Next Kirby?
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ralph123
Well-known member
With all of the great neighborhood web sites and social media to warn people about Kirby & other door to door salespersons being in the neighborhood, I'm surprised they can still get in houses. On my local nextdoor site, the comments were about being sure to have a no solicitors sign and to not let them in the door because "Kirby sucks in a bad way". Who is still letting them in the door? I can't imagine anyone who has a lot of hard floors even considering a Kirby.
Kirby may be a great vacuum for deep carpet, but it's bulky and lacks on board tools. The sales pitch seems to be to bully the consumer into buying the product whether they want it or not. I wonder how many returns they would have per month if they had a more reasonable 30-day return policy versus the 72-hours?
Kirby may be a great vacuum for deep carpet, but it's bulky and lacks on board tools. The sales pitch seems to be to bully the consumer into buying the product whether they want it or not. I wonder how many returns they would have per month if they had a more reasonable 30-day return policy versus the 72-hours?
oreck_xl
Well-known member
I really hope I'm wrong here, but in New York Kirby isn't doing well. The number of distributors is diminishing and I think they're gonna get the full mileage out of that Generation platform until they close their doors. We may see another variation or two of the Generation series before they shudder completely but I don't think we'll ever see a completely new model again...
One thing you can't argue is that Kirby and Rainbow haven't compromised their principles. Neither has sold out to a conglomerate like TTI.
Unlike so many other at one time popular brands. No one other than the purchaser decides what the machine is worth to them.
Unlike the biggest retailer in the United State. (We all know who that is) That tells the manufacturers what price point they will pay per unit to be sold in one of their stores.
The days of purchasing a quality piece of equipment are gone for those who don't feel the need for a Kirby or Rainbow and at one time Electrolux. There was a time when Hoovers were not only affordable to the masses they were also well made and reliable. The Kenmore line was also very well made and reliable as well as cost efficient to the masses.
Today's generation simply can not function without having a product improved or redesigned every 12 months to throw away money on. Today's generation wasn't taught about value and longevity. They did not suffer thru one or both world wars. A depression where the masses lost everything and struggled daily just to see another day. They have no concept of what true hardship is. They only know the benefits of the post war years when things were better because of two income family's. Today's generation has never had to do with out.
Kirby and Rainbow have survived for decades with out having to completely redesign their products. As many of you gripe about. They are still here producing their product true to form as they have for decades. As you may have noticed the models that are coveted from the past and are still spoken highly of are no longer available. Now said companies have sold out to one large conglomerate that cheapened up products to be disposable with in 2 - 3 years and most of all you can't purchase the one part that is needed to make the machine usable. P.S.True beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
Bottom line is no one is forcing you to buy it.
I for one will stick with what has been tried and true to me for over 48 years. Anyone that wants my share of today's over priced unreliable and or disposable equipment is welcome to my share.
Unlike so many other at one time popular brands. No one other than the purchaser decides what the machine is worth to them.
Unlike the biggest retailer in the United State. (We all know who that is) That tells the manufacturers what price point they will pay per unit to be sold in one of their stores.
The days of purchasing a quality piece of equipment are gone for those who don't feel the need for a Kirby or Rainbow and at one time Electrolux. There was a time when Hoovers were not only affordable to the masses they were also well made and reliable. The Kenmore line was also very well made and reliable as well as cost efficient to the masses.
Today's generation simply can not function without having a product improved or redesigned every 12 months to throw away money on. Today's generation wasn't taught about value and longevity. They did not suffer thru one or both world wars. A depression where the masses lost everything and struggled daily just to see another day. They have no concept of what true hardship is. They only know the benefits of the post war years when things were better because of two income family's. Today's generation has never had to do with out.
Kirby and Rainbow have survived for decades with out having to completely redesign their products. As many of you gripe about. They are still here producing their product true to form as they have for decades. As you may have noticed the models that are coveted from the past and are still spoken highly of are no longer available. Now said companies have sold out to one large conglomerate that cheapened up products to be disposable with in 2 - 3 years and most of all you can't purchase the one part that is needed to make the machine usable. P.S.True beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
Bottom line is no one is forcing you to buy it.
I for one will stick with what has been tried and true to me for over 48 years. Anyone that wants my share of today's over priced unreliable and or disposable equipment is welcome to my share.
