What is this?!

[vintagehoover]

I finally received a boxed set of Hoover 541 tools I bought from eBay.com today...my feelings are mixed; the seller described them as 'new', which they're clearly not, although they're in very nice condition. He didn't use any packaging, either, just put the tool box in a bigger box, although luckily they weren't damaged.

What I was most interested in was the Norca bag included in the set; I was imagining it to be a brand-new, full-sized replacement outer bag for a 541 from the mid-1920s...but it doesn't seem to be that at all. Can can anybody tell me what it is, or how it works?! The directions on the wrapper it came in don't seem to have anything to do with it! Also, is it anything rare and interesting, or is it a common find?

 

[vintagehoover]

Closer view of the bag graphic...

...

 

[vintagehoover]

Even closer!

It's printed in gold ink...note it says 'Registered Trade Mark', like a UK machine, rather than 'Reg. US Patent Office', like American-made machines...

 

[vintagehoover]

The wrapper....

Note the fitting instructions don't seem to have anything to do with the bag, which seems much too small to replace an outer bag, and has no fixing loops etc...

 

[vintagehoover]

Tools in box...

All still in paper wrappers.

 

[vintagehoover]

Whole set:

...

 

[vintagehoover]

Box label:

Since it mentions the 543 and 700, I guess they didn't come new with a 541, but were supplied afterwards. Still comes with the old-style dusting brush, though...

 

[vintagehoover]

But anyway...

...can someone tell me anything about the bag?! It's a total mystery to me!

 

[lux1521]

To my knowledge the Norca name was used on replacement parts and low end models at various points. I'll let a real Hoover expert tell more about that.

I think you can tell the tools did not come with a 541 because of the button lock. I think I have disscussed this before with you. A 541 button lock looks like the photo below.

In case you diden't see what I wrote on your site, congrats on the Hoover manual you beat me on. The changes to you site in the last few days are great too.

 

[vintagehoover]

Ah, but...

...it's the old-style furniture nozzle, with the clip-off wooden brush section (see pic). The 700/543-onwards kind had the improvement of the internal rubber membrane which focused the suction at the point-of-contact with the surface being cleaned. The tool convertor is different to the Model 700's, too.

I know about the general history of Norca, it's just this particular 'bag' which is a mystery to me! That's what I need answers on, if anyone can help?

Glad you like the site, I'm continuing to make changes as we speak. I'm using a new editing system, but it has a few glitches, so things may take a little while to sort out.

I didn't know who I was bidding against with that manual - sorry if I outbid you, but if you already have one - which I seem to remember is in better condition to the one I won! - I won't feel too bad about it If I notice any pages which are in any way different to the one you have, I'll be happy to scan them for you.

 

[lux1521]

No, I'm glad you won it! It will be very useful to you. Anyway, you actualy outbid the guy who outbid me. 3 bids from 3 people in about 20 seconds. Anyway, with the current exchange rate it is more affordable to you.

Just out of my curiosity, what material is that bag made of? I though light color bags of any kind were gone by 1927. Do the instructions talk about chemical treatment of any kind?

And for that tool, I think it is a 543/700 style unit. I have one just like it in a 543 tool set.

 

[vintagehoover]

The bag material...

...is very unusual. The outside is similar to the usual Hoover bag kind, while the inside is very soft and fuzzy - it reminds me a little of the fabric used for polishing silverware.

It looks a little like 2/3rds of a pillow-case, with one end cut off! It seems too small to replace an external Hoover dustbag, and has none of the fittings to attach it to a cleaner. The logo is also rather randomly located, and is upside-down to the open end, as if it wasn't indended to be seen...I can't make head or tail of it! I have no point of reference for it, I've never seen anything like it before. Here's a picture with the bag and an extention tube, for size-comparison:

 

[vintagehoover]

A close-up:

I thought perhaps it could be something meant for storing the tools in, but the open end seems a bit roughly-finished for that...

Or maybe the replacement Norca bag was stored in this, and in turn, placed in the large paper envelope...

 

[vintagehoover]

Interesting point about the upholstery nozzle!

I always thought that the newer-style nozzle was introduced with the Models 700 and 543, but it seems I am wrong! I have two Model 700 manuals, one slightly later than the other one. The later of the two has a little inset graphic showing the new nozzle, but the older one does not, so it seems early 700s and 543s will have the clip-off style nozzle, later ones will have the rubber-membrane style! Thanks for clearing that up

 

[lux1521]

That bag is very interesting. I'm thinking it stored something and was sewn shut, and then cut open. I'd almost think it was a protective cover for a replacement bag.

I'll make one last comment about the upholstery nozzle. It should be noted that the early 543/700 style and the 541 style are still not the same. The physical size of the metal nozzle is different. That makes for a total of 3 types from 1923 to about 1930. The 541 crevice tool I have is made of some type of plastic and if you look at it from one end it is off center compared to the metal and on center tool for a 543 and 700 and later models.

As you will see in the manual you got, the early attachment sets were much different from the ones we have. They were actualy more complete in some ways if I remember right. When I look at the big picture of Hoover attachments during that time period, I tend to think they devolved somewhat from the late 1910s to 1930.

 

[chestermikeuk]

Hhhmmmm

I wonder if it was used for "Air Purifying", take the main bag off and put this on to filter the air in your room....would make sense by the instructions on the cover...

Or is it the start of Hepa Bags!!!! slip it inside the main bag for added germ protection....

It does state that it has bag ring hooks to fit over the exhaust housing....my guess is the part of the bag with these on has been removed or ripped off, doesnt look a clean cut on the bag though....very interesting...

 

[vintagehoover]

Hi, Mike...

Im pretty sure that no fixings have been cut off, because there's absolutely no sign anything was ever attached. Even the open end doesn't seem to have been cut, because the stitching which runs up either side is finished properly at the ends - if it had been cut, surely the stitching would have been severed and come unravelled.

I'm pretty sure this is not, in fact a Norca bag, since it doesn't seem to match the description in any way!

Which still leaves me asking, what is it?!

 

[collector2]

I'm certainly no expert on this (as hoover or old sewing machines arent my forte) but is it possible that this is something that someone made out of what was left of the original bag? I cant really tell from the pictures but the edges appear to be serged and, to my knowledge, they didnt have sergers at that time. Any one know enough about that to give us a clue?

 

[vacuumkid3]

I think overlock stitching (serging) was invented in the 1800s. I found this on Wikipedia, so we know it MUST be true! ;-)

~~K~~