Vacuum Motors with Adjustable Wattage

[eurekaprince]

It seems that since the 1970's, European vacuum manufacturers offered 220-volt machines with variable speed motors. In North America, our vac-makers offered suction controls that would open valves to weaken the suction, instead of allowing the user to control the speed of the motor. I can't remember any vintage North American vacuum older than 1980 that offered the user the ability to adjust the speed of the motor (someone correct me if I'm wrong!)

It's only recently that we have begun to see variable wattage 110-volt motors with the arrival of European imports like Miele and Bosch and Electrolux. And of course, the ingenious Panasonic/Kenmore beltless brush-roll motor can be adjusted for speed to allow the user to vacuum on a "gentle" setting. But previous to 1980, it was a rare vac in a North American store that offered a motor with an electronically adjustable speed (for example, the high end Hoover Dimension and high end Eureka Express).

I am not an electrical engineer, but could someone perhaps explain (in layman's terms) why was this so much more common in Europe for such a long time? Are European 220-volt electrical grids and services more amenable to variable wattage motors? Does this have to do with the difference in electrical systems between Europe and North America? Are adjustable motors so much cheaper in Europe? Could someone perhaps shed some light on this difference?

 

[kenkart]

Two speed!

Kenmores were introduced in 1958,Royal as well as several others had two speed uprights in the 30s and 40s,also Filter Queen had a two speed introduced in the early 60s,Cadillac had both tanks and canisters that were two speed in the 40s and 50s and the Bison upright was variable speed.Im sure there are more but I cant think of them now.

 

[twocvbloke]

I don't think it's to do with the electrical supply, we have very similar grids, ours in the UK is 240v 50hz, that's really the only difference...

The motors are just your bog standard sucky-blowy motors, it's the electronics added before the motor that do the varying, as to why we have them, to be honest I'm not sure myself, it's just one of them things that to me has always been available as an option, but it is handy to drop the speed of the motor to say clean up a mess made on the floor at 2 in the morning (that's why I keep the miele, cos it's relatively quiet), while still getting full airflow at the nozzle, rather than relying solely on the suction relief valve...

Both my Electrolux Slimline (which I don't have, of course) and the miele have both speed control on the vac and a suction relief valve on the hose, handy for cleaning without having to go upto the max. power rating, so you save energy while cleaning, which could be the reason for the controls...

 

[eurekaprince]

Hans - yes it is true that many of our older North American uprights and canisters offered 2 speeds: high and low. Even my childhood Eureka 260 upright had two speeds.

I guess I should have been more specific. The European vacs offered a real range of speeds - either with a dial or a slider. Even the high end Eureka Express had a European-like slider on the canister to set the motor speed to many more than just two settings. But European canister vac-makers really focussed on offering you different wattages - you see this on so many canisters (settings offered could be 200watts, 400 watts, 800watts etc). We never saw wattage settings on our vacs.....

David - it may have to do with the preponderance of canisters in Europe, I guess. While North America is the birthplace of the upright (Hoover), Europe is the birthplace of the canister (Electrolux). Upright makers were more concerned with offering adjustable heights to match different carpets, whereas canister makers could focus on offering varying suction and tools for different jobs. Maybe that's the source of the difference?

 

[jmurray01]

As David said, I doubt it is to do with the electricity supplies.

I presume it is just something people preferred to have here in the UK and something people didn't bother about in the US - A bit like headlights being on a lot of US cleaners but hardly any UK cleaners.

I love Vacuum Cleaners with adjustable wattage! It is so much better than having a little valve that hardly does anything.

Out of my three Vacuum Cleaners that have variable wattage (2002 Electrolux Tango 1400W Bagged Cylinder, 2004 Panasonic MC-E8011 1800W Twin Cyclonic Bagless Cylinder & 1994 HOOVER Turbopower 1000W Bagged Upright) the Electroluxes system is the best.

You can lower it to an amazing low of 250W which I use when I'm using the crevice and upholstery tool as it creates more than enough suction for that and you literally can barely hear the motor! I'm not exaggerating at all. It is just a very quiet hum no louder than a fridge.

When I'm using the main floor tool I could either use the Economy setting which is 650W, the specific Carpet setting which is 750W, or the Hard Flooring setting which is the full 1400W.

I tend to use the Economy setting on carpets, as it has more than enough suction, and use the full 1400W on the laminate, but the Economy setting would work well too, I just want to make sure my laminate is crumb free.

 

[vacbear58]

European cannisters

Interesting thread.

As I recall the first UK cannisters to have an electronic suction control would have been the more TOL Hoover Freedom models from 1973 onwards. Although manufactured here it seems they were designed in North Canton. Hoover carried this on with TOL Sensotronic and Compact models - but these again would have been American designs and indeed there were equivalent models in the US, which there were not for the Freedoms (not sure about Canada though). I cannot think of any Electrolux cannister which had electronic control until the 350E in the mid 1980s. And none on the vintage Goblins either - the TOL 701 had a rotary dial but that was just a suction relief valve not and electronic control.