@Oreck XL
Part of the Kirby's down sizing dealers is the change in floor coverings. Many home owners have gone to hard surface floors. Thus no real need for a vacuum that can suck the dust mites out from under the sissel mats on the floors in china at the same time they are vacuuming the carpet in their own living room. There is very little carpeting to vacuum.
Another reason is the on going contracted sales force that rapes and pillages anyone they come in contact with. Therefor giving Kirby a bad name. The Kirby company will and has shut down ruthless sales teams. we have lost A few dealers here for that reason alone.
Most don't realize They can name their own price with in reason. They are not at the local Walmart where the price is the price. Unless of course a competitor has a better price the same product they will price match.
In 1987 I bought a new Kirby for $650.00 the vacuum itself, above floor cleaning tools, shampooer and zip brush. The "suggested list price was $1,100.00 for the machine and above floor tools. My ace in the hole was I already knew what I was getting (been using Kirby's since 1969) and that you can in fact bargain with the sales man for a better price.
Incredibly It is still here today and performs as well as the day I bought it. Imagine that.
Part of the Kirby's down sizing dealers is the change in floor coverings. Many home owners have gone to hard surface floors. Thus no real need for a vacuum that can suck the dust mites out from under the sissel mats on the floors in china at the same time they are vacuuming the carpet in their own living room. There is very little carpeting to vacuum.
Another reason is the on going contracted sales force that rapes and pillages anyone they come in contact with. Therefor giving Kirby a bad name. The Kirby company will and has shut down ruthless sales teams. we have lost A few dealers here for that reason alone.
Most don't realize They can name their own price with in reason. They are not at the local Walmart where the price is the price. Unless of course a competitor has a better price the same product they will price match.
In 1987 I bought a new Kirby for $650.00 the vacuum itself, above floor cleaning tools, shampooer and zip brush. The "suggested list price was $1,100.00 for the machine and above floor tools. My ace in the hole was I already knew what I was getting (been using Kirby's since 1969) and that you can in fact bargain with the sales man for a better price.
Incredibly It is still here today and performs as well as the day I bought it. Imagine that.
oreck_xl
Well-known member
It is a tried and true design, I will give you that. But could any other consumer product soldier on virtually unchanged for the past THIRTY years? Probably not. Take for instance, the automotive industry. Would you buy a car that looks essentially the same as the 1990 model if there are other choices out there? Probably not. I was as much a fan of the Generation 3 when it came out in 1990 as anyone else in the forum, as I was the G4, G5, G6, and so on. But, by 2014 (dovetailed with the centennial of Kirby) I expected something truly revolutionary again. That didn't happen. I saw prototype drawings on this very site of a totally new Kirby. When I saw that the Avalir was just another warmed-over Generation series machine it was a bit of a disappointment. And let's face it. The G-series IS a dated design, and the Tech Drive DOES make the machine heavier to lift up and down stairs. I think people would really like to see 12-inch "granny head" again and yours truly would love to see an on/off switch in the handle (as the prototype drawings indicated). If the Kirby salesman were to come to my house, I'd pull out my Generation 3 and ask point blank "okay, so what really IS the difference?" The answer, purely cosmetic.
human
Well-known member
Quite true. I've often said that Kirby's biggest competitor is itself. Why would anyone step up to a brand new Kirby's four-figure pricetag when you can go down to you local thrift store and pick a nice one up, a few years old, with all its accessories for less than the price of a new plasticrap vac at Wallyworld? My barely used gray and orange Sentria was a hell of a lot better value at $110 than a brand new Avalir that would have cost me 10-15 times as much. I'd much rather take advantage of a somewhat saturated second hand market.
dysonman1
Well-known member
The Kirby has changed
so much in 100 years of making them. Not. Model 1C on the left, 100th Anniversary Avalir on the right. Generation after Generation.
so much in 100 years of making them. Not. Model 1C on the left, 100th Anniversary Avalir on the right. Generation after Generation.
rivstg1
Well-known member
colors etc
With minor but constant airflow improvements due to brushroll design, emptor redesigns, bag technology, fill tube diameter and construction changes, and finally a slightly higher spinning motor . But, everyone is basically correct with their statements....its almost same vacuum since 1990.
