Making the ds50 a bit more modern

[rivstg1]

Hepa bag conversion on Dual Sanitronic 50. I got the idea from texaskirbyguy. I used a generic charcoal bag ( for odor killing ). After a mechanic cleaning ( new front bearing), it runs soooo smoothly , and a partial cosmetic renovation Including new felt around the emptor ( needs more scratch removal), I’m really happy with it. I may add wide front wheels, we’ll see. What do ya’ll think about this conversion? I get to keep the classic look and modern filtering . Sani Emptor is fully functional , I wasnt able to secure the inner bag to the top of the outer bag so it’s just stuffed in. This isn’t a ‘daily driver’ so I don’t anticipate changing the bag for a long while.

 

[rivstg1]

More restoration

 

[rivstg1]

A few more

 

[rivstg1]

Respect to those Kirby restorers who make a near flawless shine. Man, this work shows a couple of hours 3.5 ( for everything ...cleaning, washing, mechanical, and polishing ). Here I show one side that still has deep gouges in the metal, the other pic shows result of removing those gouges in that side. Still needs more but I grew tired of it. Haha

 

[lesinutah]

Hey

I clean off vacuum with barkeeper's friend and sos pass. I go over everything with steel wool. I work up going to 2000 grit. On 800-2000 I wet sand. The wet sanding it's what gets those flaws out. I then buff with red green and white compound. Then I use mother's mag and clean off with micro fiber towels. I use Mr clean sponges for trim. I spray electrical cleaner on armature and coil. If you polish screws it actually helps keeping the screws strength. I put armature on drill making sure it's balanced. I also use commuter Stone and sand paper while it's on the drill. I put altogether and use baby wipes to finish it off.
I did myd80 nozze and I didn't wet sand enough leaving small blemishes. Mirror finish with no flaws takes paitence.
Les
Very nice d50. Just looks nice.

 

[texaskirbyguy]

Great work!!

Excellent job despite only 3.5 hours on it! Yes, wet sanding takes a lot of patience and time. See my G6 resto thread for more comments on this (its headlight was bad). I would not try to get all the scratches out, as you may make yourself crazy. I leave in many of them as 'battle scars' from 50+ years of service.

So is that outer bag the replacement or an original? My mom's D50 had the wide-spaced ovals...
Glad that my experiment is working for others as well with the HEPA bag conversion.

The D50 is my favorite Kirby - very classy! And that one had lots of potential. Sure wish I had beat you to the shop to get it! )

 

[texaskirbyguy]

BTW, leave the narrow front wheels if you do not have lots of very plush carpet - looks much nicer.

 

[paul]

Awesome-looking DS50, Kelton. You do great work!

Is it a '65, '66, or '67?

 

[vacuumdevil]

Wonderful polish job! I've been thinking about a retrofit option for these vacuums for a long time ,that doesn't concern the mini emptier that we commonly see put on from the heritage 2. There was an insert on the Kirby tradition with a bag hose . I've been thinking copying it with a 3D printer and then making it so it has the ability to take a Hoover A HEPA bag I'd really like to see some modern filtration coming and easier way for everybody who enjoys these vintage Kirby's like we do.

Can't wait to see the end result when that bag is full.

 

[ultralux88]

If I could get my hands on one of the newer style 3D printers that print solid plastic parts, I could have loads of fun printing up bag adapters for all kinds of machines, so one could install the adapter and then just use a modern, easy to find bag in a machine where bags are not made anymore.

 

[rivstg1]

Paul,

Thank you sir, it’s a ‘67 model, but I also have a ‘65 that’s almost as nice...thing is, there too much wear on the back of the powernozzle connecting points, may fill them in a bit with a epoxy type aluminum stuff...like texaskirby did and then file it down to take up the slack from all the years of wear.

 

[abcvacplacentia]

How about we make a cast aluminum Mini-Emptor?

Hey Vacuumdevil and Rivstg1,

I'm about to make the leap into D50 ownership and would like to go to a Hepa bag conversion. However, doesn't the mini-emptor look the best? After all, if you're going to convert to disposable bags, then do you really need the emptor bucket? It seems cumbersome and redundant to me, unless there is some practical advantage to it over the mini-emptor.

I like the compact size of the mini-emptor, but the black plastic ruins the vintage look of the D50. Why hasn't someone made a mini-emptor out of cast aluminum? That way it could be polished and would look absolutely factory. It's such a small part that the cost of sand casting shouldn't be too expensive.

What do you guys think? I like this idea as much as my Kirby skateboard wheel concept.

 

[bnsd60m9200]

abc

its about ascetics. mini emtors look hideous on older machines, which is alot alot of collectors retrofit them like this. they're nothing wrong with making some modifications to older machines to adapt newer materials, better bearings etc. but if you want to modifiy it so much, why not just get a new era machine like a heritage II and save the trouble?? seems like alot of trouble when theyres stuff out there that can do what you want without having to modify the crap out of it. thats just my 2 cents tho.