Al

 

[vintagerepairer]

Interesting. Like everything else, the cost of the electronic parts has fallen drastically. Whereas before, one paid considerably more for a cleaner with electronic suction control, today it is very common. I know one reason for this is that with the motor wattages being so high on many cleaners today, starting them at full could cause the fuse in the plug to blow on start-up. Therefore so many cleaners have soft-start. And whlist they are fitting soft-start, they may as well stick a power control on as well I guess.

Though I expect a good deal of people have made use of the electronic control on thier cylinders from time to time, on upright cleaners this feature seemed surplus to requirements, even when folk had paid extra for it. I can't tell you how many upright cleaners I had brought in which had failed circut boards and where the owner was happier to have the whole lot removed instead of paying for new parts. I am not saying these parts failed often, but I am saying of those which did and came my way, people didn't want to pay more than they had to.

Indeed I too can think of no other Electrolux cleaner with power control before the 350E. The first Goblin to have it was on those huge cylinders which they made in the very early 1980's. This was before Goblin was taken over and I am fairly sure they were only branded Goblin and built elsewhere. One thing I have never understood though is why cleaners with electronic power control usually have the air-control on the hose handle as well. The most confusing cleaner of all was the Electrolux 506 and 560 upright, which had electronic control on the cleaner, but also had air control on the cleaning head.

 

[jmurray01]

Ah, so is the reason my 1800 Watt Panasonic starts up slowly (takes about 2-3 seconds to fully speed up when you press the power button) because of the "Soft Start" ?

My 1977 HOOVER Ranger does this also, but being 400 Watt I doubt it is because it NEEDS to, but rather because it is a bit worn out.

 

[eurekaprince]

Thanks for these posts, my friends over there in Europe.

Indeed, to be more clear: We in North America indeed began seeing canisters with variable wattage control in the 1980's - but VERY few. It was a feature that was only offered on top of the line Hoovers and Eurekas (Hoover Dimension and Eureka Express). Never saw it on a Panasonic or a Kenmore or a Japanese-made Sharp. Of course, Miele began selling 120-volt canisters here by the late 1980's - and they all had the European-style wattage control.

Regarding "Soft Start" - I remember using a Rowenta canister in Tel Aviv in 1998 that had that! That was sooooo cool! The vac also had 4 buttons for different wattages, and each button had an LED light to tell you it was activated!

I think we may have hit on the answer: In Europe, the maximum wattage available on canisters is so much higher than in North America. In North America, our maximum is 1440watts (120volts x 12 amps). Our safety standards institutes don't seem to allow this to go any higher. But in Europe, you seem to have vacs that are rated as high as 2200watts - correct me if I am wrong. So you needed to install a "soft start" transformer that would slowly ramp up the wattage to maximum. And once you have that installed, you might as well offer the user the ability to set the wattage as well!

My new Electrolux UltraSilencer Green indeed has both a variable wattage motor and a nice air valve on the hose handle. I actually like the combination! Set on the lowest wattage, this vac is nearly silent and I can even do some light cleaning if I get home to my apartment (flat) late at night. By closing the valve, I get very strong suction - even at the lowest, quietest wattage setting. I guess I use the valve to decrease or increase the "grab" of the attachment at the cleaning end of things - it allows me to continually adjust the "stickiness" of the floor tool or the upholstery nozzle. Having both adjustments is a very nice combination - you can really modify the action as you clean.

Thanks for all these responses, friends!

 

[twocvbloke]

Generally old Seniors are slow-starters from the outset, my 652A started up a lot more slowly than my similarly-designed Sanitaires, it's just a Hoover thing...

I just find it funny that people believe that more electrical Watts means more cleaning power, but, it doesn't, it just means more electricity used, my Sanitaires use about 600 watts, the larger Kirbys use 700 watts, the D80 uses I think 4-500 (no ID plate and I forget the amperage), the Victor uses 660w, the two Juniors 250 watts, and all clean pretty well, even the Juniors surprisingly, so why people insist on going out and buying an 1800 Watt eardrum-bursting fuse-blower, I don't know... :S

 

[vacbear58]

Goblins

I am not the expert that many of our European friends are but I am pretty sure Miele were offering variable power back in the 1970s, and maybe earlier. And again I think some of the german sourced Hotpoints (Bosch) from around the end of the 1970s had variable power too.

"The first Goblin to have it was on those huge cylinders which they made in the very early 1980's"

Benny, you have spiked my curiousity now. It came as a great surprise to me when I discovered that Goblin were still flogging their 701 (703 by that time I think) cannister at the end of the 1970s and possibly into the 1980s. I had thought they were long gone by that time until I acquired a Goblin brochure which showed it alongside the 555/666 and Housemaid models. Is this the one you were thinking of? A very squared off machine with all plastic body with two vents of the side of the case. If so, its the one I refer to in my earlier reply but it was just a relief vale not a power control. It had been around since the mid-1960s - I remember well that the first time I saw one was as the star prize on Take Your Pick - the quiz show with Michael Miles.