I was talking with a Kirby technician and salesman for 35+ years....he told me from what he knew of the ownership/engineering aspect of the company....they HAVE tested moving the attachments onto the handle area and several other changes.....and that they won't manufacture a 'new' Kirby unless its better performing than the existing one. IF all that's true, it certainly adds ammo to the understanding of WHY its still basically the same vacuum.
ideas to ponder....
With minor but constant airflow improvements due to brushroll design, emptor redesigns, bag technology, fill tube diameter and construction changes, and finally a slightly higher spinning motor . But, everyone is basically correct with their statements....its almost same vacuum since 1990.
I was talking with a Kirby technician and salesman for 35+ years....he told me from what he knew of the ownership/engineering aspect of the company....they HAVE tested moving the attachments onto the handle area and several other changes.....and that they won't manufacture a 'new' Kirby unless its better performing than the existing one. IF all that's true, it certainly adds ammo to the understanding of WHY its still basically the same vacuum.
ideas to ponder....
Dysonman
That's an impressive pic. The vacuum looks aerodynamically different but same uniform style. The belt lifter came in 1946 but that's 72 years ago. Small things but like you said they haven't changed much and they won't.
Beautiful 1c or 2c.
Les
That's an impressive pic. The vacuum looks aerodynamically different but same uniform style. The belt lifter came in 1946 but that's 72 years ago. Small things but like you said they haven't changed much and they won't.
Beautiful 1c or 2c.
Les
oreck_xl
Well-known member
They've had long enough to develop a new design....
We know that the Generation 3 was in the works since at least the days of the Heritage II (ala the Prometheus). And rolled it out on the 20th anniversary of the Classic platform. I hope by the 30th anniversary of the Generation 3 next year they have something new and revolutionary.
We know that the Generation 3 was in the works since at least the days of the Heritage II (ala the Prometheus). And rolled it out on the 20th anniversary of the Classic platform. I hope by the 30th anniversary of the Generation 3 next year they have something new and revolutionary.
juju93
Well-known member
Well if they read these forums then they can take some ideas and roll with it. Like it shouldn’t be hard. If rainbow can improve on the E2 Black and come out with the new SRX then Kirby can do something, besides a new shampooer.
Rainbow was long over due to increase the airflow and suction power of the vacuum. According to what has been posted here there is supposed to be a 30% increase.
A light bulb in the water pan hardly improves it's over all performance. I for one wasn't impressed by the redesign of the power head.
I would like to see the Kirby loose some weight. How ever I don't want a plastic vacuum either. I would like to see the Dual sanitronic make a come back with today's performance.
A light bulb in the water pan hardly improves it's over all performance. I for one wasn't impressed by the redesign of the power head.
I would like to see the Kirby loose some weight. How ever I don't want a plastic vacuum either. I would like to see the Dual sanitronic make a come back with today's performance.
I don't want a Kirby with the hose and tools onboard-will just make the machine even MORE heavy,clunky,awkward and less useable.I don't use the Kirby hose hardly at all-and funny use the attachments on OTHER vacuums!In general don't like hose and tool on board uprights.And sometimes you leave a trail of tools you have to go back and pick up when they fall off.NO THANKS!Kirby has reached the peak as to how good they are going to be-NOT BROKE----DON'T FIX IT!!I can agree a new machine based on the older designs would be good to try.
DO NOT want the direct drive brushroll-these motor in the brushrolls are plagued with expensive failures.You have to replace the WHOLE THING-otherwise its just a few dollar belt.Take the belt anytime!When the motor in the roll was really popular seen PILES of these rolls in vac shop junkpiles-along with the vacuums they went to when the customer bought a conventional belt driven brush from the vac delaer in a NEW machine.
Electric Attachments?
For me, I think they should bring the of the pre-Sentria Kirby back and add some electric attachments. All they would have to do is add a power take-off socket on the side of the vacuum and make an electrified hose. That way they could offer an electric power nozzle and an electric version of the Zippbrush. Once they do that, all they would have to do it make it an optional accessory and call it the Electric Attachment Set. Kirby wouldn't even have to make the electric nozzles themselves. All they would have to do is purchase them through Wessel-Werk (EBK 360 perhaps) and then slap their names on them like every other vacuum manufacturer. That way, you can use your Kirby to get under low pieces of furniture (a magical concept in the world of Kirby) They should also bring back the normal/delicate switch that made its appearance and exit on the Diamond Edition.