 

[abcvacplacentia]

Do you think the mini-emptor looks hideous because it's plastic? That's why I suggested casting one out of aluminum because it would look factory. I suppose someone could come up with a way to retrofit a bag system onto the original D50 emptor setup, but wouldn't that be redundant?

After all, why have the emptor tray and box if it's not being used for that purpose? Wouldn't a cast aluminum mini-emptor be the most streamlined method of incorporating Hepa bags? I'm pretty clueless about Kirby mods, so that's why I asked.

 

[rivstg1]

I can see a case for both views, but I guess with modern technology a.k.a. 3-D printing we could probably have one made and then cast in aluminum but, will there be enough people interested in that? In the meantime, the method I demonstrated on my previous thread of “ making ideas 50 a bit more modern’, it works beautifully ....as long as its not your everyday vacuum b/c it’s not a breeze to change the bag.
Kelton

 

[bnsd60m9200]

abc

no not the material, the shape. it makes the machine look off balance proportionally. aesthetically it looks lop side on the older machines and it bothers me visually. casting aluminum would also be extremely expensive, thats why no one would do it. the tradition and heritage had a sani emtor door with bag setups. kirby did it as a factory setup until the heritage II when the mini emtor came out.

 

[lesinutah]

Hey

Texaskirbyguy guy 2 things.
The pics are of 519 rear because it was right here and 560 nozzle which sits same as d80 since I've not put safety switch on.
The big wheels in the front when using screws to hold on big wheels flexes near the toe touch causing issues with rug. With tradition front axle you don't need the long screw big wheels fit. On tradition axle the toe touch doesn't flex down. The places it flexes is left of toe touch I didn't notice until I seen Ben's pic. The big wheels wider axle basically gives vacuum complete balance and it's going to perform better as vacuum body is not raised in the back. If you put big in the back not in front you get a muscle car look like rear is higher and front when nozzle hits carpet it's at a slight angle.
The setup I show nozzle is level no lean forward the brush plate hits carpet everywhere and in no other scenario except small wheels all around does nozzle hit ground being level. The wide tires set up gives the front heavy vacuum balance and stability providing best performance out of any set up.
Second I read your tradition thread again. I noticed something I didn't before you waxed before you sanded or buffed it out. You mentioned it brings out imperfections you can see. I always polished last. So thanks it will save time working on areas needing work not working everything because your not sure.



This is for make shift bags. Make a fabric liner that goes inside the bag. Glue it in desired position. Use Velcro to use fabric you intend to hold in place.
Or just get say 2 bags that one is liner the other is pulled out and emptied.
In the worse case Velcro attach bag cut open the top empty glue back shit or Velcro shut.
I'm no arts and crafts but my vacuum I plan on using and bag inside a bag why can't you just wash the bag. I don't know throwing ideas out there. It's why I came up with my system. I did acquire about 50 envirocare sentria 2 HEPA bags. That might be why.
If I were to use a bag the paper micron magic is what I would use if I bought bags. But seeing it's a show vacuum I get it. It's useable and doesn't make a mess simple and easy.
But the tires wider wheels more rubber on the road. Better axle no flexing. Big in back makes front lean forward and you want balance and stability and I think Ben's set up is the best.
Thanks
Les

 

[lesinutah]

Hey

Look at pics I posted it's balanced. Function and aesthetically pleasing. I will have my all blue 519 done d80 and hopefully heritage 2 43 inch nozzle. The wider forks balanced wheels it will look very astetically pleasing that I believe I can't guarantee but more appealing perhaps.
Les

 

[abcvacplacentia]

bnsd

You really think so? Here's a YouTube link to a D80 with the plastic mini-emptor. To me, it looks more streamlined and less bulky than having the emptor hanging off the side like a boxy appendage. The Legend II uses the mini-emptor and that's an even bigger vac. Does that look off balance?

Obviously, aesthetics comes down to personal preference, but I'm trying to think how Kirby would have engineered it back then if they had decent bag technology. With the Legend II, they opted for the simple mini-emptor without the larger sani-emptor bucket and tray. Wouldn't Kirby's engineers have come to the same conclusion if they were working out that problem on the D50?

As for sand casting, it's really not that expensive, even in the U.S. If we go to China, it would be even cheaper. Here's a link for sand casting estimation:

https://www.custompartnet.com/estimate/sand-casting/

If someone has a mini-emptor and can enter some basic dimensions, we can get an idea on cost. A plastic mini-emptor costs around $40 to $50, so a polished aluminum one should cost more. Maybe $120? The tooling cost could easily be amortized over 100 or so of these.