacuums that have low noise, and infact, all the things I've come to like with both Miele and SEBO vacuums. It seems buying German for an easier life may be the way forward, even if the prices are still high. 


 


I have no idea what Electrolux are planning. They have already phased out their name in the UK on their own vacuums with only Zanussi taking the budget end and AEG the premium end. Both brands currently don't have low 700 watt main size vacuums - they may well be the last brands to conform.
 
gsheen, how much power is lost through the step down transformer you have to use and is your power 50 Hz or the 60 Hz of the US?
 
Sebo Fan, AEG already has the green range , with 1300watt motors instead of the 2100 watt used in most of their machines. 


 


Deserttortoise 


 


On the smaller step down a small amount is lost but in my home I have the mother of all step down transformers due to the fact that most of our large appliances are from the USA, It has 380v 3phase power feeding it and is the size of a small ride on lawnmower, 


 


 
 
The crazy things coming out of Europe nowadays is getting pretty draconian, why, you can almost hear the marching music! Strangely, this reminds me of a German friend that once made the boastful mistake about being Europeeeen,  and I told'em that wasn't the politest of things to do in public....the proper facilities was the place to do that and to wash your hands when you were through!
smiley-tongue-out.gif


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I hardly think capping vacuum wattage is comparable to nazi Germany. Isn't there a limit in vacuum wattage in the US already?

One thing that hasn't been mentioned yet is how unreliable these cheap, high power vacuums are. The motors run too hot and the filters clog, causing the machine to overheat and wear out altogether in a few years. Then what happens? It goes to the tip and people but a new one, because it's so cheap to do that now. But there's the cost to the local council of getting rid of the old one, and they're building up. I was at my local household waste centre in the summer getting rid of garden waste. I had a sneaky peak in the electrical shed and it was FULL of cheap, high power, bagless vacuums that can't have been more than a few years old.
 

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