They should also drop the black color scheme and come up with something different. Another thing that might be an interesting feature would be a retractable power cord. Take what a Kirby used to be in the Generation Series and add some new features that they haven't tried before.
For me, I think they should bring the of the pre-Sentria Kirby back and add some electric attachments. All they would have to do is add a power take-off socket on the side of the vacuum and make an electrified hose. That way they could offer an electric power nozzle and an electric version of the Zippbrush. Once they do that, all they would have to do it make it an optional accessory and call it the Electric Attachment Set. Kirby wouldn't even have to make the electric nozzles themselves. All they would have to do is purchase them through Wessel-Werk (EBK 360 perhaps) and then slap their names on them like every other vacuum manufacturer. That way, you can use your Kirby to get under low pieces of furniture (a magical concept in the world of Kirby) They should also bring back the normal/delicate switch that made its appearance and exit on the Diamond Edition.
They should also drop the black color scheme and come up with something different. Another thing that might be an interesting feature would be a retractable power cord. Take what a Kirby used to be in the Generation Series and add some new features that they haven't tried before.
juju93
Well-known member
Also scale down the overall size of the carpet shampooer. It’s too bulky and can’t get into tight spaces.
Re: the carpet shampooer
I think that it would be cool to change from the "dry" method (suds) to an actual extractor by upgrading the motor, fan and fancase to handle direct water contact. A modified shampooer head could incorporate the extraction nozzle and brush in one unit. The collection tank could be a part of a different handle specifically for carpet extraction mode, which could also incorporate the solution reservoir, pump/regulator, controls and hot water inlet (no "clean water" tank, just get it from the source). Perhaps this would be the second best thing to using a truckmount service or a true commercial grade extractor.
I think that it would be cool to change from the "dry" method (suds) to an actual extractor by upgrading the motor, fan and fancase to handle direct water contact. A modified shampooer head could incorporate the extraction nozzle and brush in one unit. The collection tank could be a part of a different handle specifically for carpet extraction mode, which could also incorporate the solution reservoir, pump/regulator, controls and hot water inlet (no "clean water" tank, just get it from the source). Perhaps this would be the second best thing to using a truckmount service or a true commercial grade extractor.
luxlife
Well-known member
I think the rug renovator would be a great CRB design...
That is, if they can make the modifications to it. CRB stands for Counter Rotating Brushes, which is the basis of the Host carpet cleaning platform, Whittaker’s LOMAC platform and plenty of other brands that emphasize low moisture and encapsulation for carpet cleaning. It would totally revolutionize that attachment for Kirby.
That is, if they can make the modifications to it. CRB stands for Counter Rotating Brushes, which is the basis of the Host carpet cleaning platform, Whittaker’s LOMAC platform and plenty of other brands that emphasize low moisture and encapsulation for carpet cleaning. It would totally revolutionize that attachment for Kirby.
rodknock95
Well-known member
Canister
I think they should design a canister and corner the market. I use my Kirby for bi-day whip outs, and when I really get in the cleaning mode, use the Aerus Guardian cause its easier to switch from carpet mode to hose mode.
Blaze
I think they should design a canister and corner the market. I use my Kirby for bi-day whip outs, and when I really get in the cleaning mode, use the Aerus Guardian cause its easier to switch from carpet mode to hose mode.
Blaze
Kirby canister-wouldn't that be from their Douglas division?Retract cord on the Kirby-drather stick with what they have-I just don't like cordreels on uprights.The powered attachments sounds nice.How bout replacing the foam carpet cleaner with a true dry one using Host or Capture.There could be an attachment to spread and work those in-than the regular nozzle and reusable dump bag to pick the powder back up in.
These are reasons
why people like vacuum collectors would be a great source for vac manufacturers. We know these cleaners, use them, love/hate them.
Wouldn't you love to sit down with "Research and Development" at these companies?
why people like vacuum collectors would be a great source for vac manufacturers. We know these cleaners, use them, love/hate them.
Wouldn't you love to sit down with "Research and Development" at these companies?
Dual Motors?
Another thing that Kirby could do to change up the Generation Series might infuriate some people is make the power nozzle electric. That way, the main motor could focus on raw suction and self propel and that way, It might be able to produce more airflow.
Another thing that Kirby could do to change up the Generation Series might infuriate some people is make the power nozzle electric. That way, the main motor could focus on raw suction and self propel and that way, It might be able to produce more airflow.
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