Benny, you are probably one of the few on here who will know what the hell I am talking about

Al

PS Although the clip is labelled 1955 that is when the show started, I would say the clip is much later - probably mid 1960s

 

[hoover719]

The older Hoover Convertibles made from 1957 until the early 1970s had two speeds. The wattage at low speed for carpets was 420, while the high speed wattage when the converter is inserted into the rear was 625.

 

[jmurray01]

Brian - I believe the highest wattage we could have over here in the UK would be 3000 Watts. Ridiculous.

Although my Panasonic MC-E8011 1800W works well, it is borderline for being over powered.

 

[vintagerepairer]

The maximum wattage that a 13amp UK socket can supply is a little over 3kw (3000w). However a vacuum cleaner would need a soft-start if nothing else, as the surge on start-up would be terrific. I don't think 3kw will ever happen. If it did, the cleaner would need a flex capable of carrying such current, and given then length of lead on a vacuum cleaner, this would be both expensive and impracticle.

Vacbear, i will look at that link. Alas we did not have a TV set at home until 1980. My father is to blame for that. I do have vauge memories of the program you mentioned.

The Goblin cleaner i refered to was not the 701 or whatever number. This Goblin, or should i say these as there were several in the range, was large, with a top mounted swivel hose. It had 4 rollers in the rear, to make it easy to move when stood up. Two of those rollers formed the rear wheels when the machine was laid flat. I will look for pictures later. At least one model had electronic control. These cleaners had huge 38mm tubes and hose, which is the same as Victor used to use on their commercial cleaners. There were at least two styles of motor in these cleaners, one of which was Electrolux.

 

[twocvbloke]

13x240=3120 Watts, give or take the variances for power factor stuff (not that it affects domestic electrickery supplies of course)...

Personally, I'd like to see something like BS546 making a return, where you had sockets specific to the amps or watts your appliances needed, the only reason they got rid of the BS546 standard was cos of people using adaptors to use a 2-amp device on a 15-amp socket, and them wondering why their fuses didn't blow on a fault and burned down their house... :&#92

 

[vintagerepairer]

You really do like your horror stories, Mr 2CV! I would do a smile icon now if I knew how. Fire was a possibilty, but not a daily occurance. Now I know how old you are, I know you weren't around to live through what actually went on, so I'll elighten you a little. More common than fire from fuses not blowing or overloaded sockets was the electric shock hazard, and then again you were more likely to trip or fall over a cable or fall off a chair connecting an appliance to a light socket than that.

You mention what you term 'the only reason' but there were so many reasons for the introduction of one plug which did all. The real flaw in the system was that people had to fit their own plugs to new appliances, and so often they got it very wrong. Had they been done by the people who made the appliances, the UK 13amp plug may have been the best system in the world.

But as things go in circles, we are now seeing a return of poorly attached plugs and incorrect fusing from source, and that is because it is being allowed to happen. I don't know why. I think fires from plugs and extention leads could well come back into fashion.

 

[jmurray01]

I'm no electrician, but I read books on things and like to know a bit about what I'm doing, so I've learned some information about electronics so that in the future should I have to do anything that involves electrics, I should manage to do it safely.

If only other people learned a bit about things before saying "ah, it'll be fine!".

 

[vintagerepairer]

I love irony!

 

[twocvbloke]

"and that is because it is being allowed to happen. I do

I do, it's that country in the far east that points nukes at anyone who so much as suggests they're doing things wrong....

I've been dismayed at many electricals that are imported from abroad, when I was working at a computer shop, we got a large batch of computer power supplies complete with power cables, they were supposed to be UK plugs, and they were, of sorts, they were of the sort that had no facility for a fuse, so you could have 30 amps running down the cable if there was a fault in the computer, and I thought I'd cut the plug off to wire a new one on to see if I could rescue the batch for my employer, and I found that all the wires had been stained brown (presumably dye that leached from the black outer sleeving), so I couldn't distinguish between Live, Neutral & Earth, so, they all were thrown out, never being allowed into the customer's hands, because they were totally unsafe and should never have been supplied, ever... :&#92

And then there were the power supplies (same brand as the above batch too) that were explosives in their own right, only finding out a few weeks after selling the complete systems to the customer, we had quite the shortage of PSUs that month with all the warranty replacements we did... :S

That was apparently caused by those dodgy capacitors that were made using a stolen electrolyte recipe, but was incorrectly written down and thus caused a massive build up of gasses within the cases, and went pop with some force, some of the PSUs had dents in them from the exploding caps... :S

There's a good reason I decided my speciality was laptops rather than desktops at the time...